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What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 9:43:02 AM   
kyakitten


Posts: 145
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline 		Hi folks,

A little while back I met a new dom who considers himself strict and when I could tell if I was pleasing him doing so really turned me on, pretty much regardless of the activity. But when our training started to go to the "next level" wherein he withheld feedback other than direction, I didn't get turned on by serving him (hence I was told I wasn't really a sub.)

This has led me to think that maybe I have a fetish to please, rather than to serve per se. From what I've read it seems like this isn't universal - that some subs get turned on by negative or no feedback. Are there other subs out there who are "pleasers", or conversely, any who only want negative feedback? What's your motivation for submitting?




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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 9:57:25 AM   
strongnsubmissiv


Posts: 197
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		I think i'm like you kya, our motivations are the same.

Feedback is an integral part of a D/s relationship that i NEED to feel fulfilled. The fact that i do have needs doesn't make me any less of a sub, it makes me human. What i strive for is positive feedback, but negative feedback can be very constructive and is well accepted.

Regardless of context or orientation, any relationship that is one sided is doomed.

sns

_____________________________

*** Strong and submissive are not contradictions ***

(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 9:59:55 AM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline 		I think feedback, whether positive or negative is very important. I love being praised by my Master. I also need the negative feedback so i can strive to do better. Thirty-five years ago i wrote a master's thesis on feedback. It was for a physical task but the experiments i ran showed overwhelmingly that the subjects performed much better when given feedback.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 10:30:07 AM   
liltxsubby


Posts: 328
Joined: 11/18/2004
From: TX
Status: offline 		i also thrive on positive feedback. without it, what's the point of trying so hard to be good? although the bratty side does at times tend to show, at which times negative feedback is needed, else i think i can get away with it which strangely enough does not make me happy.

(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 10:55:40 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
I truely believe (for myself) that to serve is something I do because I enjoy giving. It isnt the knowing I have pleased but knowing that I have done my utmost for Another. Not out of love or the desire to be needed or for verification... but because it is what I am. I serve to offer my respect. Does the person have to earn my respect for me to serve them? Not at all, as I truely feel that such a concept is selfish in its conception.(IMO)
If a person allows me to be released in my servitude, then I am grateful to them.

_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 11:05:58 AM   
taewakan


Posts: 4
Joined: 1/6/2005
Status: offline 		Kyakitten,
It sounds to me like you hooked up with a follower of the "one true way" school of bdsm. From what I have seen, the sub-dom relationship can be like pieces of a puzzle. Get over him. Move on. Life is too short to spend chasing someone else's definitions of your personality type.
Good luck!
taewakan


_____________________________

Patience is the art of timing

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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 11:06:00 AM   
darlyn


Posts: 24
Status: offline 		most of my kink is wrapped up in the dominance of the act, less than the feedback... Although feedback is important to me, it isn't part of my kink... Luckily, my Master is a great communicator and i get the best of both worlds *smiles* so, to answer the point question of what is my motivation for submitting - to feel the Domination of my Master in the most mental and physical sense.

_____________________________

~darlyn~

"Nurturing the mind is just as important as pushing the limits of the body." ~ Master of my Destiny

(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 11:19:16 AM   
Quivver


Posts: 1953
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline
My Motivation to serve is just a part of me, I serve my children, my coworkers and friends to the best of my ability. They usually respond with some sort of feed back, be it a smile or a thank you, in which I'd prefer the Smile. It gets more complicated with a Dom, at least for me. Although now and then I play online, it's not tangible to me. So my thoughts only come from what I *think* will work for me. For it to be real life, real time, my deepest emotions will be raw to begin. Feed back will be imperative to my progression, be it positive or negative.
I'm afraid if given none I would find myself hiding, licking my wounds. To be Ignored, is to be Invisible, both equaling to *i* was not enough. If that happens
rebuilding would be much more of a task.
just my . 02

_____________________________

The problem with communication ... is the illusion that it has been accomplished. ~George Bernard Shaw

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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 9:12:25 PM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		kya,
We are all differnet individuals. There is no one true way. I would'nt let one person's opinion mold me. Yeah, if it was someone I cared about. I'd do a bit of soul searching. Would it change me? Doubtful.
I'd have to agree with the person who said get over him. Move on.

As far as why I submit. I honestly do not know. I have 100% trust in my Dom. I do love pleasing him. What is the difference pleasing vs service? It sort of in my mind is the same.
I do absolutely anything and everything he asks of me. Why, because I trust him no harm will come to me.
Over the past week there have been several threads here on control. For me there is no such thing in my mind as giving up control. Its all about trust. If I trust, I will do anything.
So, is there such a thing as a trusting submissive? I don't really know.
In my personal life, assuming I had no Dom. I strive for excellence. I will challenge most anyone on anything. Yet, when it comes to my Dom, I won't even try.
I do think it can also be a fetish. Our fetish's excite us. So, I do believe one could have a fetish to serve. Not sure if that is me.
I'd have to think on it much more before I could give concrete answers.
I think you will have the answer yourself when you find the right person for you to serve.


(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/9/2005 9:35:45 PM   
ravenna


Posts: 121
Joined: 12/22/2004
Status: offline 		Desire, desire, desire. For me desire is everything, it's my blood and breath, it's life itself, it's the reason for everything i do, and it's certainly the ultimate ground for my submission to my owner. It's as if my Owner says, perhaps not in so many words, perhaps only with his body or his deeds, "My desire for you is so great that I must take away your freedom in order to possess you utterly," and my response from deep in my gut is, "My desire for you is so great that i willingly surrender my freedom to be utterly yours." On any given day or night i may find myself submitting out of love, friendship, habit, ritual, or simply because i am compelled by superior strength or the force of His dominant personality, but underneath it all, and constantly renewed (i hope) is Desire...

(in reply to sub4hire)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 11:25:31 AM   
colonicegirl17


Posts: 14
Joined: 1/12/2005
Status: offline 		i don't serve to get off or anything like that. i serve my Master because in obeying it helps my self esteme and helps me build self confidence. when i don't obey it's because i have good reason to aka i'm uncomfertable or it will hurt me. but again this is my opinion and my experience.

(in reply to ravenna)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 12:52:30 PM   
nella


Posts: 1243
Joined: 12/30/2004
From: Norway
Status: offline 		i have no idea why i submitt, it seam strange and not logical to me, but it is my desire and i feel better aboute myself when i do so.

(in reply to colonicegirl17)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 1:41:23 PM   
Submikro


Posts: 8
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		i think most people like feedback, it's only human to want to know you've made someone happy. if i encounter any sort of "gratitude problem" i honestly would feel like i'm wasting my time. But that not just D/s, that's every part of life for me. i'm not saying i should be rewarded, i just want to be acknowledged

i don't have to be submissive, but its something i'm very willing to be. its a gift. You don't have to give people gifts, you give them because you want to bring people joy. if they can't be appreciative, then the gift is wasted on them.

How that appreciation is communicated depends on your kink, i suppose, but dead air communicates apathy.

as for why i'm submissive... i think it all boils down to what the world expects of me as a man. To be the master of my domain, control of every aspect of my life. Every "i" dotted and "t" crossed, things like that.

i look back at college and remember all the fun i had serving, helping and bringing joy to others, even when i didn't have to do it. i felt more whole and skilled when i was serving than when i tried to be in complete control. This also made many women i knew happy especially, since they were the dominant presence in those student groups and i saved them some work.

i suppose that's why i'm here now, now i'm looking for a Domme to bring joy to :)

(in reply to nella)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 2:37:23 PM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline 		As taewakan and sub4hire have pointed out, this is a fairly complex issue. There are as many motivations for submitting as there are submissives. For myself, I recieve a great deal of gratification from positive feedback. More than sex, more than playtime, when I submit I need to know that I have done well. Not getting that reward will cause me to burn out in short order. If I get that fix on a regular basis from a person I adore, I become willing to do or give damn near anything, even if I know for a fact that it is a really bad mistake.

It actually took me a while to realise that I like pain. Nearly five or six years, maybe more. To begin with, enduring or suffering at the whim of my top was a way to please or impress them, which then became the means by which I recieved praise and attention. That ultimate reward was so much more important to me that it overwhelmed any incedental pleasure gotten from the play itself.

This is, in all likelihood, far more extreme than your own case, but I offer it as an example of a possible extreme along the same basic emotional axis that you have described. On the other end are those people who need a stern, repressive, or uncommunicative dominant. These people who need the emotionally supportive father-figure they have been trying to impress their entire life, or who need the unrelenting schoolmaster who expects nothing but perfection, or even the overwhelming drill sergeant who offers nothing but abuse and expects it to feul your performance to greater heights.

I can't do that. Abuse for it's own sake does nothing but piss me off, in a bad way. Cold, stern, or repressive just reinforces the nasty little voices in my head that I spend most of my life trying to escape from. Eventually I shut down, unable to deal with the crawling pile of maggots inside my own skull. I suppose the right dominant could use these parts of my personality in a scene (anything is possible, after all), but so far I haven't met them, and they'd by golly better warn me before hand if that's what they plan to do. Emotional landmines ahoy!

Okay, before I start slinking around doing my best gollum impersonation, maybe I should get back to the point I was trying to make. This is a different end of the same spectrum. Some folks dig it. Your former top apparantly associates this sort of behavior with "twue submittive" behavior. It's a load of feldercarp. Like nearly everyone else has said - move on, find someone who's right for you. Just like how not every sub has the same needs and motivations that you have, not every dom is going to have the same needs as him. The trick - and this is a kind of hard one to get right, but well worth the effort to keep trying - is to find someone whose need as dominant matches your need as submissive, and possibly vice versa.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to kyakitten)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 9:45:02 PM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I can't do that. Abuse for it's own sake does nothing but piss me off, in a bad way. Cold, stern, or repressive just reinforces the nasty little voices in my head that I spend most of my life trying to escape from. Eventually I shut down, unable to deal with the crawling pile of maggots inside my own skull. I suppose the right dominant could use these parts of my personality in a scene (anything is possible, after all), but so far I haven't met them, and they'd by golly better warn me before hand if that's what they plan to do. Emotional landmines ahoy!


Suleiman I know exactly where you are coming from with this statement.
I have to ask. When you shut down, if the Dominant realizes they stepped over that imaginary wall so to speak and tries to give you aftercare, do you accept it or push it off?

(in reply to Suleiman)
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RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/13/2005 11:09:01 PM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sub4hire

Suleiman I know exactly where you are coming from with this statement.
I have to ask. When you shut down, if the Dominant realizes they stepped over that imaginary wall so to speak and tries to give you aftercare, do you accept it or push it off?



Depends on how far into the pit I've gone, and whether they've crossed the line before. Eventually I conclude that it is not healthy for me to remain within the relationship, if that boundary is pushed too often. If it's only happened a few times, then usually I bounce back pretty quickly with aftercare. I think I pushed off the aftercare the first few times, but that praise thing is pretty addictive. Almost anything is alright if I get some outside validation that I am actually useful, worthwhile, entertaining, and/or obedient.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to sub4hire)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/14/2005 3:43:16 PM   
bumblebee


Posts: 29
Joined: 12/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Suleiman

As taewakan and sub4hire have pointed out, this is a fairly complex issue. There are as many motivations for submitting as there are submissives. For myself, I recieve a great deal of gratification from positive feedback. More than sex, more than playtime, when I submit I need to know that I have done well. Not getting that reward will cause me to burn out in short order. If I get that fix on a regular basis from a person I adore, I become willing to do or give damn near anything, even if I know for a fact that it is a really bad mistake.

It actually took me a while to realise that I like pain. Nearly five or six years, maybe more. To begin with, enduring or suffering at the whim of my top was a way to please or impress them, which then became the means by which I recieved praise and attention. That ultimate reward was so much more important to me that it overwhelmed any incedental pleasure gotten from the play itself.



Thanks Suleiman for articulating that so well. It's almost exactly the way I feel and react though I haven't been able to find the words to express it. When I next discuss this with my Dom I'm going to borrow some of you words if thats ok.

As to Kya's question I obviously can't answer any better than those who've gone before me but I can add that pleasing, knowing that I have pleased and getting that positive feedback is very important to me. I can't tell you the thrill I get from hearing the words "good girl". It lasts longer than any orgasm. I suppose I could survive in a relationship without it, but not happily.

(in reply to Suleiman)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/15/2005 12:45:59 AM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bumblebee


Thanks Suleiman for articulating that so well. It's almost exactly the way I feel and react though I haven't been able to find the words to express it. When I next discuss this with my Dom I'm going to borrow some of you words if thats ok.




You're quite welcome to use anything I have written in these forums, as I have said to others before. If you want to use it in some publication or in another web forum, please remember to use my nic, but anything I put down here is for public consumption. If I want real credit for my work, I'll take it to a publisher myself.

~S

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to bumblebee)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: What's your motivation for submitting? - 1/15/2005 7:06:51 AM   
cynnacent1


Posts: 340
Joined: 6/25/2004
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline 		my Motivations:
#1 Reason: Pleasing my Master brings me great joy.

Positive feedback as a result from my Master, brings me great joy in knowing that He is pleased with me.
Constructive critisism received from my Master keeps me aware of the areas i need to work on in order to better myself and as a result, allows and increased level of pleasures i am able to offer Him.

The pleasure i receive in my submission to INSIDEYOURMIND is due to the fact that i enjoy serving Him, period. Being on the receiving end of His domination through serving Him in nonsexual ways, puts me in completely forfilled, peaceful and secure state of mind. Being on the receiving end of His domination through serving Him during BDSM play, puts me in a completely forfilled, peaceful and secure state of mind, and results in a very sensually intimate experience of excruciating bliss.

¸,ø¤º°cynnacent°º¤ø,¸ (proudly owned by, and devoted to INSIDEYOURMIND)



_____________________________

Current imood of cynnacent1: [image]http://moods.imood.com/display/uname=cynnacent1/fg=339999ns=1/imood.gif[/image] Click the smiley to get your very own imood indicator.

(in reply to kyakitten)
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