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RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/24/2012 8:17:34 PM

cloudboy

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quote:

Montana
Favre
Bradshaw

I would take Elway over Farve and Bradshaw. I'd also take Marino over them as well.

Montana and Bradshaw would not each have four SB rings if they had to play in the salary cap era.

As for the regular season, Drew Brees season last year is about the best I've ever seen in my lifetime -- I was just stunned at how good he was.

Montana is probably the best SB QB of all time.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 3/24/2012 8:18:08 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6741

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/24/2012 9:46:16 PM

Winterapple

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Peyton and Eli are two of the greatest and history
will give them their full due. Their father
Archie would have been one of the greatest
to if he had a team to work with.
A top five would IMO include the Mannings,
Drew Brees, John Elway. The fifth spot
could be Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana or
Dan Marino. Bradshaw and Favre definitely
top tenners but neither has the talent
of the Mannings or Brees or Elway.
If Brady makes the top ten he'd only
squeak his way in.
And like it or not Manning hatred Peyton
and Eli are amazing not just because
of what they bring physically but mentally
as well. They understand the game inside
out and both know how to work as a
team and bring a team together.
Peyton has at least two years to play
barring a bad injury. I think he can get
another ring and will go to another super
bowl. He is a shining asset to anyone
lucky enough to have him in their
organization because he's got it all.
He will never do as Favre did he will
leave the playing field with grace.
Tebow's main assets are he's young
and uninjured. He could make a good
NFL player but just not as a quarterback.
It's not just the physical aspects he's
lacking, he's mentally not a quarterback
IMO. And there is a mental aspect to
football. Peyton, Eli and Drew Brees have
the mental as well as the physical
in abundance. That's what makes them
great. It's what makes them tower over
others. Putting Peyton down and not
giving him his due is like saying Abe
Lincoln is overblown. Peyton, Eli and
Drew are poetry in motion. But haters
are gonna hate.

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(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 6742

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/24/2012 10:03:59 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

quote:

Montana
Favre
Bradshaw

I would take Elway over Farve and Bradshaw. I'd also take Marino over them as well.

Montana and Bradshaw would not each have four SB rings if they had to play in the salary cap era.

As for the regular season, Drew Brees season last year is about the best I've ever seen in my lifetime -- I was just stunned at how good he was.

Montana is probably the best SB QB of all time.

Elway doesn't make my top ten due to the choke factor. In his prime he lost 3 Super Bowls by a combined total of 96 points.

Marino would definitely be my #11. He doesn't finish higher because he never won a championship.

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 6743

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/24/2012 10:09:54 PM

slvemike4u

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See right there Ken I have a problem ,Elway doesn't lose those three absent the fact that he played on some seriously flawed teams....and Marino is missing a ring had he actually ever had a team to begin with
And I hate Marino

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6744

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 1:00:52 AM

Edwynn

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It is a screwball of inanity, futility, and less-than-level-headedness to compare players in any sport across decades and eras in absolute terms of some imagined ranking of today. That said, I can somewhat understand the consideration for Bradshaw even tough he was about the luckiest QB ever in terms of inherited team talent, both sides of the ball. He somehow found a way to dissociate from his usual penchant for throwing interceptions when it came to the big games. Had he played on almost any other team ...

Montanna, OTH, was more consistent and made noticeably fewer 'WTF?!' throws than Bradshaw throughout the season.

I understand that team success of the QB might come into play regarding QB comparisons, but anybody who thinks that either Brady or Bradshaw comes anywhere close to Unitas as a QB is just delusional.

< Message edited by Edwynn -- 3/25/2012 1:08:51 AM >

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6745

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 9:13:10 AM

slvemike4u

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We have a winner...someone who actually understands the game has showed up.
Someone who actually understands that Unitas is as much the gold standard og QB ing as Ruth was to baseball.
Thank you very much Edwynn.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Edwynn)

Post #: 6746

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 9:14:58 AM

DomKen

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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

See right there Ken I have a problem ,Elway doesn't lose those three absent the fact that he played on some seriously flawed teams....and Marino is missing a ring had he actually ever had a team to begin with
And I hate Marino

Elway's team's were good enough to go to the SB 3 times in 4 years. In 2 of the SB's they even started out doing well and then fell apart. He choked, it's just that simple. The fact that the 2 he did win were on teams that featured the run game just goes further to show he isn't in the truly elite of the NFL QB's.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6747

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 9:17:28 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

We have a winner...someone who actually understands the game has showed up.
Someone who actually understands that Unitas is as much the gold standard og QB ing as Ruth was to baseball.
Thank you very much Edwynn.

If you're claiming Unitas is #1 and Peyton is at worst #3 who is your #2? Montana? That would leave a bunch of QB's with both better career stats and more on field success farther down.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6748

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 9:18:51 AM

slvemike4u

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Okay than Ken,name me one QB who was able to win with a less than adequate running game.
And since you have made the standard the ring,that is the standard your candidate must be measured against ?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6749

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 11:11:42 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

Montana
Farve
Brady

Also keep in mind that Elway had an adequate run game in the 3 SB blowouts. The 2 in question were not balanced offences but ones that were much more run than pass.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 3/25/2012 11:18:45 AM >

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6750

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 11:19:33 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
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From: United States
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Nah,I don't see that,they all had adequate running games,granted their running was helped by the talent at qb keeping defenses playing pass first...but when push came to shove they could all call on a running game.
With the guys you have chosen we would mostly be talking about running by committee,but give me some time(a little distracted right now,some other shit is going on)and I will be back with the backs,the yardage accumulated and most importantly yards per carry stats
Care to name the years(to make this easier for myself...lol) when you are asserting these guys won without benefit of a more than capable running attack ?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6751

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 11:22:46 AM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Elway doesn't make my top ten due to the choke factor. In his prime he lost 3 Super Bowls by a combined total of 96 points.

Marino would definitely be my #11. He doesn't finish higher because he never won a championship.

It is a team sport. Seems to me you are imparting a higher ranking to QBs from better teams. If Scott Norwood made his kick v. the Giants, would you elevate Jim Kelly up in the rankings?

Its hard for me to see how you can demote Elway for choking but leave Brett Farve in your top 5.

I love Joe Montana, but he always had a running game, he had a HOF WR, and a championship caliber defense with HOF talent on it. SF and PITT were not dynasties because of the QBs, no the dynasties there were total team efforts.

As far as a QB elevating a team, I might pick Kurt Warner of the Cardinals during their SB run and just miss.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6752

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 11:58:05 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Nah,I don't see that,they all had adequate running games,granted their running was helped by the talent at qb keeping defenses playing pass first...but when push came to shove they could all call on a running game.
With the guys you have chosen we would mostly be talking about running by committee,but give me some time(a little distracted right now,some other shit is going on)and I will be back with the backs,the yardage accumulated and most importantly yards per carry stats
Care to name the years(to make this easier for myself...lol) when you are asserting these guys won without benefit of a more than capable running attack ?

Montana would be the last 2 SB years.
Farve would be most of his career including his SB win
Brady would be most of his career, last year would be fine.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6753

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 11:59:51 AM

DomKen

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Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Its hard for me to see how you can demote Elway for choking but leave Brett Farve in your top 5.

Farve holds most of the career records at QB and is the holder of the overall consecutive games streak which anyone who has played Football can tell you is a very impressive stat.

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 6754

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/25/2012 1:50:36 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Farve holds most of the career records at QB and is the holder of the overall consecutive games streak which anyone who has played Football can tell you is a very impressive stat.

I forgot about the consecutive games streak. That is a distinguishing feat. His 1st year in MN was incredible at his age.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6755

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/26/2012 4:38:13 AM

Edwynn

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Joined: 10/26/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

We have a winner...someone who actually understands the game has showed up.
Someone who actually understands that Unitas is as much the gold standard og QB ing as Ruth was to baseball.
Thank you very much Edwynn.

Unitas threw an interception returned for a touchdown on his first NFL pass, then bumbled a hand-off resulting in a fumble on the next possession. After that he threw a touchdown pass in 47 straight games. No one else has done that.

I still don't understand how the Baltimore Colts (sorry, I still despise the Indianapolis thing, though I like Manning) did not win at least one more championship than those two, but that's the way it goes. But he took that otherwise semi-decent Colts team and made other teams with much better defenses worry and suffer almost every week, and in the playoffs. The guy just made things happen by his own account like no other quarterback. BTW, Jerry Richardson, owner of the Carolina Panthers, was Unitas' 4th or 5th receiver in the day, though he caught one TD pass in the championship game.

Unitas was just in a class of his own, not sure if we'll ever see that repeated, no matter what yards thrown in a season by others.

BTW, after trashing your Jets, I know enough about the Giants to know they are one of only a few teams from the oldest days. My uncle attended school at LSU same time as Y.A. Tittle, that guy who later helped win the '63 championship for your phenomenal NY Giants. My uncle went on to greater glory as a physics professor at Ga. Tech while getting his PhD in civil engineering, and designing my parents' house.

Jerry Richardson, ... my own uncle ... we all have such ties to the greatest glory if we just look about.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 6756

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/26/2012 6:59:26 AM

slvemike4u

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From: United States
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Sorry Edwynn,he never helped the Giants win the 63 title....they lost to the Bears.As a matter of fact there is a famous photo of old Y.A. after the bear defense had had their way with him...he is on his knees,helmet off,beaten bloody and looking old....I think he retired after that
Those old Giants teams were champs only once,they kept getting beat in title games to Unitas and the Colts,Packers and Starr ....and the Bears and their defense.
They were a great team studded with future HOFers...but just one title.55 I think
Ken,maybe later today....I didn't forget

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Edwynn)

Post #: 6757

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/26/2012 7:16:42 AM

DaddySatyr

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From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
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I've been a JAY! EEE! TEE! ESS! JETS!!! JETS!!! JETS!!! fan since 1969.

I just want to say: A football team with two "star" quarterbacks has no quarterback.

What the blue fuck was Woody Johnson/Mike Tannenbaum thinking?

Peace and comfort,

Michael

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Post #: 6758

RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/26/2012 7:32:35 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I've been a JAY! EEE! TEE! ESS! JETS!!! JETS!!! JETS!!! fan since 1969.

I just want to say: A football team with two "star" quarterbacks has no quarterback.

What the blue fuck was Woody Johnson/Mike Tannenbaum thinking?

Peace and comfort,

Michael

Since when are 2 of the 5 worst passers in the NFL for the 2011 season called 'star quarterbacks'?

Go fish.

< Message edited by Hillwilliam -- 3/26/2012 7:33:00 AM >

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RE: NFL Sob or Jump for Joy - 3/26/2012 11:12:43 AM

slvemike4u

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Okay,my opinion of Tebow the quarterback iis well known.
No press conference is going to change that...but I tell you what it is hard to dislike this kid.
He is just too nice a guy for me to be able to take any shots at him" the person".....I could do with less of the "my savior Jesus Christ" stuff...but I cant for the life of me take any shots at him .
He is a nice guy....a real nice guy
lol,I'm a convert....lol

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Hillwilliam)

Post #: 6760

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