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directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 10:18:25 AM

Mavis

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i got nabbed doing some of this recently, and i wanted to introduce the topic and get some help with correcting my verbage. There are two issues really.. inadvertantly using directives with Dom or Master, and also the "good luck charm" thing.

"Enjoy Your dinner", "Oh! try that pie, You'll love it!", "Sleep well", "Sorry about Your cold, are You taking Your vitamins?" are all ways of saying i really care about You..
Of course, i *could* just say "i really care about You..." that would work without sounding like i am trying to be Masters Mommy yes?
i realise those expressions sound like directives. It's very difficult to change some of the normal nilla or neutral ways of talking. Things like "Drive safe" or "Have a good night/weekend/ day", and even "Be well", are such common parting expressions they have become like good luck charms we hand to loved ones to carry until they are returned to us safely. i was reading an article about how the lexicon has developed with lines like that to such an extent, some people suffer real anxiety if their loved one leaves for work, and they forgot to say "drive safe", as if not having said so, the person could have an accident and never be returned to them. They have become American superstitions, the author said. He makes a fair point. What i took from that was if we're thinking those good luck charms have power, a slave using them is assuming a control that, even if it was real, wouldn't be appropriate for a slave in any case. So, for Dom/mes and submissives alike, do Y/you use "good luck charms" in workplace, family and friends situations? Have Y/you ever considered the "drive safe" reminder isn't really going to change the outcome of someone's travels? Also, what suggestions are out there for those of us who are looking for parting "blessings" that aren't couched in directive sounding terms? "i hope you sleep well" just sounds so artificial and cumbersome, as does a LOT of "D/s speak".. i feel like i'm doing gymnastics with language! But then, i am in D/s relationships because i want the dynamic to be different, and choice of words used is part of that, at least for me. Thanks in advance, i know Y/you folks will have plenty of great ideas.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 10:26:33 AM

juliaoceania

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quote:

So, for Dom/mes and submissives alike, do Y/you use "good luck charms" in workplace, family and friends situations? Have Y/you ever considered the "drive safe" reminder isn't really going to change the outcome of someone's travels?

In psych 101 we were taught behaviors like this were "magical thinking". I do say them, but not for some kinda superstitious or OCD reason. It crosses my mind when I part from loved ones that we may never see them again... so these sorts of "sayings"
reinforce to me that we should not take it forgranted that people will always come home safely.. we should be more thoughtful of our interactions is my point.

quote:

Also, what suggestions are out there for those of us who are looking for parting "blessings" that aren't couched in directive sounding terms?

1) I wish you well today, on your journey, with your new job?
2) You will be in my thoughts?
3) I am always sending you light when you go away?

I have caught myself with "directive speak", although he has not reprimanded me for it.. he knows who is in charge and so do I....smiles

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 10:39:16 AM

LuckyAlbatross

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I always say "Don't crash" when saying goodbye to someone who's going to drive, and "Don't burn the house down" when leaving someone at the house. Those are just inside family sayings that developed decades ago and we enjoy using.

There are some masters who do in fact order their slaves to ALWAYS use passive voice and never say things like "Have a good day!" I find that a bit obtuse and ignoring the intention of language in favor of the blatant literal expression. But to each their own.

So I don't use particular sayings for luck, but I have a lot of quirky language sayings that I use.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 10:45:15 AM

juliaoceania

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This subject reminded me of something that happened with my last serious vanilla relationship. I am a mom so when I would cross streets with my son I would always grab his hand before I did. This became a deeply ingrained habit. One day I was crossing a street with my boyfriend and I grabbed his hand... he says to me "You know, I am perfectly able to cross the street on my own and have been doing so for a few decades". I did not even realize that I was doing this...

I do not know why, but this thread made me think of that...

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 11:48:06 AM

Mavis

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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

One day I was crossing a street with my boyfriend and I grabbed his hand... he says to me "You know, I am perfectly able to cross the street on my own and have been doing so for a few decades". I did not even realize that I was doing this...

I do not know why, but this thread made me think of that...

LOL. the reason it made you think of that is probably because that's pretty much what made me start it. Master has a big weekend coming up, and W/we were discussing the schedule, and i was saying things like, "oh, if You leave early and get a good breakfast.." and "Since You'll be going to bed early.. what time should i do my night-call?"

He said "well, I've been feeding Myself and such for quite some time now Mommy.. and I will go to bed when I am tired, thank you." LMAO.

That's what reminded me about the "sleep well" thing and the rest just all came up at once. Thanks for the story, it's nice to know i'm not the only momma-sub out there, but there is help outside of a 12 step program!

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 11:52:36 AM

mnottertail

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this thing is part and parcel of the book

You Just Don't Understand, By Deborah Tannen (tanner?)

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 11:54:15 AM

Mavis

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

I always say "Don't crash" when saying goodbye to someone who's going to drive, and "Don't burn the house down" when leaving someone at the house.

See, i prefer those to the aforementioned cumbersome "I wish you well" stuff, but then we're back to the directives thing. i could just imagine
"Don't crash"
"Alrighty-o, since you've told Me specifically not to.."

i'll ponder "Master, Your slave wishes you Would not crash n burn today, if Thou might please grant me this, Your slave would be grateful until the next trip cometh .." but i don't see myself internalising that.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 12:00:57 PM

juliaoceania

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There are some ways that being a mommy-sub can be very service oriented. For example my Daddy likes me to undress him and put him in the shower, bath him and then put him to bed with a good movie while I get him drinks/snacks. Almost the same type of care I would give an ill child, except he is not ill and I am doing this because he likes it from me. But I do get my nurturer side fulfilled by this.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 1:09:24 PM

ownedgirlie

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A bunch of us at work listened to a Brian Regan CD (the guy is hysterical) in which he jokes about starting to say one thing, then changing your mind mid-way and accidentally finishing it off with something else. For example, you start to say "Take Care!" but then halfway into it your mind decides to say "Good luck!" so what ends up coming out is, "Take luck!"

So we say that to each other at work all the time..."Bye....take luck!" It's kind of a staple phrase now :)

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 2:29:49 PM

BitaTruble

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quote:

Also, what suggestions are out there for those of us who are looking for parting "blessings" that aren't couched in directive sounding terms

Just try putting the word 'please' in front of it and see if that works for you. That turns it from a directive into a request which leaves it up to the dominant to accept or discard.

Please, sleep well.

Please, drive safely.

Please, try this pie.

It worked for me, it may work for you or it may not, but you can give a shot.

Celeste

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 2:59:00 PM

agirl

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Maybe that's a bit American.....not sure though.

I just say*Bye* when people go.

And *goodnight* when off to sleep.

I don't ever feel the desire to say anything like * Take care*.....blah, blah.....it just seems daft and superfluous.

agirl

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 2:59:11 PM

Arpig

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I find it a little ridiculous to mangle the language in order to "express" one's dominance or submission...the dominance or submission is either there or it isn't, and I suspect that if it needs to be "expressed" in convoluted sentence structure or clumsy passive voice or 3rd person phrasing, it isn't really there.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 3:34:17 PM

Mavis

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Celeste, thank you. Just that one little word does make it land very differently. Sometimes i can't see the forrest for the trees.

Arpig, i agree with you. He understands my intent, it's not so much an issue between U/us, but i am concerned about minutia, so if there is an itty-bitty tweak i can make that sounds "righter" to Him or to others, i'm happy to do it. i've got plenty other ways of irritating southern-speakers, so i work on what things i can as they come up.

Julia, i also agree on the mommy-sub thing, it's not a bad gig at all! My mom always called my dad "Daddy-Baby" and i've adopted it at my house because that's how relationships are, we do swap nurturing roles and it's a warm n fuzzy thing. Actually, i wrote Master i was going to post this question, but i got back the reply "No,no.. wait" too late, it had already been posted for an hour.. So once i decide how to strain that feedback of the personal not to be shared stuff, i'll be back to add some enlightening stuff.

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RE: directives as good luck charms - 10/6/2006 5:50:35 PM

gypsygrl

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I do the mommy thing and can be very directive. Sometimes, when I'm talking to my kids its like I'm talking to a dog: Sit! Stay! Stop! Now! Yo! It took me a long time to learn this style with them, and it seems to stop them in their tracks the way a more gently phrased sentence doesn't. Alot of times I don't even say a word, but just make a specific noise, that sort of sounds like Ack! These aren't good luck charms, but sometimes they pop up in the middle of play, and to be honest, they help set boundaries better than the way I used to do it "Please sir, I'd rather you didn't cross that limit" vs. "Yo! Quit fucking with the tits!" Of course, if I have to go there, chances are I won't be playing with that dominant again because its not really what I want out of play. I want to submit not coach foot ball. But, at least I don't have to worry about a lot of boundary crashing. You wouldn't believe it, but I have run into more than one dominant who intentionally brought out that kind of behavior in me.

But, more to your point, I also do a mommy-always-ready-with-a-tissue thing. I can be very maternal, and mother hennish always reminding people to eat and remembering what foods they like and don't like. Its just an instinct. But, in another way it feels really controlling, and I feel easier about it if they request that kind of approach from me. And I need constant reassurance that its ok, because it feels so controlling or intrusive when I direct mommy behavior at an adult besides the fact that it tends to be infantilizing. Maybe I'm projecting, though, because I really don't like to be treated that way and hate it when someone hovers over me trying to meet my every whim because, well, it feels intrusive, controlling and infantilizing.

I do say things like, "have fun," "be careful" and that kind of thing. You're right, as I think about it, it does have the feel of being magical thinking or a superstition. Thinking about times when I've said it, what I mean is "I don't really want you to leave because Im worried about what will happen when we're apart but I know you have to go so go, but make sure nothing bad happens to you and don't be miserable, but try to have some fun." I don't think its a good idea to actually say that all the time. :)

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