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Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:15:44 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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During a conversation with a submissive regarding her issues with giiving up control and submitting to the will of a dominant, she mentioned she was afraid of losing her sense of self by becomming devoted and focused on the needs and wants of the dominant. This was something I was at a bit of a failure to respond to so I was hoping perhaps some of the experienced slaves and submissives could shed some insight into this issue. Is the issue of forgetting one's sense of self a valid concern when a person is focusing on the needs and wants of another before their own?

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 1/18/2007 9:18:33 PM >

_____________________________

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The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

Post #: 1

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:26:58 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

During a conversation with a submissive regarding her issues with giiving up control and submitting to the will of a dominant, she mentioned she was afraid of losing her sense of self by becomming devoted and focused on the needs and wants of the dominant. This was something I was at a bit of a failure to respond to so I was hoping perhaps some of the experienced slaves and submissives could shed some insight into this issue. Is the issue of forgetting one's sense of self a valid concern when a person is focusing on the needs and wants of another before their own?

She sounds like she is perhaps a novice? I know when I first began to explore with my former dominant and I realized how intense a power exchange could be, how all encompassing it could be, I was excited and scared all at the same time. It was a heady time for me. I think that it could be termed "sub frenzy". I even had trouble concentrating on my daily life.

Perhaps you can address what her specific concerns are? What would she fear giving up, what would she gain, is the trade worth it to her? If she is a novice she needs to be thinking about these things realistically, and I would not expect or encourage immediate answers, because the answers should come from within her, not what she thinks you "want" to hear. I can tell you, I felt this sense of sometimes being so alone when contemplating the loss of self. I do not think being submissive should mean the loss of self, it should be something that feels as though we are gaining the expression of who we are... it takes the right dominant person to see who we are, and honor that authentic person inside... if anything it only becomes enhanced!

If she is a novice, she is still finding out what her wants and needs in this world are, and if I were a dominant helping her explore that, I would tell her that her needs and desires matter and need to be straight in her mind before she jumps into giving up her sovereignty.

Good luck to both of you.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 2

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:52:53 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

During a conversation with a submissive regarding her issues with giiving up control and submitting to the will of a dominant, she mentioned she was afraid of losing her sense of self by becomming devoted and focused on the needs and wants of the dominant. This was something I was at a bit of a failure to respond to so I was hoping perhaps some of the experienced slaves and submissives could shed some insight into this issue. Is the issue of forgetting one's sense of self a valid concern when a person is focusing on the needs and wants of another before their own?

Its healthy for submissives to have boundaries, limits, and a developed sense of what is and is not good for them. A submissive who can skillfully tell a dominant he's off his rocker, wrong, or misguided has a core self you can rely upon. Someone with a strong core ornamented with a sense of submission ---- offers a superior relationship to a dominant, as he/she will offer inciteful feedback, originality, verve, and excitement to a relationship.

(Such a submissive knows that no relationship is all about "the other.")

So, I don't think her concern excludes the possibility of submission.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 1/18/2007 10:01:03 PM >

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 3

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:56:04 PM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

I used to be quite afraid of this. I was instructed to consider what exactly I was afraid of. Each piece of that puzzle was listed and discussed. The irony is, had I not given up control and fully submitted, I never would have found myself. Deeply submissive and his slave is who and what I am. I was losing my sense of self by not submitting to him.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 4

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:56:34 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
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deleted

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 1/18/2007 9:59:31 PM >

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 5

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/18/2007 9:58:29 PM

darksdesire

Posts: 326
Joined: 10/18/2006
Status: offline

Agreed. The more I submit, the more I lose myself in him, the more I find myself. It's one of the many wonderful paradoxes of D/s.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 6

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 7:11:28 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

If you choose a relationship that fulfills you, then you will become MORE of who you are as you progress into it.

The problem is that most choose the collar over the relationship and make bad choices in their relationships, and thus end up stifling themselves.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 7

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 7:50:28 AM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

Greetings..~smiles~

If she is at this point thus far..she needs to realize that this is part of herself also. It just appears that it isn't a part of herself that has been recognized for very long, and there is no comfort zone present because the lack of understanding this aspect of herself is still vastly unexplored. You can help her explore that, and understand that by testing the waters of what she's feeling inside that has indeed brought her this far. Stopping at the line though to allow her to make the choice of keeping or dismissing, stopping or moving farther into exploration.

So in essence it is pretty much what some here have said already. She's not loosing herself..she's only going to discover and understand better a different part of herself. She will have to be the one to take that leap though.

Sort of like you have 3 rooms you've played in all your life. You know them like the back of your hand. They are safe, secure, familiar, understood..but there has always been a 4th room within. Up until now you've never had a need to visit it because the other 3 were always enough to fill your needs. Now though after all these years..your starting to become bored with the 3 rooms. They just don't provide you with everything they use to but yet the fear of leaving these familiar rooms to find out what that other room is about can be scarey doings. Even if this room has always been a part of your world, and available to you...you don't have a clue about it. What if whats in it will be bad things that will try and stop me from going back to the 3 rooms I know, and understand? First fear can be alleviated by understanding that this 4th room has always been there, and therefore has been apart of me or you all along. Gotta get past that 1st fear and accept it I think before you can proceed into it. Also have to realize that once entering it..there is no guarantee. It may be a awful room for you. It may turn out to be the best damn room ever and you'll smack yourself wondering why the heck did I wait so long. Or it might just turn out to be no big deal, and no more thrilling than the 3 other rooms have become once the newness of the 4th room wears off.

Don't even ask me where I came up with this room thing. I don't have a clue but it seem to fit..lol.

Only other thing I could offer is to have her read the responses from persons here who have visited that elusive 4th room.

Good luck to you both Sir

Well Wishes
starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

< Message edited by starshineowned -- 1/19/2007 7:51:23 AM >

_____________________________

"And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." --Abraham Lincoln

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 8

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 8:13:25 AM

dawntreader

Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

I used to be quite afraid of this. I was instructed to consider what exactly I was afraid of. Each piece of that puzzle was listed and discussed. The irony is, had I not given up control and fully submitted, I never would have found myself. Deeply submissive and his slave is who and what I am. I was losing my sense of self by not submitting to him.

i agree with this. While i have not had the opportunity to experience this in any of my D/s relationships, i have experienced it in my spiritual journey and as scary as it can be...it is just as awesome and rewarding...

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 9

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 8:53:23 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline

I was never afraid i found my true self in my submission. Yes i belong to him but i also belong to myself if that makes sense.

Matt's littleone

(in reply to dawntreader)

Post #: 10

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 9:39:09 AM

eroticBBWsub

Posts: 6
Joined: 5/1/2006
Status: offline

I was also concerned about that in the beginning. But I took the risk, and like others have said, felt like I found myself by giving myself to him. I became totally devoted to him, I loved him, I gave him everything - my mind, my heart, and my body. I held nothing back and changed my entire life to serve him and be his.

Things were fine until he released me on Monday. It was out of the blue, it was overnight, it was shocking. He listed every time I had been confused or didnt understand things in the beginnig. He said cruel, hurtful things to me, and broke his most sacred promises to me. This was a R/T, 3 1/2 year relationship.

Now I am a released submissive, I am heart broken, I am in shock, I dont know what to do with myself now. This was my first Master and my first D/s relationship. My entire life was about serving him and pleasing him.. Without him now, who am I and what am I supposed to do???

I cant imagine ever doing this again, ever trusting someone to that degree, ever giving myself to someone like that. I lost myself in him and now having lost him, I feel like I have lost myself, that I am lost now.

I would tell any novice that its great when he holds you and wants you. Losing yourself and devoting yourself only to him is great while he still wants you. But when he changes his mind and releases you for no understandable reason, I dont think its worth the risk, or worth the pain. Now I need to figure out what to do now.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 11

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 9:44:40 AM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

It can be part of the learning process and the scariest part of it, to truly go done the path where it does become mostly about your dominant to you and less about what has been about in your life before.

For a healthy person it is just a process you must go through. For some there is little thought and for others it can be a struggle, for me personally, this comes up not so much when feelings hit me but when I have been in that stage is this something that is actually going to go long term or if I am going to get hurt if this happens to me. For me part of it was just being patient and part of it was being able to still look at my life and see where I was still very much me. My career, family and friends were still there in my life. My interests may take a back burner but they did not disappear. Thoughts of this nature help get me past this.

Society’s ties to an individual are tough to cut and are not cut all at once. It takes time. If I were to see someone struggling with this issue I would just have talks with them to remind them they are not deleting themselves but just rearranging how they live and the point of that is to make them much happier.

_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to littleone35)

Post #: 12

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 12:57:53 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

Thank you all for the insights.

The girl was at one point in the beginnings of a relationship with me. The relationship was ended by me before it got very far when I realized that we just simply werent a good match. As LA mentioned, rather than choose the collar, I chose to end something that was inventibably going to be a mismatched relationship. We are still close friends though and this issue came up when we were reflecting back on problems during the relationship. From our time together and the observations I made during it, she has quite a lot to overcome before she can give up control to another person...though perhaps a good bit of that was caused by the lack of a strong emotional connection between us. I appreciate all the replies and feedback as I do still try to help her along with her own issues for when she meets the right dominant

It sounds very similar to me with my own changes since I have gotten started in this. A dominant is just one of my identities. My own changes have been simply from a sterngthening of that identity and not from a loss of my other ones. I am still a chef when I go to work and still just "one of the guys" at the friendly card table.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 1/19/2007 1:08:34 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to toservez)

Post #: 13

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 1:10:42 PM

onestandingstill

Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline

Hi Mad Rabbit,
Yes absolutely this is just where I am after being in the life for two years.
It's very hard to go from an individual person to an image of your Dom with no image of your own without getting lost or losing things about you that you love along the way.
I'm sure my resistance comes from my baggage I won't or can't put down.
How do you not count, but yet you count???
It's burning my head up trying to figure out ow to still have me, but behave other than myself in public.
It's also hard to do things required of you in public knowing no one but the two of you knows why you're doing it.
When it does not mold to the public image of a sub, yet it's what a Dom requests of his sub it leaves the sub looking bad or toppy when in fact she's feeling persecuted and doing what the Dom said to the letter sometimes.
In all. this is right where I'm most confused and training hard too. I think my biggest question is how to be me, but in being a good sub, not care about my image because I'm like only his reflection and not a person with a will or rights to my image any more.
What I've been getting as good advice is when I Stand before the Master that I fully trust with my life, and I respect him enough to lead me this will be a non issue. Till then it's very possible it's a safety net I can't let go of till trust is established. Once I have that trust I'll trust his judgment and have no fear or qualms in this.
suzanne

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 14

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 1:17:01 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

Thank you, onestandingstill and a big thanks again to everyone. Been rereading all the posts and thinking and they have been very helpful in providing some insights into many past experiences and to see things in a different way.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to onestandingstill)

Post #: 15

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 1:34:12 PM

completenz

Posts: 315
Joined: 1/10/2007
Status: offline

i agree with what others have said
i belong to Him, heart,body and soul and the intensity of my submission can , at times, be a little scary. His love and control have, however, given me a freedom i never imagined. The freedom to be me
c

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 16

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 1:55:08 PM

slavejali

Posts: 2918
Status: offline

I think the fear based around loss of a sense of self is based on a person erroneous identification of self to begin with.

There is nothing of any real value that can be lost.

_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 17

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 3:22:17 PM

KeirasSecret

Posts: 415
Joined: 8/17/2006
From: central NH
Status: offline

At the risk of sounding like a horrible submissive, I might be able to shed some light on this for you.

When I first got with my Dom I was as new as new gets to D/s, and had no idea what I was looking for or what to expect. (My Dom knew this.)

At one point something came up, and I realized there were certain things that would cause moral dilemmas for me. One half of me knew I had committed myself to my Dom and wanted to be able to do what he wanted; the other half kept telling me it was wrong.

After much debate with myself, I concluded the only way I would succeed at such things was if I were to shut down my thinking and emotions about the topic at hand. I feared that if I did this I would not be able to start them up again (I would loose myself).

Eventually, I found a different way to think about it, by putting things into prospective:

i belong to Sir,
for i have, willingly, given myself to Him.
my body and mind are His
to do with as He sees fit.
i trust that He knows and will do what is best for me.
He will not harm me.

This helped me to remember I don’t have to want to do the task he has set before me; I don’t even really have to like it; all that matters is, I wish to please him, and he does not want to harm me.

I believe for me, trusting that he would not harm me, is what has been hardest.

Just my experience with it, don’t know if it will help.

Be well,

_____________________________

It apears to me, the practice of "an eye for an eye" has finally taken it's toll; the majority are now walking around blind.

Bitching; whining in a louder voice.

If the truth hurts, change it!

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 18

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/19/2007 4:21:37 PM

Hissltviolet

Posts: 44
Joined: 12/19/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

During a conversation with a submissive regarding her issues with giiving up control and submitting to the will of a dominant, she mentioned she was afraid of losing her sense of self by becomming devoted and focused on the needs and wants of the dominant. This was something I was at a bit of a failure to respond to so I was hoping perhaps some of the experienced slaves and submissives could shed some insight into this issue. Is the issue of forgetting one's sense of self a valid concern when a person is focusing on the needs and wants of another before their own?

She sounds like she is perhaps a novice? I know when I first began to explore with my former dominant and I realized how intense a power exchange could be, how all encompassing it could be, I was excited and scared all at the same time. It was a heady time for me. I think that it could be termed "sub frenzy". I even had trouble concentrating on my daily life.

Perhaps you can address what her specific concerns are? What would she fear giving up, what would she gain, is the trade worth it to her? If she is a novice she needs to be thinking about these things realistically, and I would not expect or encourage immediate answers, because the answers should come from within her, not what she thinks you "want" to hear. I can tell you, I felt this sense of sometimes being so alone when contemplating the loss of self. I do not think being submissive should mean the loss of self, it should be something that feels as though we are gaining the expression of who we are... it takes the right dominant person to see who we are, and honor that authentic person inside... if anything it only becomes enhanced!

If she is a novice, she is still finding out what her wants and needs in this world are, and if I were a dominant helping her explore that, I would tell her that her needs and desires matter and need to be straight in her mind before she jumps into giving up her sovereignty.

Good luck to both of you.

...OH!!!...i love the term 'sub frinzy'...and how you discribe how it was for you...perfectly discribes exactly what i am experiencing at the moment...thank you so much...<giggles>...i have been telling Master that i feel like i am 'insane'...ah...but...such a delicious insanity...every sensation is so delightfully overwhelming...i do not fear 'losing myself'...like so many others have said...to let go of 'self' is to actually 'find' self...just redefined in the blissful influence of the Master...nothing could be better...

<blushes>
wishes happiness to everyone!!!

_____________________________

ETERNALLY/INFERNALLY
Lord Bear's violet
(SLRN) 876-742-285
~**~
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and
http://www.freewebs.com/fabricconcepts/

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 19

RE: Fear of Losing Sense of One's Self - 1/20/2007 12:29:27 AM

BeautifulRacket

Posts: 70
Joined: 9/28/2006
From: Seattle Area
Status: offline

Great topic, Maddrabbit! My boy and I were just talking about this subject, and this thread is going to give us a ton of insight and far more to discuss, so thank you to all who have shared their thoughts here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: eroticBBWsub

I was also concerned about that in the beginning. But I took the risk, and like others have said, felt like I found myself by giving myself to him. I became totally devoted to him, I loved him, I gave him everything - my mind, my heart, and my body. I held nothing back and changed my entire life to serve him and be his.

Things were fine until he released me on Monday. It was out of the blue, it was overnight, it was shocking. He listed every time I had been confused or didnt understand things in the beginnig. He said cruel, hurtful things to me, and broke his most sacred promises to me. This was a R/T, 3 1/2 year relationship.

Now I am a released submissive, I am heart broken, I am in shock, I dont know what to do with myself now. This was my first Master and my first D/s relationship. My entire life was about serving him and pleasing him.. Without him now, who am I and what am I supposed to do???

I cant imagine ever doing this again, ever trusting someone to that degree, ever giving myself to someone like that. I lost myself in him and now having lost him, I feel like I have lost myself, that I am lost now.

I would tell any novice that its great when he holds you and wants you. Losing yourself and devoting yourself only to him is great while he still wants you. But when he changes his mind and releases you for no understandable reason, I dont think its worth the risk, or worth the pain. Now I need to figure out what to do now.

Wow. I'm so sorry you're hurting, Sweets! I can only guess that he was "kicking his dog" - hurting/punishing you for his own pain and demons. It sure sounds like you deserve far, far better.

The pain will recede, and a stronger, even more beautiful person will emerge. I always try to focus on the positive, namely what I learned and how I can apply that knowledge to improve myself and increase my happiness in the future. I have to grieve first, but that seems to help ease the pain for me. I'm sure you have/will find things that work for you, and above all, be incredibly good to yourself! Try to do at least one thing that's just for you and makes you feel good each day, and surround yourself with people who love you. Being a good sub takes an amazing amount of strength, so gather that up and keep telling yourself you'll be fine.

(in reply to eroticBBWsub)

Post #: 20

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