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Canada insists US "right to work" goes; Mexi... - 9/5/2017 4:39:02 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		When you say "We're going to re-negotiate," you open the door to everything.

Canadian negotiators are demanding the United States roll back so-called "right to work" laws – accused of gutting unions in some U.S. states by starving them of money – as part of the renegotiation of the North American free-trade agreement. The request is part of a push by Ottawa to get the U.S. and Mexico to adopt higher labour standards under the deal.

Mexico, meanwhile, is campaigning to include its oil and gas sector in the deal.

These major moves on the labour and energy files came over the weekend at the second round of NAFTA renegotiations in Mexico City.

One group of negotiators spent all day Sunday working on the labour file, according to a schedule of the talks obtained by The Globe and Mail. One source familiar with the discussions said Canada wants the United States to pass a federal law stopping state governments from enacting right-to-work legislation; the source said the United States has not agreed to such a request. Canada believes that lower labour standards in the United States and Mexico, including right to work, give those countries an unfair advantage in attracting jobs.

Jerry Dias, the leader of Canada's largest private-sector trade union, said Ottawa's negotiators are: pushing Mexico on its corporate-sanctioned unions, which are accused of negotiating collective agreements unfavourable to workers; agitating for both countries to offer a year of paid family leave, as Canada does; and targeting American right-to-work laws that allow workers in unionized shops to refuse to pay dues, draining money from unions.

"I'm very pleased with the position the Canadian government is taking on labour standards," Mr. Dias, president of Unifor, told reporters outside the talks. "Canada's got two problems: The low wage rates in Mexico and the right-to-work states in the United States."

Mr. Dias, whose union represents a broad swath of occupations from auto makers to paperworkers, met on Sunday with Canada's chief NAFTA negotiator, Steve Verheul, and members of the team working on labour matters. He argued lax labour standards in the other two NAFTA countries are bleeding jobs out of Canada.

https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/canada-demands-us-end-right-to-work-laws-as-part-of-nafta-talks/article36160015/?ref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theglobeandmail.com
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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 4:52:04 AM   
Tkman117


Posts: 1353
Joined: 5/21/2012
Status: offline 		Weird to think my country is trying to do more for the American people than their own president is. But then again, people are people and they deserve the same basic rights regardless of whatever politics are in play at the time.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:21:27 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		More to the point, they don't want to have to compete against businesses who get to employ lower labor standards.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:33:34 AM   
Made2Obey


Posts: 357
Joined: 8/21/2008
Status: offline 		I'm with the Canadians on this one.
Right to work laws were never about improving the employment market. They were always a thinly disguised attempt to de-fund the Democratic Party by reducing unions' ability to contribute. That seems basically Un-American to me.
Also, no one forces anyone to take a job in a union shop. If someone chooses to work in a unionized employer because it pays more and/or has better benefits, then they should have to compensate the team that negotiated higher compensation.
It's rather like an actor whose agent negotiates a high salary on some project for that actor, and then the actor turning about and telling the agent he/she doesn't feel like paying the agent for their work.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:39:04 AM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		I was a union member for 34 years. CWA working for AT&T. It always seemed un American to me forcing me to pay union dues to support democrats that I would never vote for.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:43:56 AM   
BoscoX


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I was a union member for 34 years. CWA working for AT&T. It always seemed un American to me forcing me to pay union dues to support democrats that I would never vote for.


Part of what is killing the unions. Not everyone hates America, loves communism, and wants to support the Democrats who do.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:44:41 AM   
Made2Obey


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Status: offline 		I understand that point, but unions are majority rule and if you choose to belong to one you have to go along with that. You did get a vote on the leadership after all, and if you truly felt you could not support the majority decision, you always had the option of changing jobs.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:49:42 AM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		I liked my job and was very good at it (cable splicer). You shouldn't have to quit your job to avoid majority rule.

(in reply to Made2Obey)
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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:53:05 AM   
BoscoX


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I liked my job and was very good at it (cable splicer). You shouldn't have to quit your job to avoid majority rule.


If you don't want to support the Democrat party you should have the right to work without doing so.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 5:56:45 AM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		For 34 years I didn't have that right. Join the union or quit your job. That is what is wrong.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 6:26:29 AM   
Made2Obey


Posts: 357
Joined: 8/21/2008
Status: offline 		The Constitution doesn't spell out any right to work. But anyone has the ability to leave their job if they disagree with policies there. I've left jobs for that reason more than once. Always made as much or more on the next job, so it's not even a hardship.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 6:30:43 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I was a union member for 34 years. CWA working for AT&T. It always seemed un American to me forcing me to pay union dues to support democrats that I would never vote for.

That's not how it works. Political activities are separated out, and the member has to opt in to the political contributions.

(in reply to servantforuse)
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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 6:54:16 AM   
MAINEiacMISTRESS


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Made2Obey

I understand that point, but unions are majority rule and if you choose to belong to one you have to go along with that. You did get a vote on the leadership after all, and if you truly felt you could not support the majority decision, you always had the option of changing jobs.

When I was in college a local paper mill union decided (for the "betterment" of their members lives) to strike. It lasted for many months. The mill hired "SCAB" workers. There was spray painting and other vandalism of these people's homes and any local businesses who supported them. Many of the original workers couldn't find other jobs and lost their homes, had to uproot their kids from schools and friends, and move away. I have to say I'm not a big fan. Yes, if worker safety is an issue unions can be helpful, but for things like pay increases, striking is not worth an entire community's downfall like I witnessed. They need to have better negotiators at the wheel.

(in reply to Made2Obey)
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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 7:08:12 AM   
BoscoX


Posts: 11239
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I was a union member for 34 years. CWA working for AT&T. It always seemed un American to me forcing me to pay union dues to support democrats that I would never vote for.

That's not how it works. Political activities are separated out, and the member has to opt in to the political contributions.


Are you really that stupid, or are you just totally incapable of basic honesty

Here's an example of union sleaze illegally colluding with Democrat sleaze to fuck dissenters who attended a Republican convention:

DNC Email Leak Shows Cozy Relationship between Democrats and Unions

In the words of late NFL football coach Dennis Green, “they are who we thought they were.”

The Democratic Party and labor unions are consistently accused of having a quid pro quo relationship, and for good reason. Emails from the DNC email leak confirms this and reinforces research that shows that major labor unions contribute nearly exclusively to liberal causes. From 2012-2014 labor unions contributed $418,660,619 to progressive organizations and 99 percent of union political funds go to left-wing causes.

What do labor unions get? Just check out the Democratic Party platform. It is a set of misguided policies that benefit unions over workers and the economy.

For one example, the Democratic Party platform advocates for a $15 minimum wage, which labor unions also support.

No one is against workers making more money, but government-mandated wages do more harm than good. Recent research from the Heritage Foundation finds that an increase to a $15 minimum would eliminate 7 million jobs. Rather than government interfering in the free-market, a better solution is to remove burdensome regulation that allows business to innovate and increase productivity that would raise wages organically.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, union members earn far more than the current minimum wage (over 95 percent of all workers make over the current minimum wage). So why are unions so concerned about raising the minimum wage and pouring millions into the “Fight for 15” efforts around the country?

Simple: self-interest. As I’ve explained in a previous post, one, many union contracts tie union member wages to increases in the minimum wage. Two, many state and local minimum wage laws exempt unions from minimum wage requirements, which makes union labor more competitive with non-union workers.

As the recently leaked DNC emails show, Democrats get more than just money from labor unions in exchange for pushing union-friendly policies.

One email laying out the DNC’s “Counter Convention Sketch” shows the close ties between unions and Democrats. The email shows that the Democrats planned on using the SEIU’s “office space in downtown Cleveland close to convention that can be the base of operations and host the wrapped mobile RV.”

Something that should be investigated further, did the SEIU report this political activity, which it is required to do as part of Department of Labor regulations?

Another email further shows the cozy relationship between the DNC and unions. One “idea” posed by the DNC is to “Meet with the hotel trades, SEIU, and Fight for 15 about staging a strike.”

DNC “Off-site activities” included a “Fast food worker strike around the city or just at franchises around convention.” And “Infiltrate friendly union hotels and properties around the convention that Republicans will be patronizing to distribute ‘care’ packages”

More

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 7:33:23 AM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

For 34 years I didn't have that right. Join the union or quit your job. That is what is wrong.

If you were really principled about the stand you are taking, you would refuse all union negotiated benefits too. But I never hear those who complain about compulsory union membership refusing to accept the benefits that union representation brings to a workplace.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 8:06:03 AM   
Made2Obey


Posts: 357
Joined: 8/21/2008
Status: offline 		It's not news that unions and the Democratic party work in unison, they have for over a century.
It's also not news that some unions have corruption among the leadership, just as politics and business often do. None are 100% innocent, and none are 100% corrupt.
But I do feel strongly that overall America has benefited from strong unions.
Modern working conditions are almost entirely a union benefit, and it trickled down to non-union employers as well.
The United Fund probably would not exist without unions.
And for every example of a corrupt union that can be found, you can find an equal number of corrupt business owners who compromised safety in the name of profit and killed employees by doing so.
It's not a one-sided issue, you have to look at the big picture.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 8:59:13 AM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		I always supported da union. Just didn't like it. As far as principles, supporting my family trumped that.

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 8:59:22 AM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline 		Wasn't it the unions that kept telling everyone that their jobs were being taken away by China and Mexico?
That was sort of what gave us Trump, wasn't it?

Also, I find it hard to accept that people will blame the unions but not the SCABS or the employers.
Anyone want to take a guess why there's such a massive wealth gap?

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 9:40:15 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Made2Obey

I understand that point, but unions are majority rule and if you choose to belong to one you have to go along with that. You did get a vote on the leadership after all, and if you truly felt you could not support the majority decision, you always had the option of changing jobs.
Hard to change jobs if there is no "right-to-work" rule, isn't it?

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RE: Canada insists US "right to work" goes; ... - 9/5/2017 10:06:54 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


Posts: 5490
Status: offline
quote:

DNC Email Leak Shows Cozy Relationship between Democrats and Unions

And yet you are just peachy keen about the cozy relationship between the corporations and the GOP, eh?
Which side are you on?

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