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I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/21/2017 2:44:46 PM

MasterJaguar01

Posts: 2346
Joined: 12/2/2006
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I LOVED his 60 mins interview and agreed with everything he said (except for his worship of Trump)

More recently (in his speech in New York)
This quote rings sooooo true in every way:
"There has not been a more destructive presidency than George Bush's,"

And this one about Bush:
"He has no earthly idea of whether he's coming or going, just like it was when he was President of the United States."

Steve Bannon makes a lot of sense often (just not always) :)

In high level principles... I support his idea of Economic Nationalism.

At a high-level, I support looking for ways to gain more favorable trade agreements. (Not necessarily tariffs)
At a high-level, I support a merit-based immigration system like other countries have (with the exception of course of true refugees escaping violence)
At a high-level I support looking for a more equitable contribution from members of strategic alliances (e.g. NATO). (I do not support making inaccurate provocative claims that the alliances are obsolete, and that other countries are contributing less than they actually are)

P.S. I posted about Steve Bannon, so the Howdy Doody guy will accuse me of duplicating the "Economic Nationalists" primary thread.

< Message edited by MasterJaguar01 -- 10/21/2017 3:34:02 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/21/2017 5:29:47 PM

ThatDizzyChick

Posts: 5490
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quote:

I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more

You know, they have medication for that.

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Not your average bimbo.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 2

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/21/2017 5:33:44 PM

Lucylastic

Posts: 40310
Status: offline

you can prescribe it, but you cant make em take it.

PS that isnt a dig at the OP, but bannon is a carbuncle on the backside of humanity.
But like a clock, sometimes he isnt far off the mark.
However the vastness of his disregard for others...puts me off being able to say anything....nicer.

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(in reply to ThatDizzyChick)

Post #: 3

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/21/2017 6:05:05 PM

MasterJaguar01

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Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: online

I find it fascinating that I saw Bosco in this thread... Yet no comment from him I truly believe he is just flummoxed on this.

(in reply to Lucylastic)

Post #: 4

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/21/2017 8:49:47 PM

Marini

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I seriously disliked George Bush, I said it often during and after his Presidency.

I didn't need Bannon, to "inform" me how awful and destructive GWB was.

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As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 5

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 12:22:45 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

Very few people disagree about W.

The problem with Bannon isn't that he can't identify the problems (for most politicians, this has never been the problem), it's that he comes up with clumsy, ineffective or ethically repulsive solutions.

Shutting everything down isn't a solution, it's an act of aggression.

Focusing on dealing with the people who are profiting the most from globalization/cheap overseas labor, taxing them, penalizing them, imprisoning them, etc... and then putting the money to good use in terms of education, social programs, job creation, etc. is the way to go.

Blaming everything on 'the dirty Chinese', 'the dirty Mexicans', 'the dirty Muslims', 'the whiny liberals' and 'the selfish Europeans' is a nice simplistic way to sum up all the US's problems, but it's also a good way to completely destroy the social fabric of the entire country, and also the rest of the world.

(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 6

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 12:57:17 AM

MrRodgers

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Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Very few people disagree about W.

The problem with Bannon isn't that he can't identify the problems (for most politicians, this has never been the problem), it's that he comes up with clumsy, ineffective or ethically repulsive solutions.

Shutting everything down isn't a solution, it's an act of aggression.

Focusing on dealing with the people who are profiting the most from globalization/cheap overseas labor, taxing them, penalizing them, imprisoning them, etc... and then putting the money to good use in terms of education, social programs, job creation, etc. is the way to go.

Blaming everything on 'the dirty Chinese', 'the dirty Mexicans', 'the dirty Muslims', 'the whiny liberals' and 'the selfish Europeans' is a nice simplistic way to sum up all the US's problems, but it's also a good way to completely destroy the social fabric of the entire country, and also the rest of the world.

Good post but from what I've read and the little bit I've heard is that in the cause of anything close to what one might describe as 'economic nationalism' the real beginning politically needs to be an overpowering, getting rid of or otherwise marginalizing the establishment or at least the 'established order.'

That cannot happen at the ballot box or if it can, will take at least another generation as reflected by how quickly the Tea Party has been so marginalized. Until you get a substantial majority of say even of just hard fiscal and corp. conservatives all of the way to committee chairs, real change goes nowhere.

And the reason is, is that the real establishment is behind-the-throne, the industrialists, the bankers and corp. elites that have all of those million$ in free speech to throw around and thus...pull the strings.

_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 7

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 1:18:07 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Good post but from what I've read and the little bit I've heard is that in the cause of anything close to what one might describe as 'economic nationalism' the real beginning politically needs to be an overpowering, getting rid of or otherwise marginalizing the establishment or at least the 'established order.'

That cannot happen at the ballot box or if it can, will take at least another generation as reflected by how quickly the Tea Party has been so marginalized. Until you get a substantial majority of say even of just hard fiscal and corp. conservatives all of the way to committee chairs, real change goes nowhere.

And the reason is, is that the real establishment is behind-the-throne, the industrialists, the bankers and corp. elites that have all of those million$ in free speech to throw around and thus...pull the strings.

If the established order wants to continue to be the established order, they will have to make concessions or they will go down with the ship.
The problem is that the danger isn't real enough for them yet.

I honestly think that the right is a much bigger problem than the elites... because for every scumbag like Donald Trump or the Koch brothers, you have a philanthropist like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett.

The problem isn't the people who have the money, the problem is the people who continue to block effective solutions by defunding education, lowering taxes on the rich, deregulating industry, etc.
It isn't the elites who are doing this, it's the right-wingers in power, and the left-wingers who continue make concessions to them.
People who are craving a real left-wing party in America are forced to settle for a compromised left who makes unforgivable concessions on economic and military issues in exchange for a few pithy advances in civil rights from time to time.
It has been this way for so long that it's actually a way of life now.
Obama's 'whiff of socialism' is what got him elected in 2008... and when he didn't follow up, people didn't hold him accountable because the alternative is obviously worse.

America is still caught up in a deranged mutation of the anti-leftist sentiment left over from the cold war... becoming so extreme as to suggest that all taxes, all social programs, all environmental initiatives, all attempts to counter racism, and even science are something to be feared, mocked, etc... and that America desperately needs to protect itself from the enemy.
The Democrats only offer a slightly less unhinged perspective on the same sentiment.

Canada, Germany, Australia, the UK, Scandinavia... none of these countries have political organizations as vile and backwards as the GOP, and are better for it.
If Trump leads to a stronger left, that would be the one good thing about his presidency, but I don't see it happening... all I see is the compromise party acting weaker than ever before and refusing to change.

I think it's far more likely that the right nominates Hitler in 2024 than the compromise party running a real leftist in 2020.

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 8

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 1:58:29 AM

MasterJaguar01

Posts: 2346
Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Very few people disagree about W.

The problem with Bannon isn't that he can't identify the problems (for most politicians, this has never been the problem), it's that he comes up with clumsy, ineffective or ethically repulsive solutions.

Shutting everything down isn't a solution, it's an act of aggression.

Focusing on dealing with the people who are profiting the most from globalization/cheap overseas labor, taxing them, penalizing them, imprisoning them, etc... and then putting the money to good use in terms of education, social programs, job creation, etc. is the way to go.

Blaming everything on 'the dirty Chinese', 'the dirty Mexicans', 'the dirty Muslims', 'the whiny liberals' and 'the selfish Europeans' is a nice simplistic way to sum up all the US's problems, but it's also a good way to completely destroy the social fabric of the entire country, and also the rest of the world.

Great post... I will say... Not only can he identify the problems, at a theoretical level (one ready for prime time on 60 minutes), he can talk in generalities as to the solutions. It's when he starts dumbing down those solutions and starts identifying scapegoats (e.g. "the dirty Chinese, etc.) that his thought process breaks down.

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 9

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 2:27:27 AM

MasterJaguar01

Posts: 2346
Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Canada, Germany, Australia, the UK, Scandinavia... none of these countries have political organizations as vile and backwards as the GOP, and are better for it.
If Trump leads to a stronger left, that would be the one good thing about his presidency, but I don't see it happening... all I see is the compromise party acting weaker than ever before and refusing to change.

I believe if you do some research on this, you find this not to be true. It just so happens that the "vile and backwards" folks in those countries don't have enough money and power right now.

All of those countries have more social programs than the U.S. They also have much smaller, much less diverse populations, which lend themselves to more manageable (from a cost and logistical perspective) programs.

Take healthcare in the UK for example. As the UK's population has grown and become more diverse (gee I sound like Steve Bannon, but more eloquent). the healthcare system is starting to show signs of unraveling. I spent 3 weeks there this summer, and the news stories were about a doctor shortage. (Docs were leaving the country, and new docs out of med school were only practicing a short time in the UK and then leaving)

Part of what has made the UK's healthcare system manageable in the past, is that providers, mid-levels, AND Rn's make a boatload less in the UK than they do in the U.S. while having to see many more patients.

And BTW: I have said in my whitepapers on the subject that PART of the problem of the cost of healthcare in the U.S. is the income expectations of providers.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/aug/10/shortage-doctors-midwives-mothers-babies-lives-risk
https://www.ft.com/content/a3a52be8-8e3a-11e7-a352-e46f43c5825d
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/03/16/how-much-are-junior-doctors-paid-and-why-are-they-threatening-to/

Healthcare is but one example.

My overall point is...
Steve Bannon may get to the point of scapegoating groups (which is disgusting and unhelpful), but take him back up to his "ready for 60 minutes" level, and he begins to make sense. Without some sense of "Economic Nationalism", the social programs that we DO have will begin to unravel. (Of which the UK Healthcare system is perfect example for that country).

< Message edited by MasterJaguar01 -- 10/22/2017 2:36:40 AM >

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 10

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 3:37:01 AM

bounty44

Posts: 6374
Joined: 11/1/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Very few people disagree about W.

seriously? looking forward to the results of the study that show that.

but since you cannot produce that, that is, it doesn't exist and anything you would try to share would be a lame attempt at stretching terms/changing goalposts, etc., how about we just leave it as a rhetorical statement?

quote:

America is still caught up in a deranged mutation of the anti-leftist sentiment left over from the cold war... becoming so extreme as to suggest that all taxes, all social programs, all environmental initiatives, all attempts to counter racism, and even science are something to be feared, mocked, etc... and that America desperately needs to protect itself from the enemy.

in this case, let me borrow a phrase from bosco---only in your cartoonish view of reality is what you said the case.

and im sure you miss the incredible irony in your premise too.

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 11

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 9:08:52 AM

BoscoX

Posts: 11234
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Canada, Germany, Australia, the UK, Scandinavia... none of these countries have political organizations as vile and backwards as the GOP, and are better for it.
If Trump leads to a stronger left, that would be the one good thing about his presidency, but I don't see it happening... all I see is the compromise party acting weaker than ever before and refusing to change.

I believe if you do some research on this, you find this not to be true. It just so happens that the "vile and backwards" folks in those countries don't have enough money and power right now.

All of those countries have more social programs than the U.S. They also have much smaller, much less diverse populations, which lend themselves to more manageable (from a cost and logistical perspective) programs.

Take healthcare in the UK for example. As the UK's population has grown and become more diverse (gee I sound like Steve Bannon, but more eloquent). the healthcare system is starting to show signs of unraveling. I spent 3 weeks there this summer, and the news stories were about a doctor shortage. (Docs were leaving the country, and new docs out of med school were only practicing a short time in the UK and then leaving)

Part of what has made the UK's healthcare system manageable in the past, is that providers, mid-levels, AND Rn's make a boatload less in the UK than they do in the U.S. while having to see many more patients.

And BTW: I have said in my whitepapers on the subject that PART of the problem of the cost of healthcare in the U.S. is the income expectations of providers.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/aug/10/shortage-doctors-midwives-mothers-babies-lives-risk
https://www.ft.com/content/a3a52be8-8e3a-11e7-a352-e46f43c5825d
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/03/16/how-much-are-junior-doctors-paid-and-why-are-they-threatening-to/

Healthcare is but one example.

My overall point is...
Steve Bannon may get to the point of scapegoating groups (which is disgusting and unhelpful), but take him back up to his "ready for 60 minutes" level, and he begins to make sense. Without some sense of "Economic Nationalism", the social programs that we DO have will begin to unravel. (Of which the UK Healthcare system is perfect example for that country).

Socialist principles applied to healthcare? What could possibly go wrong

I can't understand why British doctors and nurses are so unhappy with slave jobs and slave wages

What on Earth is the matter with them. Where is their sense of communal camaraderie

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Thought Criminal

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 12

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 9:38:57 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

Look at the genius Bosco piggybacking on someone else's post, adding nothing but sarcasm, socialism-bashing and the ridiculous implication that he is worldly enough to have brought it up as well.

This from a guy who has contributed exactly zero insight to the forum over at least the time I have seen him here.

Bounty too... adds absolutely nothing but insults without even attempting to attack the substance of my post.
Pathetic.

(in reply to BoscoX)

Post #: 13

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 9:49:13 AM

BoscoX

Posts: 11234
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Look at the genius Bosco piggybacking on someone else's post, adding nothing but sarcasm, socialism-bashing and the ridiculous implication that he is worldly enough to have brought it up as well.

This from a guy who has contributed exactly zero insight to the forum over at least the time I have seen him here.

Bounty too... adds absolutely nothing but insults without even attempting to attack the substance of my post.
Pathetic.

Your fellow howlers might buy into your troll spew... But any thinking person is enjoying a hearty laugh at your expense

It's comedic in it's high irony, describing neither bounty nor myself, but your own post, as well as your own posting style

Never stop commenting here - PLEASE

_____________________________

Thought Criminal

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 14

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:10:10 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Canada, Germany, Australia, the UK, Scandinavia... none of these countries have political organizations as vile and backwards as the GOP, and are better for it.
If Trump leads to a stronger left, that would be the one good thing about his presidency, but I don't see it happening... all I see is the compromise party acting weaker than ever before and refusing to change.

I believe if you do some research on this, you find this not to be true. It just so happens that the "vile and backwards" folks in those countries don't have enough money and power right now.

My guess is that this is because the societies they are living in don't support them with donations or votes.
I am not saying it is impossible for them to become the GOP for their respective countries, just that they aren't the GOP... and I think the local cultures have something to do with that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
All of those countries have more social programs than the U.S. They also have much smaller, much less diverse populations, which lend themselves to more manageable (from a cost and logistical perspective) programs.

Take healthcare in the UK for example. As the UK's population has grown and become more diverse (gee I sound like Steve Bannon, but more eloquent). the healthcare system is starting to show signs of unraveling. I spent 3 weeks there this summer, and the news stories were about a doctor shortage. (Docs were leaving the country, and new docs out of med school were only practicing a short time in the UK and then leaving)

Part of what has made the UK's healthcare system manageable in the past, is that providers, mid-levels, AND Rn's make a boatload less in the UK than they do in the U.S. while having to see many more patients.

And BTW: I have said in my whitepapers on the subject that PART of the problem of the cost of healthcare in the U.S. is the income expectations of providers.

I don't know how you can claim that England or Canada don't have diverse populations.
Canada actually has the highest percentage of foreign-born residents in the world.

You will have to explain to me why diversity and population size make public health care unsustainable because it seems to me that if more people are there to pay in, there will be more money available for treatments.

Brain drain is always an issue where public health care exists near to nations with private health care-- salaries are higher elsewhere, but that doesn't mean that private health care is better for society as a whole.
The worst part is places like Denmark where people train to be doctors for FREE, then leave Denmark and go elsewhere because the private systems offer more money... the nation as a whole trains people to be doctors and gets nothing back.

Of course, if all health care were public, this might be less of an issue.

Still, if it's a choice between health care that I can afford and doing without because it would bankrupt me or ruin my credit score, I would still choose the former.
And if you are sure the UK system is failing, are you going to argue that the US system is an unqualified success?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
My overall point is...
Steve Bannon may get to the point of scapegoating groups (which is disgusting and unhelpful), but take him back up to his "ready for 60 minutes" level, and he begins to make sense. Without some sense of "Economic Nationalism", the social programs that we DO have will begin to unravel. (Of which the UK Healthcare system is perfect example for that country).

I get that the UK and other public health care systems aren't perfect, but the issue here isn't whether they are perfect or not, it's whether they are better than what the US has now.
You can't just say 'oh look, we have so many problems', 'oh look they also have so many problems', 'oh look the world isn't perfect' and then conclude that you can't learn from other systems and pick and choose what might work best.
You don't need to copy everything that another country does, but if you're not willing to learn from your own mistakes and are always using the mistakes of others as an excuse to never change, you're doomed to fail.

I also don't know how you get from 'socialized health care has problems of its own' to agreeing with a vision that basically amounts to 'fuck the rest of the world'.
America has ALWAYS put its own interests first, and the idea that this hasn't been happening is offensive... America is NOT a victim, and Americans have been reaping huge benefits from wars, trade agreements, defense contracts, etc. for decades now.
The problem is that all of this 'keep what belongs to you' shit means that the Americans who are benefitting aren't sharing the benefits with anyone else, because the right has been making sure that they don't have to.

(in reply to MasterJaguar01)

Post #: 15

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:17:14 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Look at the genius Bosco piggybacking on someone else's post, adding nothing but sarcasm, socialism-bashing and the ridiculous implication that he is worldly enough to have brought it up as well.

This from a guy who has contributed exactly zero insight to the forum over at least the time I have seen him here.

Bounty too... adds absolutely nothing but insults without even attempting to attack the substance of my post.
Pathetic.

Your fellow howlers might buy into your troll spew... But any thinking person is enjoying a hearty laugh at your expense

It's comedic in it's high irony, describing neither bounty nor myself, but your own post, as well as your own posting style

Never stop commenting here - PLEASE

You really do give me the impression that you don't understand anything that's actually being said, including links to things that you post.
Obviously you understand things like 'howler means I don't like you', but not much beyond that.

I know you don't understand what fallacies are, how to conduct a debate, what trolling is, or even that cutting someone down tends to involve a bit more than calling them meaningless names.
Do you even have the slightest inkling of just how little substance there is in each and every post you make?
I keep telling myself that on some vague, intuitive level, you know this is true... but there are also times that I am certain you simply lack the facilities to discern this.
Seriously... 'thinking person'?? What, like the guy whose only argument is calling everyone 'comrades' and reposting townhall? The guy who pretends something is funny, calls everyone a 'howler' and then refuses to discuss the issue at hand?
Hey... remember when you were repeating 'alt-left' over and over instead of 'howler'? Wow, I bet you think you're pretty smart for switching terms like that.

In fact, you're probably just sitting there at home, beaming with pride over how you called someone a 'howler' for the 483rd time, sure that you really 'got them' that time, and that everything you believe in has become that much more true.

(in reply to BoscoX)

Post #: 16

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:27:02 AM

Lucylastic

Posts: 40310
Status: offline

FR.

As the healthcare in the UK has been free at point of service since 1948, almost 70 years. You can claim failure, all you like, it has saved millions of lives, and continues to do so.
Its been unravelling since the 80s, precisely because of the government cutting programs, inserting more managers, and less front line staff.
Privatising the hc system is something that has dragged it down. Its being worked on, not left to die. Its lagging, its far from perfect, but please dont say the US cant do it because of the population and logistics, that just proves how shitty your planners are....profit over care is one of the reasons they are all having problems.
And continues too as the rich fuck the poor over again, yay profit.
As they do, the whole world over.

_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 17

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:37:14 AM

BoscoX

Posts: 11234
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

Look at the genius Bosco piggybacking on someone else's post, adding nothing but sarcasm, socialism-bashing and the ridiculous implication that he is worldly enough to have brought it up as well.

This from a guy who has contributed exactly zero insight to the forum over at least the time I have seen him here.

Bounty too... adds absolutely nothing but insults without even attempting to attack the substance of my post.
Pathetic.

Your fellow howlers might buy into your troll spew... But any thinking person is enjoying a hearty laugh at your expense

It's comedic in it's high irony, describing neither bounty nor myself, but your own post, as well as your own posting style

Never stop commenting here - PLEASE

You really do give me the impression that you don't understand anything that's actually being said, including links to things that you post.
Obviously you understand things like 'howler means I don't like you', but not much beyond that.

I know you don't understand what fallacies are, how to conduct a debate, what trolling is, or even that cutting someone down tends to involve a bit more than calling them meaningless names.
Do you even have the slightest inkling of just how little substance there is in each and every post you make?
I keep telling myself that on some vague, intuitive level, you know this is true... but there are also times that I am certain you simply lack the facilities to discern this.
Seriously... 'thinking person'?? What, like the guy whose only argument is calling everyone 'comrades' and reposting townhall? The guy who pretends something is funny, calls everyone a 'howler' and then refuses to discuss the issue at hand?
Hey... remember when you were repeating 'alt-left' over and over instead of 'howler'? Wow, I bet you think you're pretty smart for switching terms like that.

In fact, you're probably just sitting there at home, beaming with pride over how you called someone a 'howler' for the 483rd time, sure that you really 'got them' that time, and that everything you believe in has become that much more true.

Were your mad howling anywhere near the reality you and your little troll army friends wouldn't work overtime to make so many of these threads about me (and other conservative posters) personally

The opposite is true - the things we post serve to drive you trolls further insane because you cannot address nor deny what we write so you troll like this

Work to make every discussion personal rather than academic or factual

As in your trollish reply to my post above:

quote:

Socialist principles applied to healthcare? What could possibly go wrong

I can't understand why British doctors and nurses are so unhappy with slave jobs and slave wages

What on Earth is the matter with them. Where is their sense of communal camaraderie

Doctors and nurses are fleeing the socialist system in the UK, and their health care system is in shambles

It's the exact system you howlers want for the USA

But you are all halfwits who cannot possibly address the subject matter of a post, the very best you can manage is to make these threads personal or arrange some other form of derail or deflection. Things of that nature

Day in and day out, thread after thread, time and time again

_____________________________

Thought Criminal

(in reply to heavyblinker)

Post #: 18

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:49:29 AM

BoscoX

Posts: 11234
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

FR.

As the healthcare in the UK has been free at point of service since 1948, almost 70 years. You can claim failure, all you like, it has saved millions of lives, and continues to do so.
Its been unravelling since the 80s, precisely because of the government cutting programs, inserting more managers, and less front line staff.
Privatising the hc system is something that has dragged it down. Its being worked on, not left to die. Its lagging, its far from perfect, but please dont say the US cant do it because of the population and logistics, that just proves how shitty your planners are....profit over care is one of the reasons they are all having problems.
And continues too as the rich fuck the poor over again, yay profit.
As they do, the whole world over.

So you're saying that the problem is, that it isn't communist enough there in Britain, despite the howler chorus constantly reminding us that the UK is FAR to the left of the USA

FAR to the left

So far to the left that Americans don't know what socialism is, according to you howler trolls

Yet it's too capitalist now, to handle it's citizen's healthcare?

Seriously?

Here's the system you're looking for, I think: You need a strong leader to make it all work out. Don't you...

China’s rising authoritarianism has a stark human cost

I Heping spent his career trying to hold Chinese Communist Party officials accountable for their darkest behavior. He believed in an authority higher than the party — China’s own legal system. And for that, he suffered tremendously.

Since the late ’90s, Li, a 46-year-old human rights lawyer, had defended China’s most persecuted groups: dissidents, petitioners, victims of land grabs and forced demolitions, church leaders, practitioners of the banned spiritual group Falun Gong. Then came the “709” crackdown — named for July 9, 2015, the night it began — when authorities detained or interrogated more than 300 lawyers and their associates, including Li. They held Li without charge for nearly two years. And this May, they let him go — on the condition he remain silent.

“What my husband has gone through during that 22 months in jail was relentless, inhuman, perverted and unthinkable,” said his wife, Wang Qiaoling, 44, who has emerged as an outspoken advocate for rule of law amid her husband’s enforced silence. “The police will torture you till the edge of death, both physically and mentally.”

Since Chinese President Xi Jinping ascended to power in 2012, he has both amassed extraordinary power — analysts routinely call him China’s strongest leader since Mao Tse-tung — and ratcheted up repression to its highest levels since the early 1990s.

Wang Qiaoling is the wife of human rights lawyer Li Heping. (Fred Dufour/ AFP / Getty Images)
This week, a twice-a-decade Communist Party congress is almost certain to grant him another five-year term. Yet beyond the congress’ displays of pageantry and protocol — its chandeliers, identical black suits and long, turgid speeches — Li’s experience is a vivid reminder of the party’s propensity for maintaining its grip on power through violence and fear.

The Communist Party, under Xi, has introduced new, draconian legislation tightening control over religion, foreign non-governmental organizations and the internet. Xi’s sweeping anti-corruption drive has “punished” more than a million officials and suppressed competing party factions. He has repeatedly vowed to preside over a “national rejuvenation” — one that categorically rejects “Western values” such as democracy, rule of law and freedom of speech. The media has been neutered. Scores of lawyers, activists and journalists have been jailed...

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Thought Criminal

(in reply to Lucylastic)

Post #: 19

RE: I find myself agreeing with Bannon more and more - 10/22/2017 10:57:27 AM

heavyblinker

Posts: 3623
Status: offline

Listen to all of this mindless, ignorant hysteria about the great British exodus of 2017!

'Doctors and nurses are fleeing!'
'The system is in shambles!'

Why not:
'Everyone in the UK has AIDS because of socialism!'
'Socialist doctors are sewing people's arms onto where their legs should be!'

Your posts are like headlines in a fucking supermarket tabloid, and contain about as much truth.
It is truly a wonder why anyone even lives in post-apocalyptic hellholes like Canada and the UK when they could be literally DYING because they can't afford privatized healthcare in the US.

(in reply to BoscoX)

Post #: 20

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