Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (Full Version)

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Awareness -> Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 12:25:31 PM)

https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html?platform=hootsuite

I'll summarise the above link for you, because I know Leftists suffer terribly from confirmation bias and rarely venture outside their own echo chamber. An associate professor of economics and political science decided that gender was a critical role in the Trump/Clinton debates and set out to stage a reverse-gendered version of some sections of them as a performance piece - presumably so everyone could confirm that misogyny and sexism were the reasons Trump won.

Oh dear.

So the audience were mostly academics, so it was pretty much a totally Leftist crowd. The performances were followed by a discussion and each audience member had a pre and post-performance survey to fill out.

The female Trump was played by actress Brenda King, while Jonathon Gordon played the male Clinton.

Here's some select quotes from the article:

quote:

Many were shocked to find that they couldn’t seem to find in Jonathan Gordon what they had admired in Hillary Clinton—or that Brenda King’s clever tactics seemed to shine in moments where they’d remembered Donald Trump flailing or lashing out. For those Clinton voters trying to make sense of the loss, it was by turns bewildering and instructive, raising as many questions about gender performance and effects of sexism as it answered."


quote:

"We both thought that the inversion would confirm our liberal assumption—that no one would have accepted Trump’s behavior from a woman, and that the male Clinton would seem like the much stronger candidate. But we kept checking in with each other and realized that this disruption—a major change in perception—was happening. I had an unsettled feeling the whole way through."


quote:

"Based on the conversations after the performances, it sounded like audience members had their beliefs rattled in a similar way. What were some themes that emerged from their responses?

We heard a lot of “now I understand how this happened”—meaning how Trump won the election. People got upset. There was a guy two rows in front of me who was literally holding his head in his hands, and the person with him was rubbing his back. The simplicity of Trump’s message became easier for people to hear when it was coming from a woman—that was a theme. One person said, “I’m just so struck by how precise Trump’s technique is.” Another—a musical theater composer, actually—said that Trump created “hummable lyrics,” while Clinton talked a lot, and everything she was was true and factual, but there was no “hook” to it. Another theme was about not liking either candidate—you know, “I wouldn’t vote for either one.” Someone said that Jonathan Gordon [the male Hillary Clinton] was “really punchable” because of all the smiling."


quote:

"I was particularly struck by the post-performance discussions about effeminacy. People felt that the male version of Clinton was feminine, and that that was bad. As a gay man who worked really hard, especially when I was younger, to erase femininity from my body—for better or worse—I found myself feeling really upset hearing those things. Daryl [the actor playing Jonathan Gordon, the male Clinton] and I have talked about this multiple times since the performances. Never once in rehearsal did we say, “play this more feminine.” So I think it was mostly the smiling piece—so many women have told me that they’re taught to smile through things that are uncomfortable. It’s been really powerful to hear women talk about that, and a learning experience for me. I was surprised by how critical I was seeing [Clinton] on a man’s body, and also by the fact that I didn’t find Trump’s behavior on a woman to be off-putting. I remember turning to Maria at one point in the rehearsals and saying, "I kind of want to have a beer with her!"


Part of the problem with the current divide between Right and Left wing politics is the echo chamber effect combined with a complete lack of intellectual honesty. When an experiment like this plays to a favourable crowd yet completely undermines their expectations, it demonstrates the fact that people have far more unconscious biases than they realise or are prepared to admit.

Basically, Clinton supporters, you gave her a pass because she's a woman and you're sexist. Keep that in mind next time you try and explain away Trump's victory as a product of sexism and misogyny.

Technically, this also makes you hypocrites - but I think you've got enough to think about for a while. Have a nice day.

(Oh, don't think I've forgotten you Right wing fucktards either - you've got your own set of problems and hypocrisies).




Musicmystery -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 12:31:34 PM)

Do you own straw stock?




Awareness -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 12:33:50 PM)

I'll put you down for "I didn't understand the article".




stef -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 12:41:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Do you own straw stock?

At the very least, some folks here have definitely been buying in bulk lately.




Kirata -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 1:26:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html?platform=hootsuite

Fascinating. What an ingenious idea, and surprising outcome! Thanks for the link.

K.







Aylee -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 5:04:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html?platform=hootsuite



Is anyone surprised that people projected their dislike of Trump onto his performance, making it impossible for these people to listen to what he was actually saying? Is it any surprise that these people projected their belief that democrats are the good guys on Clinton, making it impossible for them to see the trainwreck she was and is?

Identity politics appears to be bad for the health. It prevents you from hearing and understanding what's said then leads to insanity.




JVoV -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 5:39:37 PM)

The rehearsal video was fun to watch. But it reaffirmed what I already knew. Hillary was a boring candidate that didn't offer clear solutions to the voters in the swing states. Her record wasn't great.

Still, she managed to win the popular vote, which means nothing unless you're trying to analyze the election results. But in order to do that properly, you have to identify the states that flipped to red from 2008, and look at their biggest concerns.

Until we can do that honestly, nothing else matters.




Kirata -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 6:24:09 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Identity politics appears to be bad for the health. It prevents you from hearing and understanding what's said then leads to insanity.

[image]http://www.weaselzippers.us/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Screen-Shot-2017-03-08-at-7.00.23-PM.png[/image]
https://twitter.com/womensmarch/status/839526756856000512

K.






Aylee -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/8/2017 7:02:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Identity politics appears to be bad for the health. It prevents you from hearing and understanding what's said then leads to insanity.

[image]http://www.weaselzippers.us/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Screen-Shot-2017-03-08-at-7.00.23-PM.png[/image]
https://twitter.com/womensmarch/status/839526756856000512

K.





I knew that there was a reason I loved you! Thanks for that!




BoscoX -> RE: Restaging the debate - turns out Leftists are sexists (3/9/2017 6:45:11 AM)

FR

Anyone have a link to the full video? I would like to see the whole thing.




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