China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 9:56:41 AM)

Despite campaign promises that he would out-fox China, Trump’s decision to withdraw from the Paris climate agreement has done just the opposite.

As America pulls out of the climate deal, China is poised to go in for the kill. According to this article from Vox, the U.S.’s absence from the climate deal will create a gap in trade opportunities and a green energy economy just waiting to be snapped up by China.

While Merkel’s recent speech foreshadowed a distancing of Europe from America, she later said "the cooperation of the European Union with China in this area will play a crucial role, especially in regards to new technologies,” clearly suggesting a strengthening alliance between Europe and China.

Furthermore, China is poised to take the lead in sustainable energy, an economy that Trump has basically put off limits for America.

In Trump terms- we won’t be winning against China.

It isn’t the first time Trump — who spent the campaign demonizing China — will have wound up giving Beijing a major chance to expand its standing on the world stage.

After Trump withdrew the US from the Trans-Pacific Partnership, China inserted itself into trade talks among other nations disappointed by America’s reversal. As Canada and Mexico have felt spurned by Trump during the runup to renegotiating NAFTA, China has emerged as a more reliable trading prospect.

This isn’t happening quietly behind the scenes: At China’s first appearance at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Chinese President Xi Jinping chided the West for its flirtation with protectionism, and painted a picture of his country as a paragon of free trade and an inviting place for foreign investment.

“While the US is breaking these ties, China — which has traditionally been more reserved in international affairs — is building them at breakneck pace,” Alex Wang, an environmental law professor at the University of California Los Angeles, told me. “As the US loses good will, China is building it.”

The reshuffling of the world order in the wake of Trump’s announcement could be seen almost immediately, with top Chinese and European leaders criticizing the US’s withdrawal side by side on Thursday.

Standing next to German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Chinese Premier Li Keqiang said that “fighting climate change is a global consensus” and pledged that China would remain committed to the Paris agreement.

In a statement to the press, Miguel Arias Cañete, the European Union commissioner on climate action and energy, made the point even more forcefully: "No one should be left behind, but the EU and China have decided to move forward. Our successful cooperation on issues like emissions trading and clean technologies are bearing fruit. Now is the time to further strengthen these ties to keep the wheels turning for ambitious global climate action.”

It won’t be the last time that Beijing and Brussels find themselves seeing eye to eye, or that the two sides look past the US and look to work on joint initiatives that don’t involve Washington. And Europe and China’s enhanced cooperation is quite likely to go beyond coordinating on climate change.

China has generally been eager to capitalize on Trump’s protectionist tendencies. In his World Economic Forum speech, Chinese President Xi warned against rising nationalism in the West and defended free trade. This is China lecturing the US and Europe about free trade. China’s economy has liberalized significantly in recent decades, but it’s a country that flagrantly disregards all kinds of global trade rules, from denying market access to foreign companies to subsidizing many of its key industries. But when you have the most powerful politician in the world calling for 45 percent tariffs against other countries, Xi doesn’t look so preposterous.

If there’s one realm where China is set to best the US in the wake of Paris, it’s in developing a sustainable economy. It’s already investing more than the US in clean energy — in 2016, it invested more than $88 billion to the US’s $59 billion — but the gulf between the US and China will grow as the US decides that renewable energy investment isn’t a priority. And it will grow fast.

America First is turning out to be anything but.

https://www.vox.com/world/2017/6/3/15729424/trump-paris-climate-china

Of course, there are all those Chinese trademarks the Trump family businesses got abruptly . . .





tamaka -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:03:35 AM)

That is the best news i've heard all day. Nothing would be better for the earth than for China to be economically incentified to go green and lead the world in green technologies. God knows that smog-ridden China is contributing more pollution into earth's atmosphere than anywhere else. Awesome news!




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:05:19 AM)

I like that part too.

I'd like it better if the US were on board. Clean skies matter here too.

So does economic opportunity.




heavyblinker -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:12:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka
That is the best news i've heard all day. Nothing would be better for the earth than for China to be economically incentified to go green and lead the world in green technologies. God knows that smog-ridden China is contributing more pollution into earth's atmosphere than anywhere else. Awesome news!


And a lot of the pollution is being produced by factories which are meeting the demand set by American consumers, who still contribute more CO2 per capita.




tamaka -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:14:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I like that part too.

I'd like it better if the US were on board. Clean skies matter here too.

So does economic opportunity.


The US will end up using green technologies. China never would have, most likely, especially not to the extent that they need to, unless they were incentified like this.




tamaka -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:16:30 AM)

Leaders can lead in mysterious ways.




MercTech -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:16:35 AM)

When one of the most polluting countries pays lip service to going "green"; pardon me for being skeptical. The international plan for renewable energy is less about stewardship of the planet than it is of consolidating power in the hands of unelected bureaucrats.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/16/chinas-booming-middle-class-drives-asias-toxic-e-waste-mountains

http://content.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1870162,00.html




tamaka -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:20:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

When one of the most polluting countries pays lip service to going "green"; pardon me for being skeptical. The international plan for renewable energy is less about stewardship of the planet than it is of consolidating power in the hands of unelected bureaucrats.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/16/chinas-booming-middle-class-drives-asias-toxic-e-waste-mountains

http://content.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1870162,00.html



Exactly... that's why this is great. They will do it for the money.




WhoreMods -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:26:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

When one of the most polluting countries pays lip service to going "green"; pardon me for being skeptical. The international plan for renewable energy is less about stewardship of the planet than it is of consolidating power in the hands of unelected bureaucrats.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/16/chinas-booming-middle-class-drives-asias-toxic-e-waste-mountains

http://content.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1870162,00.html


Coming from somebody who lives in the other most polluting country, that's pretty cute.




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:49:20 AM)

In the past two years, China has moved far beyond lip service.




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/5/2017 10:50:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I like that part too.

I'd like it better if the US were on board. Clean skies matter here too.

So does economic opportunity.


The US will end up using green technologies. China never would have, most likely, especially not to the extent that they need to, unless they were incentified like this.


No, China has a rapidly growing problem that they started addressing in a seriously green way a couple years ago.




Greta75 -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (6/6/2017 6:30:32 PM)

China smog is getting serious toxic level so they are gonna wanna fix it before all Chinese citizens turn into freakshows and mutants.

I like the idea of letting China lead on green technologies. They got their own excessive polluted ground to experiment on and see the results.




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 8:11:53 AM)

True, globally China forging ahead is a win/win.




mnottertail -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 8:38:13 AM)

well, a mixed blessing, just another few generations of burgeoning industry they own.




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 9:27:27 AM)

Yes, true.




WhoreMods -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 9:29:39 AM)

If the trumptooners could read anything longer than a tweet I'd suggest they get hold of John Hersey's White Lotus and study it carefully to get a clue about how the end of this century will play out if they carry on fawning and grovelling to the Chinese the way that they are.




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 12:04:01 PM)

Well . . .




Musicmystery -> RE: China "wins" as Trump plays himself (or sells us out) (7/26/2017 2:16:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

When one of the most polluting countries pays lip service to going "green"; pardon me for being skeptical. The international plan for renewable energy is less about stewardship of the planet than it is of consolidating power in the hands of unelected bureaucrats.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/16/chinas-booming-middle-class-drives-asias-toxic-e-waste-mountains

http://content.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1870162,00.html


Coming from somebody who lives in the other most polluting country, that's pretty cute.

At the same time, it's only going to happen if it's financially viable.




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