RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (Full Version)

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Sinergy -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/18/2007 12:24:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Amaros

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

Hello A/all,

Thank you for that lucid analysis, Amaros.  I had the opportunity to study (was working on a degree in teaching children with neurological deficits) some aspects of neurology, but your cogent description of satori was wonderful to read.

I did have a couple of comments.

I was reading about testing use of CAT (if I remember right) scan technologies as feedback tools.  A person with, say, uncontrollable seizures is hooked up to a machine which monitors brain activities and taught to alter their brain activity based on what the screen tells them.  This becomes important because if they learn a certain thought pattern which causes certain brain wave activity, and they feel an aura (precursor to seizure activity) they can concentrate on the brain wave activity they want and avoid seizing.

I have not really gone deeply into the research on using this sort of things for other issues, but it seems to me that it might be possible.  What I found most fascinating was a bunch of Buddhist monks (Tibetan) whose practice includes meditation in sub-zero temperatures overnight allowed themselves to be hooked up to CAT scans and had their brain waves monitored the entire time.   I am uncertain how the water in their cells refused to freeze, but I did find it pretty fascinating to read.

Sinergy


I heard about something many years ago - Peter Townsend used something like that to kick heroin - I think I might have read about it ina Rolling Stone interview, but never heard anything more about it. I'd be very interested in any information/resources on it you might have, I'm very interested in the whole notion of biofeedback.



Will have to remember the source materials I had.

The search term would be neurofeedback as opposed to biofeedback.  These are similar in the use of an EEG, although biofeedback also measures variations in other biological processes, heart rate, etc.

Neurofeedback is strictly altering brain wave patterns.  The person stares at a screen which has their brain waves displayed on them and starts trying to alter these patterns with their thoughts.

What is curious is that different types of thoughts transmit on different frequencies.  The reason substances like Ritalin work in people with ADD/ADHD is because those two problems are caused by an insufficiency of brain activity on certain frequencies.  So giving a brain stimulant to those people speeds that up.  Neurofeedback allows you to ask the person to increase the specific frequency that is slow for them.  After a while, the brain learns to self maintain it's frequency levels.

I want to edit that to point out that I tend to be relatively anti medicine.  My impression of a lot of it is that one is simply trading problem / effect A with problem / effect B.

It has been found useful for helping people with ADD/ADHD, behavioral problems, etc.

Sinergy




deathitivity -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/18/2007 6:51:32 PM)

God is but an infinity; an irrational number; an explanation.

There's my 2 cents, I'm getting out of here before this thread buries me.




QuietlySeeking -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/19/2007 1:46:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

That's a pretty lame viewpoint.

Religious groups are known to have exhibited very intense intolerance throughout the years. The witch hunts were intolerance of paganism. Catholics teach that the use of condoms is sinful. Mormons teach black people are the descendants of Cain (black skin being the "mark of Cain"). Just because each of these views doesnt represent a whole group that numbers in the billions doesn't mean that large numbers are not represented. LDS people are approx. 12 million members strong. That's a lot of people believing in some serious bullshit.


This comment made me roll in the floor.  You forgot the intolerance of pagans toward Christians, the intolerance amongst pagan groups within themselves....for a tolerant bunch, I've seen a greater division between them than between the Baptists and Catholics and Pentecostals.  Most of the denominations can at least come together and say, "well, we all believe in Jesus."

Large numbers don't breed intolerance.  Religious groups don't breed intolerance.  PEOPLE breed intolerance.




meatcleaver -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/19/2007 4:21:42 PM)

Probably one of the most tolerant churches is the Church of England which Dawkins pointed out, groomed its tolerance by taking religion out of religion. Even one of its Bishops said, its irrelevent who Jesus was and no one really believes in the resurrection which he called a trick of bones.




beastie7 -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/26/2007 5:15:36 PM)

I tend to agree with Juilette; there is NO God. Man made religons for the control. The Catholic Church (one example only); since it's inception, with the warring papal leaders; to gaining power over England (and other country governments); read about Thomas Beckett; read about poor Jeanne d'Arc; read about Nazi Germany, the Ukraine; now a Nazi sits as Pope.

If you choose to fantazie 'there is a God' then so be it; your choice, if you choose to believe there is No God' then for you there is 'No God'; so be it.

So what's the big deal here. When I die, I hope I can maintain my own integrity; dealing with the 'death thing'...all I know is you die playing in your own shit, and ...alone.




Amaros -> RE: There is No God by Penn Jillette (1/27/2007 6:57:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

quote:

ORIGINAL Amoros
I experinced another phenomona: a spontaneous physical manifestation of kinesthetic an behavioral traits I did not previously possess.


Wots that then ?


As pedestrian as it sounds, I walked different - you hadda be there.




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