quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
ds,.... the ultimate profit for that vehicle no matter where its built, goes to the parent companies bottom line, wherever that companies headquartered.

quote:

For example, Medtronic, a long time Minnesota company, in a strategic move, "inverted" & transferred its home offices to Ireland, where it now pays a third of the taxes it paid in the US.
Guess what? That means its profits, AND GDP is now also claimed by Ireland. and it STILL gets to keep the $40M in US federal contracts it has acquired. Not to mention allsorts of other perks of a US company,

quote:

Like the majority of the benefits of US citizenship. OH sure, Medtronic, hired more people, and those people pay taxes, buy things, etc.,. BUT.... that doesn't make up for the $3 BILLION in taxes EVERY YEAR that doesn't go into US coffers. and THAT $3B in taxes is what we all have to make up for.

quote:

NOW,.....let Me make this clear...... I am all for a TRUE MIDDLE CLASS TAX CUT. - families and individuals. and poor people.
NOT one thin dime of a tax cut to the wealthy, or the majority of big corporations, big business without strings attached,
to Me, the wealthy and big corporations don't need another bundle of money to not create jobs with. which job creation is one of the bullshit selling points for the tax cuts in the first place.
u like the wealthy so much? keep giving them ur wallet and see what u get back from them. keep giving the wealthy tax cuts with no strings attached and that's all ur doing.

quote:

So far the only thing they given u or anybody so far from tax cuts is more space between u and them for total net worth....how stupid is that???

quote:

IF the reason for giving a tax cut is for job creation, then its not too damn much to demand & make them ACTUALLY create jobs with it....
Now, u and I have had some good debates,...but, How does that NOT make sense to u??
to be simplistic.... If I ask u for money for a particular reason and u give it to Me, (TWICE!!) but I instead I go buy or do something else with it altogether, why should u keep giving Me more money OR....not demand I spend it for the reason I told u?

quote:

PS.....its nicknamed "VOODOO economics" for a darn good reason...

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Look we can all preach about how people get to keep more of their money and most will spend it. However, to do that via revenue reduction is to put that spending on our children and their children.

quote:

According to a 2012 study published in the Economist, rapid growth in private debt is a better predictor of recessions than increases in public debt, growth in money supply, or trade imbalances. Consumer credit in the US rose by 22 percent over the last three years, reaching a record-high $3.18 trillion in April, the Fed reported on Friday.
When Reagan took office, total credit card debt alone $500 billion. When Reagan left office it had tripled $1.5 trillion. As of this study in 2012 it has tripled again to $3 trillion.
So if anything, more money in the hands of consumers one would reason, would prompt a reduction in debt but that doesn't happen except in the extreme as did after TARP. Americans were paying down debt at $7 million/DAY. Now credit is back in stile.
Other studies have suggested that the American consumer is now tapped out. So until the American consumer can attain the jobs that would provide for such consumption...debt and more debt rulles the day.
HERE

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
ds,.... the ultimate profit for that vehicle no matter where its built, goes to the parent companies bottom line, wherever that companies headquartered.

Then Chrysler, Jeep, and Dodge are not American nameplates anymore. Try pulling that one out on a UAW member.

quote:

For example, Medtronic, a long time Minnesota company, in a strategic move, "inverted" & transferred its home offices to Ireland, where it now pays a third of the taxes it paid in the US.
Guess what? That means its profits, AND GDP is now also claimed by Ireland. and it STILL gets to keep the $40M in US federal contracts it has acquired. Not to mention allsorts of other perks of a US company,

$40M in US Federal contracts? So what? Are you going to attempt to make the claim that ONLY US-American companies, based in the US should be eligible for Federal contracts? Ready for the Federal Government to start paying a shit ton more for those contracts because you're eliminating competitors?

quote:

Like the majority of the benefits of US citizenship. OH sure, Medtronic, hired more people, and those people pay taxes, buy things, etc.,. BUT.... that doesn't make up for the $3 BILLION in taxes EVERY YEAR that doesn't go into US coffers. and THAT $3B in taxes is what we all have to make up for.

Maybe companies don't leave if the tax codes were fair or less uneven? Btw, Medtronic still pays taxes on all the business it does in the US, just like before.

quote:

NOW,.....let Me make this clear...... I am all for a TRUE MIDDLE CLASS TAX CUT. - families and individuals. and poor people.
NOT one thin dime of a tax cut to the wealthy, or the majority of big corporations, big business without strings attached,
to Me, the wealthy and big corporations don't need another bundle of money to not create jobs with. which job creation is one of the bullshit selling points for the tax cuts in the first place.
u like the wealthy so much? keep giving them ur wallet and see what u get back from them. keep giving the wealthy tax cuts with no strings attached and that's all ur doing.

First of all, how do you define the "Middle Class?" That will make any sort of math easier and less ambiguous.

I completely oppose "strings attached" unless it applies to everyone evenly. Reductions in taxes is a reduction in the amount of money government is taking away from you. That is, they are taking less of your money. Your money. Anyone should be free to choose where they spend their own money.

I would support a progressive tax bracket structure, though I much prefer a consumption tax (with a few tax-free categories). I absolutely support closing all loopholes (save for charitable giving and double taxation).

quote:

So far the only thing they given u or anybody so far from tax cuts is more space between u and them for total net worth....how stupid is that???

Why the fuck do you care how much more they have than you?!? Why not just give a fuck how much you have?

quote:

IF the reason for giving a tax cut is for job creation, then its not too damn much to demand & make them ACTUALLY create jobs with it....
Now, u and I have had some good debates,...but, How does that NOT make sense to u??
to be simplistic.... If I ask u for money for a particular reason and u give it to Me, (TWICE!!) but I instead I go buy or do something else with it altogether, why should u keep giving Me more money OR....not demand I spend it for the reason I told u?

Because they are not "giving" them money. That money starts off belonging to them, not the government. They should have the authority to dictate where their money goes, shouldn't they?

quote:

PS.....its nicknamed "VOODOO economics" for a darn good reason...

To make it sound scary and spooky. I know.

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
ds,.... the ultimate profit for that vehicle no matter where its built, goes to the parent companies bottom line, wherever that companies headquartered.

Then Chrysler, Jeep, and Dodge are not American nameplates anymore. Try pulling that one out on a UAW member.

quote:

For example, Medtronic, a long time Minnesota company, in a strategic move, "inverted" & transferred its home offices to Ireland, where it now pays a third of the taxes it paid in the US.
Guess what? That means its profits, AND GDP is now also claimed by Ireland. and it STILL gets to keep the $40M in US federal contracts it has acquired. Not to mention allsorts of other perks of a US company,

$40M in US Federal contracts? So what? Are you going to attempt to make the claim that ONLY US-American companies, based in the US should be eligible for Federal contracts? Ready for the Federal Government to start paying a shit ton more for those contracts because you're eliminating competitors?

quote:

Like the majority of the benefits of US citizenship. OH sure, Medtronic, hired more people, and those people pay taxes, buy things, etc.,. BUT.... that doesn't make up for the $3 BILLION in taxes EVERY YEAR that doesn't go into US coffers. and THAT $3B in taxes is what we all have to make up for.

Maybe companies don't leave if the tax codes were fair or less uneven? Btw, Medtronic still pays taxes on all the business it does in the US, just like before.

quote:

NOW,.....let Me make this clear...... I am all for a TRUE MIDDLE CLASS TAX CUT. - families and individuals. and poor people.
NOT one thin dime of a tax cut to the wealthy, or the majority of big corporations, big business without strings attached,
to Me, the wealthy and big corporations don't need another bundle of money to not create jobs with. which job creation is one of the bullshit selling points for the tax cuts in the first place.
u like the wealthy so much? keep giving them ur wallet and see what u get back from them. keep giving the wealthy tax cuts with no strings attached and that's all ur doing.

First of all, how do you define the "Middle Class?" That will make any sort of math easier and less ambiguous.
I completely oppose "strings attached" unless it applies to everyone evenly. Reductions in taxes is a reduction in the amount of money government is taking away from you. That is, they are taking less of your money. Your money. Anyone should be free to choose where they spend their own money.
I would support a progressive tax bracket structure, though I much prefer a consumption tax (with a few tax-free categories). I absolutely support closing all loopholes (save for charitable giving and double taxation).

quote:

So far the only thing they given u or anybody so far from tax cuts is more space between u and them for total net worth....how stupid is that???

Why the fuck do you care how much more they have than you?!? Why not just give a fuck how much you have?

quote:

IF the reason for giving a tax cut is for job creation, then its not too damn much to demand & make them ACTUALLY create jobs with it....
Now, u and I have had some good debates,...but, How does that NOT make sense to u??
to be simplistic.... If I ask u for money for a particular reason and u give it to Me, (TWICE!!) but I instead I go buy or do something else with it altogether, why should u keep giving Me more money OR....not demand I spend it for the reason I told u?

Because they are not "giving" them money. That money starts off belonging to them, not the government. They should have the authority to dictate where their money goes, shouldn't they?

quote:

PS.....its nicknamed "VOODOO economics" for a darn good reason...

To make it sound scary and spooky. I know.

well introduce that previously unknowing UAW member to an actual economics major and I'm pretty sure They will be damn surprised where the ultimate profits and taxes for his labor goes to.
Those nameplates are American but that's where it ends. The final profits, Taxes, and GDP are in Italia's coffers. Bon Appetit!!.... (er, sorry thats French, but u get the idea...)
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-filing/Annual-Report/2016/12/31/t.aspx?t=:FCAU&ft=20-F/A&d=67af96fce38795963770ef1d200697c8 .......this is Fiat's 2017 annual report. Read and learn My friend.
And since we get along, I'm going to try and shorten ur search for the truth by suggesting clicking on links: • EXHIBIT 99.1 FCA BANK 16/15  • EXHIBIT 99.2 FCA BANK 15/14 once u get there.... pick one or the other,
...after that I'm going to tell u what My business economics teacher demanded of Me: read the whole thing.... slowly. I will trust in ur intelligence to find & see the truth.
Medtronic's & Chrysler got to where they are by different means, but the end result is the same.... they are now both European owned companies who pay (less) European taxes, which gives Medtronics huge advantages over American based companies in bidding for US government contracts.
I give a fuck about what wealthy people & corporations have when its at My own expense beyond buying their products.
I don't know what rock hit u in ur head that u don't think that if they don't pay BILLIONS in taxes that >>>> u <<<<< don't make up for that loss in tax revenue somewhere???
Oh wait .....maybe ur gonna drive around with a full car of asphalt to fix potholes on the national interstate Highways when needed right? u would rather foot the bill

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
ds,.... the ultimate profit for that vehicle no matter where its built, goes to the parent companies bottom line, wherever that companies headquartered.

Then Chrysler, Jeep, and Dodge are not American nameplates anymore. Try pulling that one out on a UAW member.

quote:

For example, Medtronic, a long time Minnesota company, in a strategic move, "inverted" & transferred its home offices to Ireland, where it now pays a third of the taxes it paid in the US.
Guess what? That means its profits, AND GDP is now also claimed by Ireland. and it STILL gets to keep the $40M in US federal contracts it has acquired. Not to mention allsorts of other perks of a US company,

$40M in US Federal contracts? So what? Are you going to attempt to make the claim that ONLY US-American companies, based in the US should be eligible for Federal contracts? Ready for the Federal Government to start paying a shit ton more for those contracts because you're eliminating competitors?

quote:

Like the majority of the benefits of US citizenship. OH sure, Medtronic, hired more people, and those people pay taxes, buy things, etc.,. BUT.... that doesn't make up for the $3 BILLION in taxes EVERY YEAR that doesn't go into US coffers. and THAT $3B in taxes is what we all have to make up for.

Maybe companies don't leave if the tax codes were fair or less uneven? Btw, Medtronic still pays taxes on all the business it does in the US, just like before.

quote:

NOW,.....let Me make this clear...... I am all for a TRUE MIDDLE CLASS TAX CUT. - families and individuals. and poor people.
NOT one thin dime of a tax cut to the wealthy, or the majority of big corporations, big business without strings attached,
to Me, the wealthy and big corporations don't need another bundle of money to not create jobs with. which job creation is one of the bullshit selling points for the tax cuts in the first place.
u like the wealthy so much? keep giving them ur wallet and see what u get back from them. keep giving the wealthy tax cuts with no strings attached and that's all ur doing.

First of all, how do you define the "Middle Class?" That will make any sort of math easier and less ambiguous.
I completely oppose "strings attached" unless it applies to everyone evenly. Reductions in taxes is a reduction in the amount of money government is taking away from you. That is, they are taking less of your money. Your money. Anyone should be free to choose where they spend their own money.
I would support a progressive tax bracket structure, though I much prefer a consumption tax (with a few tax-free categories). I absolutely support closing all loopholes (save for charitable giving and double taxation).

quote:

So far the only thing they given u or anybody so far from tax cuts is more space between u and them for total net worth....how stupid is that???

Why the fuck do you care how much more they have than you?!? Why not just give a fuck how much you have?

quote:

IF the reason for giving a tax cut is for job creation, then its not too damn much to demand & make them ACTUALLY create jobs with it....
Now, u and I have had some good debates,...but, How does that NOT make sense to u??
to be simplistic.... If I ask u for money for a particular reason and u give it to Me, (TWICE!!) but I instead I go buy or do something else with it altogether, why should u keep giving Me more money OR....not demand I spend it for the reason I told u?

Because they are not "giving" them money. That money starts off belonging to them, not the government. They should have the authority to dictate where their money goes, shouldn't they?

quote:

PS.....its nicknamed "VOODOO economics" for a darn good reason...

To make it sound scary and spooky. I know.

well introduce that previously unknowing UAW member to an actual economics major and I'm pretty sure They will be damn surprised where the ultimate profits and taxes for his labor goes to.
Those nameplates are American but that's where it ends. The final profits, Taxes, and GDP are in Italia's coffers. Bon Appetit!!.... (er, sorry thats French, but u get the idea...)
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-filing/Annual-Report/2016/12/31/t.aspx?t=:FCAU&ft=20-F/A&d=67af96fce38795963770ef1d200697c8 .......this is Fiat's 2017 annual report. Read and learn My friend.
And since we get along, I'm going to try and shorten ur search for the truth by suggesting clicking on links: • EXHIBIT 99.1 FCA BANK 16/15  • EXHIBIT 99.2 FCA BANK 15/14 once u get there.... pick one or the other,
...after that I'm going to tell u what My business economics teacher demanded of Me: read the whole thing.... slowly. I will trust in ur intelligence to find & see the truth.
Medtronic's & Chrysler got to where they are by different means, but the end result is the same.... they are now both European owned companies who pay (less) European taxes, which gives Medtronics huge advantages over American based companies in bidding for US government contracts.
I give a fuck about what wealthy people & corporations have when its at My own expense beyond buying their products.
I don't know what rock hit u in ur head that u don't think that if they don't pay BILLIONS in taxes that >>>> u <<<<< don't make up for that loss in tax revenue somewhere???
Oh wait .....maybe ur gonna drive around with a full car of asphalt to fix potholes on the national interstate Highways when needed right? u would rather foot the bill

Considering fixing potholes is supposed to come out of the taxes we pay for fuel......

So, your reaction to corporations leaving for other places for lower taxes, is to not make the US tax structure more competitive? That's not likely to make things better.

Government revenues are at or near record highs. It's spending that's the problem in the US.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
ds,.... the ultimate profit for that vehicle no matter where its built, goes to the parent companies bottom line, wherever that companies headquartered.

Then Chrysler, Jeep, and Dodge are not American nameplates anymore. Try pulling that one out on a UAW member.

quote:

For example, Medtronic, a long time Minnesota company, in a strategic move, "inverted" & transferred its home offices to Ireland, where it now pays a third of the taxes it paid in the US.
Guess what? That means its profits, AND GDP is now also claimed by Ireland. and it STILL gets to keep the $40M in US federal contracts it has acquired. Not to mention allsorts of other perks of a US company,

$40M in US Federal contracts? So what? Are you going to attempt to make the claim that ONLY US-American companies, based in the US should be eligible for Federal contracts? Ready for the Federal Government to start paying a shit ton more for those contracts because you're eliminating competitors?

quote:

Like the majority of the benefits of US citizenship. OH sure, Medtronic, hired more people, and those people pay taxes, buy things, etc.,. BUT.... that doesn't make up for the $3 BILLION in taxes EVERY YEAR that doesn't go into US coffers. and THAT $3B in taxes is what we all have to make up for.

Maybe companies don't leave if the tax codes were fair or less uneven? Btw, Medtronic still pays taxes on all the business it does in the US, just like before.

quote:

NOW,.....let Me make this clear...... I am all for a TRUE MIDDLE CLASS TAX CUT. - families and individuals. and poor people.
NOT one thin dime of a tax cut to the wealthy, or the majority of big corporations, big business without strings attached,
to Me, the wealthy and big corporations don't need another bundle of money to not create jobs with. which job creation is one of the bullshit selling points for the tax cuts in the first place.
u like the wealthy so much? keep giving them ur wallet and see what u get back from them. keep giving the wealthy tax cuts with no strings attached and that's all ur doing.

First of all, how do you define the "Middle Class?" That will make any sort of math easier and less ambiguous.
I completely oppose "strings attached" unless it applies to everyone evenly. Reductions in taxes is a reduction in the amount of money government is taking away from you. That is, they are taking less of your money. Your money. Anyone should be free to choose where they spend their own money.
I would support a progressive tax bracket structure, though I much prefer a consumption tax (with a few tax-free categories). I absolutely support closing all loopholes (save for charitable giving and double taxation).

quote:

So far the only thing they given u or anybody so far from tax cuts is more space between u and them for total net worth....how stupid is that???

Why the fuck do you care how much more they have than you?!? Why not just give a fuck how much you have?

quote:

IF the reason for giving a tax cut is for job creation, then its not too damn much to demand & make them ACTUALLY create jobs with it....
Now, u and I have had some good debates,...but, How does that NOT make sense to u??
to be simplistic.... If I ask u for money for a particular reason and u give it to Me, (TWICE!!) but I instead I go buy or do something else with it altogether, why should u keep giving Me more money OR....not demand I spend it for the reason I told u?

Because they are not "giving" them money. That money starts off belonging to them, not the government. They should have the authority to dictate where their money goes, shouldn't they?

quote:

PS.....its nicknamed "VOODOO economics" for a darn good reason...

To make it sound scary and spooky. I know.

well introduce that previously unknowing UAW member to an actual economics major and I'm pretty sure They will be damn surprised where the ultimate profits and taxes for his labor goes to.
Those nameplates are American but that's where it ends. The final profits, Taxes, and GDP are in Italia's coffers. Bon Appetit!!.... (er, sorry thats French, but u get the idea...)
http://quote.morningstar.com/stock-filing/Annual-Report/2016/12/31/t.aspx?t=:FCAU&ft=20-F/A&d=67af96fce38795963770ef1d200697c8 .......this is Fiat's 2017 annual report. Read and learn My friend.
And since we get along, I'm going to try and shorten ur search for the truth by suggesting clicking on links: • EXHIBIT 99.1 FCA BANK 16/15  • EXHIBIT 99.2 FCA BANK 15/14 once u get there.... pick one or the other,
...after that I'm going to tell u what My business economics teacher demanded of Me: read the whole thing.... slowly. I will trust in ur intelligence to find & see the truth.
Medtronic's & Chrysler got to where they are by different means, but the end result is the same.... they are now both European owned companies who pay (less) European taxes, which gives Medtronics huge advantages over American based companies in bidding for US government contracts.
I give a fuck about what wealthy people & corporations have when its at My own expense beyond buying their products.
I don't know what rock hit u in ur head that u don't think that if they don't pay BILLIONS in taxes that >>>> u <<<<< don't make up for that loss in tax revenue somewhere???
Oh wait .....maybe ur gonna drive around with a full car of asphalt to fix potholes on the national interstate Highways when needed right? u would rather foot the bill

Considering fixing potholes is supposed to come out of the taxes we pay for fuel......

So, your reaction to corporations leaving for other places for lower taxes, is to not make the US tax structure more competitive? That's not likely to make things better.

Government revenues are at or near record highs. It's spending that's the problem in the US.

quote:

ORIGINAL: itsSIRtou
.....And when they pay less taxes because ur making things "more competitive" for them, please make note of that when those gas taxes go up that .5 to 2 cents a gallon to u, and as u are paying it, remember the only thing the upper 1& are thinking about u paying that extra tax (among other rising taxes.) is how much of a SUCKER u are for letting them LIE to u & literally get away with shifting more of the tax burden to u, while swearing (lying) they are going to create jobs with another tax cut....

quote:

while they shift more cash into the off-shore tax-dodging banks they aren't supposed to have ether.
sure go ahead.....u fall back on the "spending problem" one-trick pony, but remember those wealthy people are taking advantage of the same disaster relief services that the lowest income home owner is....
thats ALSO coming out of ur pocket when they are more than capable of taking care of their own shit.
please inform Me oh "Help for the truly needy" and Mr. "Personal Responsibility"
....when do u pry ur eyes open and discover ur being fleeced?

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)