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What to look for in a flogger - 9/9/2006 5:33:15 AM   
wanta247


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Joined: 9/5/2006
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Can someone please suggest the things that we should look for ina flogger, ie: material, number of falls, over all length, thickness and with of falls. Also the best type of flogger to use for any desired effect. Thank you.
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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/9/2006 7:02:03 AM   
mstrjx


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www.aswgt.com

Jeff

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/9/2006 8:44:33 AM   
Viper001


Posts: 55
Joined: 8/8/2005
From: SF, California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wanta247

Can someone please suggest the things that we should look for ina flogger, ie: material, number of falls, over all length, thickness and with of falls. Also the best type of flogger to use for any desired effect. Thank you.


Nope, I'm not a mistress, lol. But was asked to assist as a whip/flogger maker in the SF Bay Area.

Fall material is a personal preference. Chapside for general purpose versatility, thuddy but some sting available depending on how it's used. Latigo/oily utility for sting and heavy "thud". Suede, deer, elk or "deertanned cowhide" for soft thud and warmup (almost a massage effect). Rubber works well for seriously vicious sting, heavy thud.

General specs for floggers: 8" handle, 20-24" falls, 3/16" to 3/8" depending on material, total number of strings in the fall average 30 to 60 (again, depending on the material and intended use), 12-14" braided wrist strap.

Features to look for in quality: a solid bundle of falls attached to the handle, cheaper floggers have a large vacancy in the center where the dowel is visible. Tight braiding on the handle. Solid, tight button knots. Balanced with the balance point approximately 1.5" behind the the fall.

Please contact direct if I can be of further assistance.

Respectfully,
RFJM
aka Viper Leatherworks
[email protected]


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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/9/2006 12:26:54 PM   
MsSonnetMarwood


Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
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A couple of notes on this.....

You don't need to go top of the line, but don't ever waste your money on something really cheap either.  Cheap floggers won't last and just don't feel as good.   For a good middle-of-the-road leather flogger, figure that you'll spend about $100. 

As a "first flogger", your best bet is something like a medium length deer or moose flogger.   It won't be a heavy intense flogger - more of a sensual massage-y thump flogger.   While you're learning how to use it, it will prevent you from doing much damage, and once you get proficient with floggers, it'll always be a great warm up toy.   When you're happy with that, you might want to get another flogger that's more thumpy (like buffalo or bull or suede) or stingier (like a braided flogger or latigo).   For non-leather floggers, bunny fur floggers, if well made, are both sensual and thumpy, but won't hold up like a leather flogger will.  Rubber stings like crazy or is uber thumpy, depending on how thin or thick the rubber strands are.  One of more unusual floggers I've seen used rubber snakes for the falls.  I'm still pissed at myself for not getting it.

"Balance point", in layman's terms, is the weight of the handle in relation to the weight of the falls on the flogger.  You want the handle to be slightly heavier than the falls, with the weight distributed fairly evenly across the length of the handle. 

The only thing I use wrist straps for is to hang the flogger up with, so length is a non-issue. 

< Message edited by MsSonnetMarwood -- 9/9/2006 12:28:08 PM >


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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/9/2006 11:32:08 PM   
MisPandora


Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wanta247

Can someone please suggest the things that we should look for ina flogger, ie: material, number of falls, over all length, thickness and with of falls. Also the best type of flogger to use for any desired effect. Thank you.

Damn, that's about as individual a question as 'what kind of car is best'!!!!

-- Size matters.  The handle needs to be balanced to the individual's hand and arm length.
-- Handle texture.  Do you prefer a smooth handle, or something with grip?  Braided, wrapped or corsetted handles are fancy.  Do you want hardwood or something different like a hame ball or metal handle?
-- Length does matter.  Obviously, 42 inch long falls on a flogger being handled by a 5 foot tall woman is going to be a might bit awkward.  The falls should be a managable length for the person. Also keep in mind the space that you're using the flogger in AND it's function.  A CBT or tit whip probably shouldnt be the long one!
-- Materials?  It's really going to depend on your skill, your desire to hurt someone, and the abilities of the bottom/target.  Do you want the razorwire?  (Just kidding) Deer and lambskin are very soft and are nice for a warmup or cooldown.  Elk is a little heavier and makes for a good middle of the road flogger.  (And braided elk is a nice softer cat.)  Suede is up there too, and has a nice texture that some enjoy.  Buffalo, caribou, moose and bull to be thicker (and some hides are cushy), creating a big thud.  Other leathers will vary -- cowhide, kangaroo, shark and horsehide all tend to be more edgy and stingy to play with.
-- Cut.  The ends have alot to do with the feel (square vs. slant cut) as does the width of the tress (narrower, especially with the sharper hides, tends to be far more stingy.)
-- Knots.  Knots in the ends, whether a braided cat or regular thin falls, will doubly increase the intensity of the implement.

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Ms World Leather 2004
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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/10/2006 6:20:30 AM   
mstrjx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

quote:

ORIGINAL: wanta247

Can someone please suggest the things that we should look for ina flogger, ie: material, number of falls, over all length, thickness and with of falls. Also the best type of flogger to use for any desired effect. Thank you.

Damn, that's about as individual a question as 'what kind of car is best'!!!!



That's why I didn't bother with a response, just a web site where you could find 50 of them, rated for severity and descriptions.  It's just too open-ended.

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/11/2006 7:40:08 PM   
ladylexington


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Good advice so far. I'd add a few suggestions to help you learn your personal preferences.

Go to a BDSM trade show. You'll get to try out hundreds of floggers. Test them on your leg, so you know how thuddy or stingy the falls feel, or bring a sub along for the ride. (It makes for awesome foreplay.)

And, if you're still not sure. See if a local pro Domme will let you rent her dungeon and equipment. (Some do this, some don't.) Then try out a little bit of everything. Many lifestyle Dommes are also willing to give lessons and offer first-hand advice. With a little practice, you can get a variety of sensations from a single flogger.



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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/14/2006 11:33:40 PM   
cacodylic


Posts: 157
Joined: 3/6/2005
From: CA
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Sorry, I couldn't resist....
quote:

ORIGINAL: wanta247
Can someone please suggest the things that we should look for ina flogger, ie: material,
 
human, female
quote:

number of falls,

I'd prefer seeing her natural hair, but...
quote:

over all length, 

oh, say 5'0" to 5'8"
quote:

thickness 

thin to medium
quote:

 Also the best type of flogger to use for any desired effect.

A very experienced one...

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/16/2006 3:45:04 PM   
Samwhiplash


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Hmmmm the most important factor for me in my next flogger/spanker buy will be ease of stroke for maximum impact with minimum exertion. An I the only one who wld far rather still be fresh as a daisy with perfect makeup at the end of a lengthy flogging - rather than a sweaty lady lololol

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/16/2006 7:47:24 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear wanta247, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Floggers are as personal choice as you want to go, as it is equipment that best suits the job you have to do with it.
 
I would take a look at web sites for floggers and make inquiries, as well as get someone with a wide selection to handle such.  I'll also mention that regardless of what type of leather you select, such as deer, there will be a wide variety of tanning processes that are done to deer hide, to which causes different results, so that should be kept in mind.
 
If you have a consistant partner, if they aren't a pain puppy, a Moose or Elk might do very well.  You can make approximately five sensations from one flogger, as well as go light sensual strokes as well as putting weight behind the stroke to feel heavier.  In addition, taking half the tails back, you will get a lighter flogger with a higher pitch of stingy tails.  Just tuck the excess tails under your grip of the handle.  You can twist all the tails into a tight twist and let go at the last minute, which makes a deer flogger feel like a bull.  You can take all but 9 tails back and create a cat o nine tails, or all but 2 or 1, to which a 'single' or one tail, is a single tail--so you don't need to rush out to buy a snake or signal whip; just by being creative with your one flogger.  Different strokes offer different sensations as well.  Spritzing the back of your victim, with water,  then flog them dry also creates a different sensation.
 
At times I flog with lace gloves.  So, I use mainly wood handled floggers, as they move smoothly in gloved hands with little soiling.  Leather handled floggers go well with bare hands.  On a good day, I can hold three (3) floggers in each hand, putting a total of 6 floggers in action.  Arthritis is getting the best of me, so most times I have 2 in each hand with a total of 4, or standard one in each hand to do Florentine style.
 
Technique really is a important element, as to swing the flogger with as little effort as possible.  The ideal way to manage floggers, is let them do the work for you.  You send the flogger with the energy and follow through once it strikes the target. 
 
I look at floggers that do not have their tails flail outwards like a person sticking their finger in a electrical socket.  The tails should stay as close together as much as possible, sometimes you have to roll the flogger to find that spot.  However, a good flogger will stay together no matter where it is handled from.  I would avoid dead leather, which is stiff, dry, cracks when it is bent hard, like making a loop around the little finger or nail.  Holding the flogger still where the tails dangle, look to see if they are hanging even and not one or two lower than the rest.  Caress the tails--the leather should feel alive, soft and supple. 
 
My personal preference for floggers, is one that I can place my hand over the victim's neck, as they face the cross, that my hip is in line with the victim's hip, and be able to take my whip hand and come across my chest and strike the back without the tips of the tails of a flogger to 'wrap' or go beyond the "infraspinatus muscle" or around the rib cage/under arm area.
 
Small floggers, in my opinion, cause bad habits if attempting to use them as full size floggers.  It causes people flogging to swing their shoulders and arms wider and wildly to compensate the tail length.  Floggers that are 12 inches or less are for close in whip work. 
 
Floggers, which are multi-lash whips belong to the lash group, out of seven known whip groups.  Scourge group carries such whips like cat o nine tails, braided knots, blood knots, Roman flail, and or those that can cause damage.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/16/2006 8:13:24 PM   
LadyHugs


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Dear wanta247, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Here is an excerpt from a "Whips" presentation handout authored by me and copyrighted.  This may help;
 
"...
The softest to the heaviest leather are as follows:
Deer Suede which is rough out or has texture on both sides of the lashes, that feel very soft to the touch and with weight. The impact in the beginning is of thud and soft, yet when the skin is warmed and highly sensitive it acts as an abrasive as texture becomes amplified.
 
Cow Suede is the next level up in the suede department, which again is a thud like whip, with rough textured lashes on both sides of each lash, that is a bit heavier then deer suede flogger, but is very small in recognition as to the increase of weight and stiffness.
 
This whip leather acts nearly identical to the deer suede, as it feels soft to a slave’s skin at first but turns abrasive when the skin is warmed and sensitivity is amplified.

Deer
is one of the most common and most sold type flogger leather in the leather community in general. Noted for its softness and flexibility, this leather is smooth on both sides of the lashes or tails, and also is not as heavy weighted as the suede leather.
 
Impact is gentle and smooth, relaxing and to the slave is relaxing and feels as if a massage is taking place.
 
Masters placing their strikes with more intensity will hear the strike of the deer flogger become louder but, the damage is still not high but, the noise is enough to shake up beginners watching on the side line as a Master can appear to be beating the slave to death.
 
This leather is a “must have” in a Master’s collection as it is great for warm ups and preparing the skin.
 
Lamb is the next softest leather and depending on how it is processed can be equal to deer.
 
New or Nubuck Lamb again is soft and can come in either rough tails or smooth depending on the vendor that makes these whips.
Soft and pleasurable to the slave, this whip is a nice leather and if a slave is sensitive, he or she can feel the difference in the slight heavier weight of the Lamb tails and the impact noise is different s well.
 
Goat, which is a bit stiffer than the lamb leather, still is very soft and usually sold in smooth tailed, finishes.
 
The slight increase in texture and stiffness is not enough to make a huge difference yet; the slave can feel it for sure.
 
Elk, which is a type of deer, has a heavier texture and weight to the lashes of the whip. Still smooth tails but, again enough for a slave to feel the slight difference in the degree of impact and sound of the whip’s leather.
 
Moose leather is more game then deer, has a thicker hide and thus it is just a small measure heavier then elk and goat.
 
Soft on both sides of the lashes, this whip leather provides a nice step from the very soft side of leathers such as suede and deer, to the lower intermediate weight leather.
 
Cow which is usually the female hide of the bovine family, has less toughness then a bull’s hide and is a nice intermediate weight leather which is processed in two divisions. Soft cow and Heavy Cow.
 
Soft cow is processed in a way, which it is flexible, and less weight then heavy cow.
 
The impact capability is intermediate and for frail players such as beginners, those ill and lack muscle tone and stamina, this leather is usually as far as most female slaves can go, unless they are masochistic or leathered, meaning seasoned and in playing shape.
 
Heavy cow, is heavier and under the Bull as far as weight, impact and thickness.
 
Heavy cow also is sold in smooth leather and can be often mistaken for a soft bull. However, heavy cow would be considered to be on the up scale of intermediate weight whips.
 
Bull is the second most available leather for the multiple tail whips. The weight is heavier, the impact measures heavier even when the dominant swings it at a light stroke.
 
Sold mostly with smooth leather, this leather is usually best worked on well-warmed up individuals with increasing impact strokes in a slow and measured increase and watching the body language.
 
Bull adds a lot of power into a stroke and often looks deceiving to the individual swinging the bull leather whip and a man can actually with little effort, can detach breasts and buttocks if a down stroke is struck on a already weakened tissue connection.
 
It is recommended that bull leather be saved for the back and buttocks but no location that has soft tissue such as breasts, penis and or balls.
 
Buffalo is a heavy leather, which is not as common to find as Bull but, offers like bull, heavy weight and heavy impact.
 
The tails are processed normally smooth on both sides of the lashes and depending on how the hide is processed can be thin or thick hide, which will make a difference on the impact ability.

Rawhide is usually found in the belt leather or craft shops, and is thick and heavy with a lot of bite to it.
 
Processed from the bovine, the rawhide is usually not dyed to a color and is very stiff.
 
The tails if thick will produce a thud but, again with bite due to the weight and edges of the lashes. If thin, such as with bootlaces, will mark easy and be extremely stinging and more times then not, leave welts.
 
Latigo leather is also similar to rawhide.  Usually found in saddles and other western items.
 
Rubber tails or lashes are also found. Most times either as bungee cord or flat rubber lashes.
 
Flat lashes are more thud then the round bungee cord type lash but, regardless of the lash, they will sting more than leather.
 
Rubber is great for those into blood sports or will want to cause marks. Because rubber can be sanitized after use without damage to the tails or lashes. This holds true with the chain or other man made materials that are selected as the lashes.
 
End of excerpt.
Beginning of excerpt from "Whip Tips" ...
The second area to which the author and presenter wishes to address, is the labels of the amount of the leather or tails which touch the body.
 
A “finger” is a point of impact and it can also be called “a touch.” This means the whip barely touches, barely brushing the skin or light pressure on the skin.
 
A “hand” is approximately three inches of the leather tips impacting the skin.
 
“Two hands” is approximately six inches of leather tips impacting on the skin.
 
Dominants should attempt to use no more than a finger touch upon the skin of the slave using a single tail.
 
For floggers, crops, whips with a cracker on a shaft, such as a dressage whip, riding whip, quirt and floggers, there should be only a “hand” of leather upon the slave’s skin.
 
Anybody using more than “two hands” of leather tips on the skin, should be doing so for a more slap effect than a brush effect by using a “hand’s “ worth of leather. This would be most likely the forehand and backhand stroke of the flogger and some other strokes.
 
The sensation of a variety of the tips hitting upon the body, will give a
smorgasbord of sensations, which causes the slave to focus on what may come next, rather than expect a routine.
 
The dominant, once confident in the accuracy of their whip placement into the target area, then can work on “stoke styles” with the multiple tail whip, such as a flogger, a cat-o-nine tails or single tails.
End of excerpt. (Copyrighted by Lady Hugs)









Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/16/2006 11:15:13 PM   
cacodylic


Posts: 157
Joined: 3/6/2005
From: CA
Status: offline
 
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHugs
Floggers, which are multi-lash whips belong to the lash group, out of seven known whip groups.  Scourge group carries such whips like cat o nine tails, braided knots, blood knots, Roman flail, and or those that can cause damage.

Dear LadyHugs, Thanks for the highly informative posts. I'm curious as to what the other five whip groups are.

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RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 10:33:55 AM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
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Dear cacodylic, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Here you go!  (Lengthy but it is from a presentation on Whips)
Excerpt...
The Seven Groups

In defining the seven groups of whips we will find that some will often cross over into other groups. This is largely due to how the whip is made and the injury factors involved.
 
When using the defined whip groups, be aware that not all in the leather community closely keep to the formal definitions and often will mean the same thing but call something by a different name or description. This being normal, it really is not necessary to embroil ourselves in debate.
 
The main thing in the leather community is to use all our whips and rods in a safe manner, to maintain them in good condition, to keep them clean as well as to sanitize them between use on others.
 
Crop Group
is the group to which is rather self explanatory, as the horseback riding crop that is found in the tack shop is in it’s own class.
 
A riding crop is defined as a shaft that is fitted with a handle that flows into a tapered shaft and ends with a flap or loop of leather, a leather design such as a little hand or butterfly as to slap the horse with.
 
When selecting a riding crop, since the purpose is to hit the naked body of a human and not a horse, is to make sure the shaft does not go past the loop in it’s construction. Cheap crops will be poorly made as well as have sharp points concealed at the tip.
 
Lash Group
has the most whips that the BDSM community uses. The Lash Group is made up of floggers, multiple tailed whips, cat-o-nines, quirts, riding whips with a cracker also known as a popper, dressage whips, cart and buggy whips, single tails, signal whips, snake whips, bull whips or any whip that has one or more lashes, crackers or poppers.
 
As those to who do not have horses or know horse equipment often confuse it, a riding whip is often confused with the crop. However, there is a great difference.
 
Unlike a crop, the riding whip is a handle, tapered shaft into a round nylon or rolled horsehair cracker. There is no flap or folds of leather what so ever.
 

Another characteristic of the riding whip is that its length is slightly longer then the crop.
 
The crop is to be used behind the leg of the rider or on the rump, to create a slap rather then a sting, as a riding whip would cause. So in summary, a riding crop is a thud and a riding whip is a sting.
 
The dressage whip, which is a riding whip, is even longer in the shaft as to permit the rider to reach back to the hind quarters and tap as to drive the horse under themselves, as to collect and be able to gather themselves to create movements much like those seen by the famous Spanish Riding Horses of Austria and other movements characteristic of the ancient war horse.
 
The cart whip is often misidentified, as dealers in horse equipment have few that need cart whips and often sell dressage whips as cart whips. However, the true cart whip has a thicker handle and shaft into a taper with a fall that goes into the cracker or popper, and is to be able to reach from the cart seat to the withers or shoulder of the horse.
 
The buggy whip is also another misidentified whip by those in tack shops. Tack shops will pass dressage whips as buggy whips or cart whips however a true buggy whip is about six feet in length with a long cracker or popper as the buggy places the horse further away from the driver and groom.
 
The carriage whip or lounging whip, which are approximately six to ten feet in length with the fall equal to the shaft’s measurement and with a cracker or popper on the end.
 
Please note, that the riding whips and driving whips are really not to be used on the horse’s body itself with any impact unless it is to give pain the horse in a case of crisis or panic as to have the horse focus on the whip and not what is frightening them. In riding and driving horses, a mere touch is most often the most contact a horse will need to send it rapidly forward.
 
Flogger is what is properly termed as a person to who whips a person but in modern times it is to identify a multiple tailed whip, made with a variety of materials such as leather and rubber.
 
In the selection of the multiple tail whip or flogger, the individual must understand the characteristics of each type leather used as well as to understand how wide or thick the lash is determines the thud or sting sensation. Just as important, is the number of lashes creates thud or sting.
 
The cat-o-nine, is a whip that has only nine lashes or tails. The cat-o-nine was originally made with hemp rope which scratches, with barbs or other sharp objects as to slice open the back of the individual that was being beaten.
 
Today’s cat-o-nine is very muted from the original but, in some cases can be crossed over into the scourge group, based on how severe the injury risks can be or risks of drawing blood.
 
Majorities of the cat-o-nine flails or whips are made in braided leather, sometimes without knots and some with knots. Some cat-o-nines are made with flat braids with or without knots.
 
Round braids will be more sting then the flat braided whips to which have more thud.
 
The quirt is rooted in the horseback riding arena, and found mostly in Australia, South America and southern regions of the United States, or locations that have a lot of brush or brambles.
 
The origin of the quirt came as a shaft riding whip would often be entangled in the brush and was more of a nuisance. In making a miniature of a bullwhip’s body, adding two lashes to it, the quirt became a handy whip as it could be hung off the saddle horn or around the wrist of the rider to move the horse forward.
 
For those to whom are not comfortable using single tails, to pull back one of the two lashes and make only one lash available to strike with is technically a single tail or single lash.
 
Further, it should be noted that the quirt with one lash might often leave marks more familiar to single tails then a quirt. And, the quirt is a favorite among those who have to work in small places where single tails are too bulky.
 

Rod Group
is the second most used group by BDSM individuals. This group classifications cover canes, rods, batons, riot sticks, poles, shafts or any like item. Absent from this group are switches, as they have their own group.
 
Often there is confusion as to what the difference between a rod and cane. So, in short the BDSM criterion is a rod is stiff with no flexibility or a small measure of flexibility and often thick in diameter.
 
The cane on the other hand, is smaller diameter and ranges from extremely flexible to barely flexible.

Natural canes consist of rattan, which is a hardy and most
accessible material for the majority of people in the leather community. The rattan cane can be finished in water based Polyurethane or in raw linseed oil.
 
Another natural cane is bamboo, which requires the most maintained as it has to be kept moist in salt water and no oils or Polyurethane or sealant will work to keep it supple.
 
Bamboo being hollow in the middle also has a different vibration to it and isn’t strong for extreme heavy caning.
 
In harvesting bamboo, the stem needs to be cut as to allow the knot area to be where it is the tip and the length determined by its cutting to the other joint or know found in the stalk.

The third natural cane is Birch. A Birch cane isn’t to be confused with a Birch switch. Birch can be commonly found among the trees in the majority of nations and in many parts of the country.
 
The Yew, which is another natural wood cane, has been in ancient times the most sought after wood due to its natural flexibility and often found in archery bows.
 
Again the Yew is the lesser-known natural cane as it is not commonly harvested and process and more rare so, than the Birch cane.
 
In care of the natural fiber cane, the ideal way to store a cane is by suspending it from a hook and not on the side or in a box in which it is supported by one end. However, if circumstances are such as there is no other way to store a cane, placing the handle on the bottom is the wise thing to do.
 
In selecting a fiber cane, such as rattan, the Master should select it by the type of diameter and intent the cane will be used for. Then, select the length as the longer the cane is the more variety of ways a Master can use it as well as it has more flexibility. Shorter canes will not have the same energy as a longer cane and thus also cheats a Master out of the necessary energy.
 
The next step in the selection process is looking at the natural fiber itself. If it is raw or coated, the fiber can be seen and what is not desired in the cane is what is known as a “coke bottle twist” or as if somebody was wringing out a wash cloth. This twist weakens the cane and will separate and can fracture under stress.
 
Often times, vendors will hide this twist under the handle, as it is not under impact stress. However if it is anywhere in the body of the cane, this twist will fail in time.
 
Bows in the cane are not as much as a problem. Often times when a cane is sold it is straight and then a bow comes forth. This can be for several reasons.
 

One, the cane is struck only on the one area and not twisted or rotated at each stroke to wear on all sides. Or, the cane was steamed and processed into being straight and then the cane relaxes into its natural state in time.
 
Now, addressing man made materials as canes and rods.
Plexiglas is a nice hard material and often found in curtain rod handles, walking canes, table legs and a host of variety of uses just as Lucite is.
 
The thinner the diameter the more sting it will create and if too thin, it will shatter.
 
Carbon is another man made material, to which can be found in arrow shafts and will shatter if harshly used however, the author has yet to have one shatter.
 
Aluminum is another wonderful material in which can be found in arrow shafts and keeping the point or tip of the arrow off, is safe to use and can be sanitized as carbon, Plexiglas and Lucite can.
 
Rubber is another element of which can be used and is found on the African riot cane, in which it is available for purchase in most countries however, with caution. This African riot cane is called a Sjombok (there are several spellings)and was designed to break bones and disable people.
 
Delran and Lexan are two other materials used in canes.
 
Metal, such as in coat hangers are very thin and will sting a lot. A metal covering that is flexible and retards the sting a lot as it adds more diameters often coats these thin metals.
 
Dipping canes in things like tool dip or rubbery coatings and then add texture is another great way to making something different and with different sensations.
 
In selecting dipping elements please make sure that it is a product that is meant to be in contact with humans. And, also know that there are individuals to whom have allergies to latex, rubber, vinyl and jelly type substances found in adult toys. Again, pre-scene negotiations are
extremely important.
 
With the extremely popular rose bush and thorns, this really would be best classified in the switch group or scourge group due to its injury risk factor
 
In using the rose cane with thorns, it must be a one-person contact toy and dedicated, as drawing blood will happen.
 
It is most unfair to use such toys after drawing blood on one slave to apply it to another slave’s body. Please be health minded and considerate.
 
Scourge Group can be best classified as those whips and rods that will by its nature cause deep and profound injuries as well as risks are more than the muted whips and canes normally found within the BDSM scene.
 
These whips and rods are usually involved in blood sports or blood play, and should be dedicated if unable to properly sterilize the whip or rod. This is why man made materials are a plus as they can be exposed to high temperatures as to kill germs and bacteria.
 
Scourges can be such as a Roman flail, which is a three-thong whip with barbs on the end. This is what was applied to Jesus Christ in the days of Roman rule.
 
Barbed whips, crackers and poppers, some cat-o-nines with blood knots or beads made of metal or glass, chain such as motorcycle drive chain or bike chain and so forth.
 
Switches that have thorns or knots left on the shaft, such as rose bush canes and switches, unfinished switches and canes, canes or rods that have exposed tips or tacks as well as spikes.
 
Strap Group covers such things as belts, razor straps, folded leather, taws, vipers, reins, spur straps and bootlaces.
 
In using the strap, the impact can be as severe as a cane full force and is deceptively damaging.
 
Belts if used, should be smooth edged, without decoration as to dig into the skin such as spikes, metal decorations, fake gems, buckles, chains or metal tips.
 
Razor straps are usually firm and don’t flex as much as belts but they are heavy and do have a deep impact. These razor straps often come
in a paddle like form with handles.
 
Folded leather is not as severe as a razor strap, but can be often identified with paddles as well as most in the strap group.
Taws or vipers have leather as a basis but are split as to make fingers. The viper has two fingers, the Scottish Taws are three fingers and there are five finger taws.
 
Taws and vipers can be used as a paddle as well as being as a strap can slice through on a down stroke and using it’s edges can mark and feel as if a cane struck them as in Middle Eastern style of caning.
 
Horse bridle reins, if braided shouldn’t be used but, if they are plain and without buckles or connections, are straps that will deliver a sharp and painful slap. It is recommended that western reins are purchased as they are often in lengths and a variety of widths and only have connectors to the bit on one side and without buckles as normally found on English reins.
 
Spur straps are tiny compared to the riding reins and are small enough to apply to breasts, genitals and make great practice targets for a Master to aim at in the use of his single tail.
 
Shoe laces, in which leather laces are always the best, can provide thin and extremely stingy sensations, which produces welts.
 
A good amount of laces together would then go into the scourge group or lash group as they become a multi tailed whip.
 
Switch Group
is best described as the flexible branch off trees or bushes.
 
Rose bushes provide switches with thorns or the thorns can be cut off and the switch smoothed prior to application.
 
Other switches can be found in Birch trees, Yew trees, and fruit trees with the exception of citrus fruit trees, Pussy willow trees and young green saplings as long as they do not have sap or pitch as pine or other wood or bushes may have.
 
Tether Group addresses those whips that are made from chain, rope or nylon.
 
In chains, the chain that is used for belts or purse straps as well as the ball chain in which usually is found around necks holding identification cards or photos can be used as floggers if in the proper amount and filed edges as not to dig or rip the skin.
 
Rope can be braided as well as knotted but, most rope whips are usually made as to be light and feathered, and a very sensual tool.
 
Nylon strapped whips are harsh and do not have the softness of rope and yet can be more severe then a chain whip due to the fiber itself. Thus, nylon is best left for webbing or suspension harnesses and bondage support as nylon will dig and cause the flesh to burn if it is allowed to rub a slave’s skin.

End of excerpt.
(Copyrighted by Lady Hugs)

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to cacodylic)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 11:36:04 AM   
Bearlee


Posts: 2311
Joined: 10/25/2004
From: South Central CO
Status: offline
 
Here is a favorite place of mine:  http://www.heartwoodwhips.com/
 
In addition to having absolutely beautiful floggers there, click and read "Passion for Whips" at the bottom of the front page for a wealth of information regarding floggers in general, including care, etc.
 
Have fun,
bear

(in reply to LadyHugs)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 6:01:44 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
Dear Bearlee, Ladies and Gentlemen;

Yes, that is a good site.  Lori Dwinelle is Proprietrix of www.heartwoodwhips.com and www.toybag.com ; I look like one of her booths as I have about one of everything she's sold in the mid 1990s.  LOL

Mention Hugs and she'll know who you're talking about.  (One reason why I need a trailer for my toy bags-chuckles)

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to Bearlee)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 6:26:56 PM   
cacodylic


Posts: 157
Joined: 3/6/2005
From: CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHugs

Dear cacodylic, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
Here you go!  (Lengthy but it is from a presentation on Whips)
Excerpt...
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

Dear LadyHugs,
Gratefully accepted!
Thanks

(in reply to LadyHugs)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 7:43:03 PM   
undergroundsea


Posts: 2400
Joined: 6/27/2004
From: Austin, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Viper001
Features to look for in quality: a solid bundle of falls attached to the handle, cheaper floggers have a large vacancy in the center where the dowel is visible. Tight braiding on the handle. Solid, tight button knots. Balanced with the balance point approximately 1.5" behind the the fall.


I am posting to both bookmark this thread and to say I appreciate the information posted in this thread. Is the significance of the balance point to provide an ergonomical flogger that does not create stress or injury for the wrist and arm?

Cheers,

Sea

(in reply to Viper001)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/17/2006 9:43:03 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
Dear undergroundsea, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
In the old days, when we made our own floggers, we took the handle and then took the leather we were going to cut into tails and bind it with string or rubber band, then take it to an edge of a kitchen chair (wood one with a straight back or a board), then add fishing weight on the end of the handle until it hung balanced, as if an even scale.  Some folks use sand but, regardless of how you weight the flogger, it was ideal if you could balance it on the side of your index finger if it was held straight on the vertical.
quote:

ORIGINAL: undergroundsea

quote:

ORIGINAL: Viper001
Features to look for in quality: a solid bundle of falls attached to the handle, cheaper floggers have a large vacancy in the center where the dowel is visible. Tight braiding on the handle. Solid, tight button knots. Balanced with the balance point approximately 1.5" behind the the fall.


I am posting to both bookmark this thread and to say I appreciate the information posted in this thread. Is the significance of the balance point to provide an ergonomical flogger that does not create stress or injury for the wrist and arm?

Cheers,

Sea


I also have a belief, that when people push the flogger into motion or drag it faster than the energy flows through it, it puts stress on the dominant's body joints.  I see so many people get tennis elbow and rotator cuff injuries and blame it on flogging.

When you have a balanced flogger you can hold it with a loose grip, which won't tense the muscles all the way from hand to shoulder and neck.  Those floggers which are heavy in the tails and fall forward, is when you move your hand further back to the end of the flogger's handle.  Such floggers are called 'muzzle heavy.'  Most floggers will be in such balance as to be heavy where the tails/braids/lashes are.  Sliding the hand back will balance it better. 

Another trick of the trade per se, is before flogging--take a long cane and do a figure 8 on the victim's back.  You'll find that it takes very little movement to keep within the target area.  If you wish to do heavy strokes, do it from the waist and follow through but, don't power just from the arm and shoulder.

Reason why I do like Toy Bag wood handled floggers, is the butt end of the flogger is a round ball like shape.  It acts much like a joint and rocks in between my fingers and why I can hold 3 floggers in each hand on a good day (when arthritis isn't tearing me up).  Letting it swing free in my fingers, like a craddle or claw, I let the weight of the flogger do the work, not change my technique.  I get weaker, I go to a heavier flogger.  If my arm/hand gets tired, I change to another tool entirely, as to refresh my stamina.

Hope this is of assistance.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to undergroundsea)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/19/2006 5:31:32 AM   
cynthiamarie


Posts: 205
Joined: 3/11/2005
From: Bluefield, WV, USA
Status: offline
Hm, since good advice is being given here on floggers, I'd like to put my problem on the table.

I like many types, including ribbon floggers.  The colors splashing all over the body does something to me, and they're nice for warm up.  I've knotted the ends off, as they tend to unravel.  Others have sold ribbon floggers that had the ends melted, but I worried about sharp edges and didn't want to leave any accidental cuts, same went for dipping the ends in something like fabric glue...I don't think it's practical anyway, as there are hundreds of ends.  I haven't had problems with the knots, until today.  I test them on myself first and look them over.  Some time after 100 strikes, one slightly thicker, stiffer ribbon gave me problems.  This is the same brand I always use, Offray, but there is a variation in the thickness and stiffness sometimes.  I had over a dozen of the knotted ends slide off over the edge. 

It takes me at least 3 hours to knot off all the hundreds of ends, and I make them 1/4 inch to 1/3 inch from the end, then unravel if I can and snip the loose threads.  I have them color coded for use on different bottoms

Does anyone know if melted ends have sharp edges that cut, or am I being too paranoid?  Latex tipping the ends would be lovely, but since there are so many I don't think that drying each strand out would be practical.  I've been considering Crazy Glue dotted onto each knot :( 

This one in two shades of blue is so beautiful it would be worth the extra hassle, but before I begin (I have two in blues, one around 2 ft long and the other around 16 inches), I'd like to hear advice from others.

Also, I know some vegetarians, and thought it would be nice to flog them with things other than leather...someone I know suggested using ultrasuede, and said that it has varying degrees of thickness.  Has anyone else tried this?  I've found a substitute for bunny fur that feels lovely, so that's good.

Thank you, LadyHugs.  Your teachings are very much appreciated.  *Makes plans to buy more fishing weights.*



edited to add that I have made all kinds of rubber ones and they're okay.  I wish I could make fancier handles, but the electrical tape around the wooden jump rope handles are working fine so far.  Over the winter, I might whittle out a dragon or something onto a handle and put green gems in for eyes.  I'll have to be really bored and snowed in for that, lol.  I do like beautiful things though, and I'm glad to hear that making over 40 something floggers for my own use already is not really excessive.


< Message edited by cynthiamarie -- 9/19/2006 5:38:06 AM >

(in reply to LadyHugs)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: What to look for in a flogger - 9/19/2006 2:15:16 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
Dear cynthiamarie, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I am curious if you are using actual ribbon, as in material/silk ribbon as flogger tail shafts.  If this is the case, most times the ends were folded back and hemmed.  Never used knots unless you wanted to have that sensation.  Some ribbon floggers of the past have had wooden beads, as plastic and glass beads, similar to African-American hair bead kits offer.  Some ribbon choices have a bit of nylon in them so, a bit of open flame to singe it has worked.  I have also seen 'mustache wax' used on tips, as it clings better to fiber or hair like materials and aren't hard as candle wax.
 
If you use tips on the ends of the flogger tails, it may indeed injure if they are sharp.  Sometimes you have to polish with steel wool to get the rough edges on stainless steel tips off.  Bolo tie tips are another option for some makers, that wish metal tips on their braided cat o nines.
 
As far as non leather products go, material suede makes a great flogger and ranges in an impact area of cow-bull.  Rubber is also an option, look for rubber backing material at your fabric store.  I've also seen ribbon and lace floggers made, some that are tipped with silk flowers and some that are not.  Material/fabric stores often carry fake leather and look at the choices they do have.  Velvet is another nice flogging material for sensation that is similar to rabbit.  As well as some fabric stores do sell fake fur.  Edge cords to sofa's and slip covers are contained fibers much like rope but, have fine criss-cross stitch to keep it 'finished' and 'enclosed' while it is fed through the material.  May want to look at upolstery supply and or talk to a craftsman.  Slippery materials, you may wish to sew the knots in if braiding won't hold.  Some people use instead of tips and knots, buttons but, I would be careful in using them.  Wool is another fabric option to create a flogger.  It is scratchy at times and if you get it wet it provides a deep hard impact.
 
Handles can be made from dowels, hammer handles (without the head), 3/4 of a police baton, hollow tube of plastic, bike handlebar grips, nice pieces of driftwood or hardwoods debarked and sanded down, like cherry, oak, maple, etc.
 
Let your creative juices flow sweet lady.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 
 

(in reply to cynthiamarie)
Profile   Post #: 20
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