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Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 12:17:34 AM   
SweetlyMisguided


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Recently, my now eight month old lab/pit mix puppy has came down with a VERY bad habit...

She's started snapping at me when I try to take something away from her that she is NOT supposed to have, or, if I am not paying her attention when she wants it...

Tonight, we were laying in bed watching a movie on tv... she was laying on the floor, and came up and put her head on the bed... I was half in/out of sleep... when suddenly she just jumped towards me barking and snapping...

Is there ANY suggestions on how to get her out of this habit and fast? It worries me that her temperment has changed so much in the past month....



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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 12:21:41 AM   
perverseangelic


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Would you like me to post this on my stupid pet owners community? I could get some advice, I imagine.

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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 12:35:04 AM   
SweetlyMisguided


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Any advice from anywhere would be appreciated! Considering I am 36 weeks pregnant... This has got to STOP and stop now!

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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 5:56:55 AM   
mistoferin


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Sweetly,
I have always owned big dogs, mostly labs, and it seems that every one of them has tried this once along the way to their maturity. It is like they are testing the waters. With a dog of that size it is VERY important that they not be allowed to get away with. You must make them understand that there really is one Top Dog in the home and it is not them. The way I dealt with it is the way I was told to by an instructor in dog training.

For a time when I was training them I would have them wear their training collars in the house, NOT THE ELECTRICAL KIND( I strongly don't believe in their use and currently have a dog that is brain damaged as a result of his previous owner's abuse of one) but the standard choker. I would keep a small clasp on it to secure it so that there would be no way that the dog could get it caught on something and have the collar tighten by mistake and accidently choke himself. Something that I could remove very fast though(like the clasp that is on the end of a dog leash) if I needed to make a correction on the dog.

I know that people get funny sometimes about choke collars and think they are cruel, but not when used as they are intended. Their intention is not to choke the dog at all. To make a proper correction with one you must get the collar up very high behind the ears and make a very fast snap(pull), release. Dogs have a nerve that runs right up behind the ear and when you properly use the collar in that way it puts pressure on that nerve and send them a bit of a jolt, not painful(I have certainly never had a dog cry out or whine from a proper correction) but an attention getter.

When I have had my dogs do as yours have I have given them an immediate correction. I have then followed it by becoming larger than life in the eyes of the dog. I take them by their cheeks (no not hard enough to hurt them in any way, just firm enough to do the job)or by the collar itself and I get right in their face. There is a technique taught in the Koehler Method of Dog Training where you repeatedly yell NO....BAD DOG!!!! In order for this to be effective you must get your voice very loud and down very low to the level of a growl. So in essence you are growling at the dog in a very loud manner....much the same way their mother would, but with words. I generally repeated the bad dog 3 or 4 times and then I would immediately take the dog without ever having taken my hands off of them and put them in confinement, whether it be a dog crate or a small room like the bathroom. I would leave them in there for at least a half an hour.

I do not recommend that you hit or strike the dog in any way as I don't believe they understand the connection. I have trained many now and take them the extra step in training to field trials and hunting. This is the method that has always worked for me, I hope it helps. I have generally not had to repeat it( I think one dog actually tried it a second time), but I also must say that I used it the very first time they ever tried it with me.

< Message edited by mistoferin -- 2/26/2005 6:01:19 AM >


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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 11:33:51 AM   
Sissyslave71


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Squirt gun (lukewarm water)

If the dog is still young...it will remembe from the training what will happen if it snaps at you its entire life.

Not so easy to train once they are older.

My co-worker is also a dog trainer.

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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 1:38:44 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetlyMisguided
when suddenly she just jumped towards me barking and snapping...

Is there ANY suggestions on how to get her out of this habit and fast? It worries me that her temperment has changed so much in the past month....

I suppose you mean advice from pet lovers hah? LOL
I would give her away it away to the shelter before it hurts me or my soon to be born God forbid. Growing up around a lot of humans with needs, the only pets one learns to tolerate are the human ones.

I grew up with 1 nice dog, and 1 evil one... The nice/intelligent one was a golden retriever, I miss him since he passed; but my nephew was bitten right below the heart by a neighbor's dog, and that is something I would never forgive any owner for, no matter how close we were; than again I don't have close friends with dogs.
Good luck and hope she can be trained to behave better. M


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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 2:47:31 PM   
Moleculor


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Squirt gun/bottle is your best bet. You have to do it IMMEDIATELY (i.e. not 15 or 30 seconds) after the snapping though, so you'll need it in your hand every time.

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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/26/2005 4:34:55 PM   
TravisTJustice


Posts: 74
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetlyMisguided

Recently, my now eight month old lab/pit mix puppy has came down with a VERY bad habit...

She's started snapping at me when I try to take something away from her that she is NOT supposed to have, or, if I am not paying her attention when she wants it...

Tonight, we were laying in bed watching a movie on tv... she was laying on the floor, and came up and put her head on the bed... I was half in/out of sleep... when suddenly she just jumped towards me barking and snapping...

Is there ANY suggestions on how to get her out of this habit and fast? It worries me that her temperment has changed so much in the past month....




Firstly, dogs have a number of age transitions which generally are times when they might show signs of uncharacteristic behavior such as new challenges to reassert their position in the pack. That 8 - 12 month period is when they grow out of the puppy stage and into the dog equivalent of young child. It's a bit like the "terrible twos" infants go through around two years of age. Their transition into the human equivalent of teen years happens around 18 months and around 3 years of age, they move into adulthood. Things generally will stay settled without any challanges from there through to 6 or so years, at which point some dogs might have their last attempts to challenge their position before settling down into older maturity.

Secondly, there are a number of reasons why a dog will try to bite: (1) fear (2) in defense of something it thinks it owns (that stupid old shoe that it sleeps with) (3) it's in pain or (4) it's psychotic.

It doesn't sound like your pup has anything to fear, so let's look at (2) -- you have to set aside time to specifically deal with the problem of it guarding things. This will mean creating a controled situation where you or a partner can correct the dog (using the Kohler methods somebody else has already mentioned) each time you attempt to take possession of whatever it is the dog shouldn't have. This exercise needs to be repeated over and over, correcting BEFORE the dog actually snaps. In other words, sit the dog close to the object. The person holding the lead should talk happily with the dog and even scratch its ear or whatever. The SECOND it even LOOKS like it's interested in making a move toward you, it gets corrected. What is achieved here is the dog will learn to not even THINK about guarding the thing.

(3) pain -- it's possible the dog is teething and thus in pain. Keeping the dog supplied with bones and chew toys will help.

A few people have mentioned sprays. These will work -- a water spray containing a few drops of cintronella oil (the smell of which dogs hate) will do wonders, or even an old perfume you don't mind using for the purpose. Of course, perfumes are alcohol based and so it is important not to spray it like Mace at Mike Tyson, OK? It's also important the response with these is immediate so the association is made -- "snap my teeth -- > I get unpleasant smells in my nose."

(4) Psychotic biters -- dogs that are straight out crazy are rarer than people might imagine, but they're much more prevalent in mixed breeds than purebreds. Without knowing the dog's family history, it's difficult to make any predictions as to how it might turn out, but the "pit" characterists are something that would bother me in your pup.

If I can also address something I feel might be a concern for you -- the imminent arrival of a new member to the household pack.

Let me say at the outset that if you have even the slightest concerns about your dog harming your baby when it comes along, get rid of the dog. Give it to a friend or family, but don't take the chance of having it "snap" -- literally and figuratively -- when there is a baby in the house. It's just not worth it.

That said, dominant dogs with stable temperments aren't prone to biting infants or young children because they don't perceive these as being any sort of a challenge to their position in the pack. A less stable dog, however, might, for any of the reasons mentioned above.

One final thought. You haven't mentioned how much basic obedience has been done with the pup. It's never too late to start and if you already have, you need to keep at it and even redouble your efforts.

Good luck :-)

Travis T.

< Message edited by TravisTJustice -- 2/26/2005 4:35:56 PM >


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RE: Need some SERIOUS puppy advice... - 2/28/2005 9:23:07 AM   
MidnightWriter


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Yup - it sounds like your pup is testing the waters, looking for pack heirarchy.

You can speak human back to 'em - a sharp whap on the muzzle, stern sharp noises, place immediately into isolation - and that'll work.

You could also speak dog - exhibit dominant canine traits. This, IME, works better and quicker.

Grab the head, immobilizing it without causing needless pain. Wait patiently until they stop struggling. Make (by force if necessary) eye contact. They'll try to look away - shift thier head to re-establish eye contact. Continue until they surrender - it's a look in the eyes that I'm not sure how to describe, but one sign is that instead of trying to look to the side, they start trying to look down.

I had one dog that held out for almost 5 minutes - most are much quicker to surrender. It may help to growl - not trying to copy a canine growl, but give it your best primate growl. Doesn't have to be loud, but menacing/warning overtones are good.

If it works, the pup will surrender, after being released, by rolling onto thier back and exposing the throat/belly. An affectionate rub or scratch (NOT in the belly/throat area) at this point is how they'll know that you've accepted that surrender, and the matter is settled, the issue is closed.

Good luck!



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