RE: Are cakes art?

RE: Are cakes art? (Full Version)

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[Poll]

Are cakes art?

No: thinking that they are is really gay

35% (10)

No: of course they're not

3% (1)

Don't know

0% (0)

Don't care

17% (5)

Maybe if they're really good cakes

7% (2)

Yes: anybody who can charge for a made to order cake is an artisan

28% (8)

Yes: if Haring and Koon's smug whiffle is art, so's a fancy cake

7% (2)

Total Votes : 28

(last vote on : 9/27/2017 6:35:01 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

Message

PeonForHer -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 3:28:53 AM)
So we're agreed, then. Everybody's who's religious should be suffering a lot more. A new thread title, perhaps!

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 3:34:34 AM)
I'm anti-all religion. If we all agree to disrespect ALL religious beliefs and disallow them to impose their religious beliefs in their business, then let's make sure it's applied EQUALLY! I want Muslims bake me a yam cake with pork floss. My objection to this fine on this Christian is because I know a Muslim baker would never be treated the same way. He would be given a hall pass. I just want a standard blanket rule. Not subjective rules. This means, a jew cannot refuse to bake a Hail Hitler cake. Make sure they fine that jew $135k too for refusing. But I know the Jew is not gonna get in trouble for refusing that cake! That's the problem. Not a uniform punishment to all businesses who discriminates. As usual because the most pacifist religion is Christianity. They get bullied the most. Even I as a Atheist can see it. And I don't like the Militant Atheists that exist in the US.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 4:40:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 I'm anti-all religion. Reely? So you have no moral compass, no conscience, no beliefs, everything is in your life is an absolute incontrovertible fact so you have no faith what so ever and you are an unthinking battery operated bot? Right? Do you have any idea what you just said?

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 4:47:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 I'm anti-all religion. Reely? So you have no moral compass, no conscience, no beliefs, everything is in your life is an absolute incontrovertible fact so you have no faith what so ever and you are an unthinking battery operated bot? Right? Do you have any idea what you just said? Yes, I realise what I have said. Christian God murdered thousands in Noak Ark. And killed innocent first borns. Why the hell would I be supportive of that murderer? Almost every religion got a nasty God and infact it is baffling why religion is even considered good considering the role models. Buddhism is barely a religion. It's just some prince who chose to live his life as a pauper and people admired that. Buddha never claim to be God or expect anybody to build a religion around him. It's crazy that you think people need a religion for a moral compass. What are morals except a set of rules made up by human beings? It used to be immoral to have sex before marriage ya know. Some crazy religions even think it's immoral to enjoy sex as it's solely for pro-creation only. Why is faith needed in life at all to function?

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 4:52:04 AM)
oh so you are a secular humanist then? YOu have a bundle of morals with no God? so everything in your life is a indisputable fact, nothing is unproven? What do you think religion is is Buddhism iyo is barely a religion? it still is immoral to have sex before marriage in several religions, just because people do it anyway doesnt change the status, or are you saying some religion went from condemning to condoning it? Since you made such a specifically clear statement "All Religions" What does religion mean to you? What is religion? Do you understand how my response relates and applies to your questions?

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 5:39:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne oh so you are a secular humanist then? YOu have a bundle of morals with no God? so everything in your life is a indisputable fact, nothing is unproven? What do you think religion is is Buddhism iyo is barely a religion? it still is immoral to have sex before marriage in several religions, just because people do it anyway doesnt change the status, or are you saying some religion went from condemning to condoning it? Since you made such a specifically clear statement "All Religions" What does religion mean to you? What is religion? Do you understand how my response relates and applies to your questions? I don't consider myself a secular humanist. I relate more to Atheism. Believing that all Gods and Religions are Man-Made! The definition of a Religion to me is Fairytales made up by human beings. That's what religion is. The bible is a fairytale book. So is the Quran. Both fictional books. Unfortunately, people take the stories so seriously. It's like Gorean right? It's just a fiction book. Yet people take it so seriously. All these books are written by human beings, just like you and me, and the material in those books all came from their imagination. Buddhism only became a religion when people started worshipping Buddha like a God. But Buddha was just a man. Nobody special. He didn't think he was special either. People just believe he was a man who have reached immortality. And wrote about his life and try to convince people to worship him and follow his way of life. But Buddha never intended ANYBODY to follow him or write about him or follow his way of life. Buddhism becoming a religion certainly isn't Buddha's idea. Just man-made just like every other religion. They added the "God-like" element to it by claiming he has reached the status of immortality and exists in some ethereal pane for eternity. I am anti-All Religion, because, they are made up stories by a regular human being, but they are so good with marketing their stories, that they actually convinced a whole loads of people to believe to the point of fanaticism. That's why we now have ISIS.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 5:54:52 AM)
Ok so to be clear you think atheism means rejection of religion? I thought it meant rejection of a deity, how did religion get dragged into your definition of atheism? You are fully aware I presume that you do not need a deity to have a religion are you not? Maybe you meant 'God/Deity-derived' religions? so square that up for me so we can sing from the same song sheet here.

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:10:05 AM)
Atheism is the rejection that any supernatural being is real. I do think all religion believes in some supernatural crap of some sort. Unless you are gonna use Scientology. That is again some damn fiction book turn into some silly way of life, in disguise of a religion. But then again, it seems like, that's how all the major religions are like. It starts with some story from some book.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:17:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 Atheism is the rejection that any supernatural being is real. I do think all religion believes in some supernatural crap of some sort. Unless you are gonna use Scientology. That is again some damn fiction book turn into some silly way of life, in disguise of a religion. But then again, it seems like, that's how all the major religions are like. It starts with some story from some book. Ok so then your use of the word anti: "All-religions" et al is improper and you really meant to say 'All-Gods" or all God based, or all spiritual based religions, and then you went on to include all non-God based cultures with man made morals as silly shit disguised as religion correct? So all cultures and subjective reasoning should be abolished iyo

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:29:27 AM)
Being "anti-anything" means that I don't believe in it or support it. And also I don't care if all of them dies and there is no such thing as religion left on earth. But I believe in individualism. So if they wanna follow their fairytale books. I really don't care. I only care when shit happens like when they use the bullshit story from their story books about how pork is so dirty and evil that they start systematically removing pork from restaurants of people who are not of their religion. When their beliefs base on a fictional book starts trespassing into my real life. For example, catholics in Philippines ban divorce and abortion for the whole country base on their religious beliefs. THAT is where I think they are crossing the line and taking their imaginary book too far. The day where Goreans starts actually kidnapping real human women pretending to be aliens. They will be taking their imaginary book too far too. Religion to me is how the belief of one or some humans can be such a strong influence on dictating what a group of people will believe. It's basically essentially the art of how can one human being have power over thousands or millions of other human beings. Scientology was started by a man who closely studied how religion works on controlling people and basically, if you read his history, he combine all old religions on how they started, to do his marketing plan and it works.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:37:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 Being "anti-anything" means that I don't believe in it or support it. And also I don't care if all of them dies and there is no such thing as religion left on earth. But I believe in individualism. So if they wanna follow their fairytale books. I really don't care. I only care when shit happens like when they use the bullshit story from their story books about how pork is so dirty and evil that they start systematically removing pork from restaurants of people who are not of their religion. When their beliefs base on a fictional book starts trespassing into my real life. For example, catholics in Philippines ban divorce and abortion for the whole country base on their religious beliefs. THAT is where I think they are crossing the line and taking their imaginary book too far. The day where Goreans starts actually kidnapping real human women pretending to be aliens. They will be taking their imaginary book too far too. but you just wiped out individualism when you wiped out subjective reasoning as part of your anti religion policy. Then there is the other problem that you accepted the gubmints policy on discrimination, the gubmint culture, the gubmints moral base derived from commercialism. It seems to me when your philosophical constructs are tested in fire they all break down, or in other words you just shot yourself in the foot. The question is are you going to fix it by shooting yourself in the other foot?

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:48:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne but you just wiped out individualism when you wiped out subjective reasoning as part of your anti religion policy. Probably because I generally don't consider people who follow a religious belief as being individual thinkers. They have chosen a group of beliefs and chose to follow those beliefs. The fact that you question that I am a unthinking robot for not believing in any religion is precisely what the problem with religion is. Why do people need an organization, a fictional book, some deity to teach and guide them how to form their conclusions? quote: Then there is the other problem that you accepted the gubmints policy on discrimination, the gubmint culture, the gubmints moral base derived from commercialism. The difference is this. Government is fluid. If they are current day existing people. This means that if I don't like the current government policy. I simply do not put in my vote for that government. But I need to respect democracy that majority wins so I may not have my way, but there is a good chance that if a government is doing a terrible job, they could be voted out. Religion is not fluid. It's basically an imaginary being who you can't confront and ask questions directly to and hold them accountable for whatever "rules and regulations" they have set. I would love to confront Allah in person to justify his nonsense laws on pork and dogs. But I can't. Yet I managed to confront my actual Minister of Labour in person face to face on some policies I am not happy with. Please don't compare it to a ruling government. To function as a society, we do need universal rules and regulations to keep things running smoothly. It's like traffic lights. IF all go green at the same time, then all the cars will crash. But with religion, as it's written by some dead human being from gazillion years ago and the book is so sacred that cannot be amended. There is nothing you can do about it, people are choice-less. In a current government, like the US. Today it's the lefties ruling and implementing their plans. Tomorrow would be righties ruling and removing some plans and implementing their plans. It's always fluid, depending on who majority put on top to create the new rules and regulations. Whole different thing.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 6:50:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 Religion to me is how the belief of one or some humans can be such a strong influence on dictating what a group of people will believe. It's basically essentially the art of how can one human being have power over thousands or millions of other human beings. Scientology was started by a man who closely studied how religion works on controlling people and basically, if you read his history, he combine all old religions on how they started, to do his marketing plan and it works. well before the age of the microscope you watched many of your fellow friends and family die from pork, so you come to the 'belief' not fact that pork is bad and you tell all your friends and family not to eat pork because you have faith in your 'belief' that the pork will kill them. So your family does not eat pork and people all around them are dying from eating pork (trichina) so your belief now created a culture, your personal 'opinion' and subjective reasoning turned out to be right and people who believed you lived which attracted more people to believe you next thing you know people 'religiously' refrained from eating pork. Meanwhile some other culture that cooks everything well done never had the problem because the trichina was killed by cooking, hence the development of a different culture, both incidentally based upon religion. Being right tends to have a very strong influence on people I agree, and religion is just that, influence, there is no law forcing someone to believe pork kills, hence you have the freedom to choose and change your religion at a whim, you do not have the freedom to choose and change laws made by the state because you never got to vote on them in the first place, your overlords did. Of course it works, the gubmint uses it in its propaganda for mass social control in every area of your life. Remember if not religion then law.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 7:01:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: Then there is the other problem that you accepted the gubmints policy on discrimination, the gubmint culture, the gubmints moral base derived from commercialism. The difference is this. Government is fluid. If they are current day existing people. This means that if I don't like the current government policy. I simply do not put in my vote for that government. But I need to respect democracy that majority wins so I may not have my way, but there is a good chance that if a government is doing a terrible job, they could be voted out. Religion is not fluid. It's basically an imaginary being who you can't confront and ask questions directly to and hold them accountable for whatever "rules and regulations" they have set. I would love to confront Allah in person to justify his nonsense laws on pork and dogs. But I can't. Yet I managed to confront my actual Minister of Labour in person face to face on some policies I am not happy with. Please don't compare it to a ruling government. To function as a society, we do need universal rules and regulations to keep things running smoothly. It's like traffic lights. IF all go green at the same time, then all the cars will crash. But with religion, as it's written by some dead human being from gazillion years ago and the book is so sacred that cannot be amended. There is nothing you can do about it, people are choice-less. In a current government, like the US. Today it's the lefties ruling and implementing their plans. Tomorrow would be righties ruling and removing some plans and implementing their plans. It's always fluid, depending on who majority put on top to create the new rules and regulations. Whole different thing. You have a problem greta, you havent been able to make the distinction between a diety and religion and you also have not made the distinction between religion and gubmint. You can change your religion every 10 minutes if you want and your religion is not going to fine you 135,000 dollars because you decided to change religions, your gubmint will because once again you do not vote on your laws, you only vote in what amounts to attorneys to lord over you and make laws for you. You want to change gubmints and you better get ready to sell everything you own, pay taxes up the ass because you want to leave the country and ultimately lose everything you worked for. yes I will bring gubmint in because if you dont have religion you will have gubmint taking its place. Da gubmint has 62,000,000 (yes thats 'million') laws, recite them to me. Whats the last law that you used your daMobcracy to change? Hey I just decided to be an atheist, so right this second I am an atheist.........now I changed my mind, so right now this second I am a jehova witness, nah on second thought this second I am going to be a baptist. See what gubmint will let you do that with their overlord laws. Case in point if everyone listened to the 10 commandments and did not murder there would be no need for gubmint murder trials would there? This is not rocket science you know, people are choiceless when gubmint makes laws for you, religion you can change on whim, gubmints of today are kleptocratic oligarchies that operate as democratic dictatorships, that now control our planet by mass corruption .

BamaD -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:09:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV Gays have been subject to community standards all this time. But it's "bullying" if Christians are? Nope. If you cannot provide the same products & services to gays, then it is discrimination. If you are in a business where your religious beliefs prohibits you from complying with the law, then you need to find a more suitable business. So Arabs have to serve pork? Where the hell do you come up with such idiotic questions? How the fuck is that even similar? The Bible doesn't forbid baking cake. But many religions forbid eating pork. So, no. An Arab-owned restaurant wouldn't be forced to change their menu. But they'll be expected to serve the same quality of food to all customers. Just like the bakery menu hasn't been changed. But it is expected to be able to provide the entire menu to all customers. And since it refuses, we have a case. No but Christian (for the most part ) consider gay marriage to be wrong. The fact that the Bible doesn't list every possible part of that marriage. isn't a loop hole.

BamaD -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:15:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV And the State of Colorado added sexual orientation to their protected classes you can't discriminate against. Does a wedding cake count as food? Not as essential food.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:20:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV And the State of Colorado added sexual orientation to their protected classes you can't discriminate against. Does a wedding cake count as food? Not as essential food. fuck that not an essential anything, there is no law says you have to have a cake for a wedding ffs, its a damn decoration and artistic 'statement', a statement that is contrary to the beliefs of christians same as if a christian wanted a gay baker to bake a cake or make a sign that read 'gays are the scum and filth of the earth abomination' Every gay in town would be breaking down the doors to bake that cake for them, hell they would make 10 of them at no charge.

Greta75 -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:28:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne You can change your religion every 10 minutes if you want and your religion is not going to fine you 135,000 dollars because you decided to change religions, You know this is not true in Asia right? It's death penalty or jail term for Muslims to change their religion. I prefer my government I think to Religious organization. The founder of our government is an Atheist and he was always very insistent that religion that kept completely out of it. Can't say the same for poor countries like Philippines or Malaysia or Indonesia. Who's religion infiltrated the government policies. If the US government has any dangers, it's "Christian bias" like the potential of abortion being banned. And Christian slogans like "IN God We Trust". I am blaming religion for that. The separation of religious faith and governing is still not frown upon enough in the US especially when politicians are still using their Christianity to win votes. The core danger is religion and the power of influence they have on politicians. And the resentment towards Christianity has cause Islam a worst religion to rise in power.

Real0ne -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:31:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne You can change your religion every 10 minutes if you want and your religion is not going to fine you 135,000 dollars because you decided to change religions, You know this is not true in Asia right? It's death penalty or jail term for Muslims to change their religion. I prefer my government I think to Religious organization. yes another Borg theocracy, its their business, its between them, its their religion, has nothign to do with me, not in their jurisdiction, but I am glad you thought about my previous posts.

JVoV -> RE: Are cakes art? (9/26/2017 8:58:38 AM)
I think gays have suffered enough under Christian-based laws in the US. It all has to end.

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