The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (Full Version)

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MrRodgers -> The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/6/2017 4:01:24 PM)

Fox News host Sean Hannity will receive the William F. Buckley Jr. Award for Media Excellence later this year at a gala dinner in Washington, D.C. Not much of an award but something...much less of a recipient and what does that tell us ?

On the subject of cycles, Warren Buffett likes to talk about “the natural progression, the three I’s.” As he put it in 2008, those I’s are “the innovators, the imitators and the idiots.” One creates, one enhances and one screws it all up. Then, presumably, the cycle starts afresh.

So Buckley's conservatism had its innovators, its imitators and now we...have its idiots.

But sometimes symbolism is more potent than fact. If we have reached the point where rank-and-file conservatives see nothing amiss with giving Hannity an award named for Buckley, then surely there’s a Milton Friedman Prize awaiting Steve Bannon for his insights on free trade. And maybe Sean Spicer can receive the Vaclav Havel International Prize for Creative Dissent for his role in exposing “fake news.”

The floor’s the limit. (or, in Hannity’s case, the crawl space beneath it)

But I've followed Buckley and while I liked him, his writing and many of his ideas, I still come back to this feeling:

For all of Buckley's obfuscatory prose and strange upper-crust mannerisms, his ideas were no more refined than the thugs who shill for his party today. He was exposed as a man of thin ideas and thinner skin countless times, just look up his debates with Gore Vidal and Noam Chomsky for a start. If you poked holes in his ridiculous premises he would do one of two things, mug for the camera or make physical threats, as he did with Vidal.

He was a man with loftier pretensions but with a sharper a mind than Hannity. However, shallow minds like far too many of today's commentators were fooled by him for years, (Buckley jumped in bed with the corporate, rent-seeking crowd) unable to distinguish substantial arguments from fatuous ones even though I still gave him a few.

What conservatives now lament in the passing of Buckley and the coming of Trump, (Hannity ?) although hardly a straight line, is not a coarsening of conservative discourse, but the revealing of its true and consistent nature.





Termyn8or -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/6/2017 4:39:20 PM)

As most, you miss the meaning of conservatism. Believe me, republicans have nothing to do with it. They will drain our pockets all day long to enrich their friends. This has been known for a long time. What to call them ? I am really not sure, maybe neo-conmen ? It is like the cold war. It was sold to you because there was some "red menace" when there never was. The result was that two countries on this planet got their Citizens to support a military buildup that made them the supreme superpowers on the planet. It would take China a decade to catch up to the Russians, let alone us.

Nobody even knows what the word means these days. True conservatism means to conserve what we have. What took us thousands of years to build. And now the progressives want to dismantle it for their "better way".

But the fact remains that true conservatives are very rare. We know that we had to discard those racist views and respect others. We know that we had to change. Roll with the changes, well OK, but only certain changes. This is how Trump got elected and you should take a good lesson from that. There is only so much change that is acceptable. If you are a boy you go to the boysroom, that is that.

And stop supporting these pieces of shit with our hard earned dollars. That, and the wars we start are the reasons I became a non-taxpayer. I REFUSE. Want to come and lock me up come on, my paper trail was eliminated a decade ago. I simply refuse to help them send missiles to Israel and Saudi Arabia.

And a half a trillion dollar offense budget is not conservative. Let these oil companies and other shit just hire mercenaries and bring our boys home to actually defend out country for a change.

That is what I call conservative. Not supporting their friends building those F-35s that we are going to have to give away because nobody will actually buy them. Sure, Canada will take a few, so will other countries, but the ones who want real defense are buying MIGs. But those F-35 boat anchors were built on no bid contracts by people who have the in with the government and can reach into our pockets.

And they are a piece of shit. You might as well put a license plate on the back o them that says "My other plane is in the shop". Problem with that idea is YOUR plane will be the one in the shop.

Republicans have always supported the military, at least when it comes to building things. They would completely cut off the VA and all benefits for soldiers who risked their lives to make them money, because they are the type of people who just don't care. And democrats do the same damn thing partly because they see no choice. But them idiots want to let our enemies into the country.

Neither party is worth a shit. They want to tear down what it took us millenia to build. There is just a slight difference about how they think it should be rebuilt.

T^T




MrRodgers -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 11:58:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

As most, you miss the meaning of conservatism. Believe me, republicans have nothing to do with it. They will drain our pockets all day long to enrich their friends. This has been known for a long time. What to call them ? I am really not sure, maybe neo-conmen ? It is like the cold war. It was sold to you because there was some "red menace" when there never was. The result was that two countries on this planet got their Citizens to support a military buildup that made them the supreme superpowers on the planet. It would take China a decade to catch up to the Russians, let alone us.

Nobody even knows what the word means these days. True conservatism means to conserve what we have. What took us thousands of years to build. And now the progressives want to dismantle it for their "better way".

But the fact remains that true conservatives are very rare. We know that we had to discard those racist views and respect others. We know that we had to change. Roll with the changes, well OK, but only certain changes. This is how Trump got elected and you should take a good lesson from that. There is only so much change that is acceptable. If you are a boy you go to the boysroom, that is that.

And stop supporting these pieces of shit with our hard earned dollars. That, and the wars we start are the reasons I became a non-taxpayer. I REFUSE. Want to come and lock me up come on, my paper trail was eliminated a decade ago. I simply refuse to help them send missiles to Israel and Saudi Arabia.

And a half a trillion dollar offense budget is not conservative. Let these oil companies and other shit just hire mercenaries and bring our boys home to actually defend out country for a change.

That is what I call conservative. Not supporting their friends building those F-35s that we are going to have to give away because nobody will actually buy them. Sure, Canada will take a few, so will other countries, but the ones who want real defense are buying MIGs. But those F-35 boat anchors were built on no bid contracts by people who have the in with the government and can reach into our pockets.

And they are a piece of shit. You might as well put a license plate on the back o them that says "My other plane is in the shop". Problem with that idea is YOUR plane will be the one in the shop.

Republicans have always supported the military, at least when it comes to building things. They would completely cut off the VA and all benefits for soldiers who risked their lives to make them money, because they are the type of people who just don't care. And democrats do the same damn thing partly because they see no choice. But them idiots want to let our enemies into the country.

Neither party is worth a shit. They want to tear down what it took us millenia to build. There is just a slight difference about how they think it should be rebuilt.

T^T

Well yes to all of the spending and power-mongering but the US is a center-right country in that we say we form govt. as an evil necessity and only to protect or inalienable rights. so this core creed and the idea that govt. is to be small, out of our lives and not engage in foreign entanglements.

Highly regulated the corp. even removing its charter for malfeasance or crimes but also removing monopolies, taxing extraordinary income from them. We formed a country that verily hated the corp. and yet the courts have released from its bounds by finding [it] rights in the constitution.

We don't see eye to eye on dems and repubs but still, the conservative movement up to the 60's or 70's...,is on life-support.




Hillwilliam -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:08:08 PM)

“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” — H. L. Mencken




Musicmystery -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:30:00 PM)

Well, in 2008 . . .

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2008/05/26/the-fall-of-conservatism




PeonForHer -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:34:02 PM)

quote:

“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” — H. L. Mencken


... And the kakistocracy will have arrived.




Edwird -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:41:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
As most, you miss the meaning of conservatism.


The Last American Conservative

The last guy we had in high office who had any clue what real conservatism is about.

Policies which increase economic and political and social divide are in opposition to conservatism.





WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:45:06 PM)

It does not work and they have a proven track record in abject failure - where you from anyway? The wee grudge bearing bastards lack the mental faculties to understand this




WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 12:47:54 PM)

Why do you care for them anyway?

I would burn you lot first and its nothing personal with you




Edwird -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:12:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Well, in 2008 . . .
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2008/05/26/the-fall-of-conservatism


From within the article: "the moral heedlessness of the young"

That's a keeper. Unless Peon steals it from me.

There was some stage actor in a show I did sound for who did his mic check by saying "We are all vessels of sin!"




BoscoX -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:22:00 PM)



Obama lost you morons 1000 seats... And you are so stupid you spew about the fall of conservatism... [:D]




PeonForHer -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:23:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedsDesire

Why do you care for them anyway?

I would burn you lot first and its nothing personal with you



They invented the theme tune to 'The Big Country'.




Edwird -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:36:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Obama lost you morons 1000 seats


You're claiming that Obama lost track of that much furniture? I don't think so.

I think you are confusing this with Republican's proclivity of throwing chairs aside, then lying down face-up and saying to their corporate masters; "Have a seat!" being the fart fetishers they are.






WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:37:42 PM)

Matter of time before I abscond to my cave with my cats
The right in our country (is it nation?) does not work, has never worked, will never work. They have a track record in failure and yet here we all are again 60-65% of the time




Real0ne -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 1:37:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” — H. L. Mencken



you think we live in a democracy? Seriously?




MrRodgers -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 2:07:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” — H. L. Mencken

But our 'democracy' is not a pure plebiscite. So [their] dream did come through...twice in a row.




WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 2:17:00 PM)

What do you Americans know of democracy

The Wombles - Remember You`re a Womble




WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 2:21:49 PM)

On a more philosophical note it doesnt work now does it 6packmalarkey and you wonder why I doom you all




MrRodgers -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 3:18:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX



Obama lost you morons 1000 seats... And you are so stupid you spew about the fall of conservatism... [:D]

What you do not understand is that the conservative movement had no part in what we see. It was purely media promotion, gerrymandering and propaganda from the repub. right of today and say...the last 30-40 years.

The conservative movement of the 50's and 60's had nothing to do with that but the new right and its development, scored them a W and now a Trump that will have two electoral victories for 12 years of policies that have and are going to be...anything but conservative just because you say it's so.




WickedsDesire -> RE: The Fall of conservatism ? Part of it here. (7/7/2017 3:29:20 PM)

howls in its mums basement fret not




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