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ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

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At great risk of being redundant, I'm hoping you'll (Merc) take the time to engage me directly in a discussion on the topic.  Here's my earlier post, which would make a good starting point.

John,
Using my favorite trite attorney interjection during depositions; "asked and answered". However, if there is anything in particular that I've said, or you fell I've alluded to that is not clear, feel free to ask directly on the profile side.

If you chose to go that route this is the disclaimer that usually comes with the response; "The views and opinions expresses are dogma for 'Merc & beth' and not to be construed as 'lifestyle' dogma in any form or fashion. Any feeling of personal attack, validation, hope, hopelessness, or invalidation, perceived by the blunt, sarcastic, pragmatic, stupid, smart, insightful, bazaar, brutal, honest, irrelevant response comes from your perspective not ours. If you don't believe that this is how we live and act let us know when you are in the neighborhood, and we'll be happy to meet you in person and, if we enjoy your company, you'll be welcomed into the hospitality of our home." That goes for Jay Wiseman too.

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ORIGINAL: twicehappy

" Hey,  Fucking Stop! I just ..... (broke my hip, crossed my threshhold, had a heart attack., etc....)
 

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ORIGINAL: Sinergy

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ORIGINAL: twicehappy

" Hey,  Fucking Stop! I just ..... (broke my hip, crossed my threshhold, had a heart attack., etc....)
 

Technically, this would be a string of morphemes combined into a specific collection of phonemes which would be considered by anybody listening to the exchange to be...

(pause for emphasis, drum roll)

Safe words.

Thank you for proving our argument that having safe words are a good thing for people in the lifestyle to have to protect the people involved.

Sinergy

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ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I love chocolate....personally, I think that people who don't like it must have some kind of defect somewhere...I just can't even comprehend not liking chocolate. Can I prove that thought or provide some anecdotal support for it. Nope. Still doesn't take away my right to have that thought. Still doesn't take away my right to state that thought. As I said in an earlier post, if my having my thought makes someone feel like something is wrong with them....then it's their issue, not mine.

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ORIGINAL: mistoferin

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ORIGINAL: Sinergy

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ORIGINAL: twicehappy

" Hey,  Fucking Stop! I just ..... (broke my hip, crossed my threshhold, had a heart attack., etc....)
 

Technically, this would be a string of morphemes combined into a specific collection of phonemes which would be considered by anybody listening to the exchange to be...

(pause for emphasis, drum roll)

Safe words.

Thank you for proving our argument that having safe words are a good thing for people in the lifestyle to have to protect the people involved.

Sinergy

Actually....if you go back and look, you will find that there are very few people who resist open and forthright communication. The stance that most of us who are "anti safeword" have taken all along is against pre-scripted code words being touted as if they have some kind of magical power vs. clear and concise communication.

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ORIGINAL: adaddysgirl
erin, 
'i love cholcoate' and 'i just can't even comperehend not liking chocolate' are your opinions of chocolate, and that is fine.  But when you outright state that those who do not like chocolate must have a defect, that makes the statement derogatory and critical (unless you are only joking of course).  The latter is much different than the former, isn't it?
 
And honestly, the point that there is something wrong with them and it's their issue...well, let's put it this way....statements like that reflect on your character more than it does the ones whom you offend.
 
BTW...i love chocolate....so i don't have that 'defect'  [:D]
 

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ORIGINAL: Sinergy
I accept the fact that you have failed to understand what I have stated.

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I dont care what words people use to stop a scene, when I use the term "safe words" it is to have words or phrases in place which allow communication between the two people and to allow the bottom to stop the scene if she needs it stopped.

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Your comments about "fucking stop that my hip is broken" are ways for the bottom to stop a scene, regardless of what the Top is thinking.

Thank you for proving the point I was trying to make.

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ORIGINAL: Kalira
Really? And what do you tell the bottom, who believed that a 'safe-word" is the end to end all?

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Violations of consent are not unique to BDSM and ignoring them is not unique to BDSM.

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ORIGINAL: mistoferin

It's only derogatory and critical if that is how they choose to take it. I am not fond of escargot. I am sure that there are some people who will think me defective for not partaking in something that gives them so much pleasure. Tis" ok though....I'm quite happy to be defective in that way [;)]! I don't take it as derogatory. Quite often, right here on these boards, people are very critical of my personal views....but I can promise you that you won't find me crying in my Cheerios over it. That's what I mean. I am responsible for the emotions that I choose to own. I am not responsible for the emotions others choose to own. As for my character...I'm quite happy with who I am. People can view me however they choose. I'm not here seeking validation.

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ORIGINAL: justheather

Kalira,
When people expound on your idea in a way that is not in line with your point of view, it does not always mean that they do not value or understand your opinion.
Sometimes, it just means that they want to explore it in another direction or look at it from a different perspective.
I think that the fact that people are responding to your OP means that they think your idea is worth discussing. They don't have to agree with you to appreciate the topic as a good one, and the fact that they disagree with you is not a personal attack.

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ORIGINAL: Kalira
Out of the respect that I actually do have for you and what you do say on here, I will keep my shut.

Have a nice day.

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ORIGINAL: Kalira

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Violations of consent are not unique to BDSM and ignoring them is not unique to BDSM.

Exactly. I was not trying to infer that they were. However, since you so conviently missed the point trying to be made, I will not attempt to point it out again.

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ORIGINAL: adaddysgirl
Well erin, i think that if you said those that don't like chocolate are morons or idiots....that would sound derogatory to most.  i don't think there would have to be much 'choosing' to take it that way.
 
Yes, i have seen others criticize your views....being critical seems to abound on these forums.  It's that type of stuff that perpetuates a lot of the anger around here.  So maybe you don't care what you say...or how it makes people feel....not your responsibility, but it really is an unbecoming quality....don't you think?
 
i know, i know...you could care less what i think.  So be it.  i have no need to argue that point.

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ORIGINAL: Morrigel

I have tried to provide examples of scenes in which safewords are better than "Fucking quit it".  Synergy has done the same--so have other posters.  The problem is not that we are not communicating--the problem is that you are not listening or even trying to listen.

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ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I am a fierce opponent of the safeword concept if we are talking about the use of prescripted "magical" words that are touted to keep one safe. I absolutely will not scene with anyone who insists that I use one. I believe that words like green, yellow, red or Rumpelstiltskin are ridiculous and very poor replacements for open, honest and forthright communication. When something goes wrong in a scene...the thing that is wrong is the first thing that comes to mind. If I am going to vomit, I don't think...uh oh, "red"....I think vomit. If my stomach turns and I am hit with a bout of diarrhea, I don't think "Rumpelstiltskin"....I think diarrhea. If my hip pops out of joint, I don't think "calliope"....I think "my fucking hip is dislocated". In any of those, or in any other of a myriad of situations, I have no desire to go searching my memory banks for the prechosen magic stop the action word. Communication of what is actually taking place works just fine.

I am also one of those subs who DOES become entirely uncommunicative after a certain point. Having a magic word at that point....or even trying to rely upon normal conversation....would be impossible. The only thing that will assure me any higher degree of safety at that point is the good judgement that I made prior to the scene in my choice of partner. It is the reason that I do not rush lightly into play with people I don't know well and it is the reason that I don't advocate casual play to others. Magic words are not a replacement for a Dominant that is in tune and paying attention.

My biggest beef with the safeword concept is that far too often I hear of Dominants who have these discussions with newer submissives and they talk of these safewords as if they are some kind of certified, stamped and approved ticket to safe scenes. I often see newbies who throw caution to the wind and common sense out the window because...."It'll all be fine...he gave me a safeword". Well, that's just fucking horsepuckey. I have also seen, especially in the case of those newer, Dominants who don't know when to end a scene without hearing the utterance of those magical words.

In my own experience...I once had a Dominant abruptly end a scene because I apparently said the word "purple" He assumed that in my delirium I confused my colors. In actuality, purple is the color I most often experience in subspace. My utterance of it was indicative that I was in a really good place....not in trouble. On another occasion I was involved in a scene that went really bad. I tried communicating openly....didn't work. I tried communicating a bit more forcefully....didn't work. Yes, I even resorted to saying and then screaming the most common "magic" word "red"......guess what....that didn't work either. Later at the hospital while I was being stitched up....I came to terms with the fact that I was the responsible party for the failure of the scene. A bit more common sense and forethought on my part would have kept me from participating.