RE: Strong Submissives (Full Version)

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WulfMan -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/4/2005 1:28:37 PM)

*chuckles*
More often than not there are strong submissives in this world. Me for example, I don't let people step on me, if I did I probably wouldn't be alive today. If you look at the Military today, the subordinates, are technically submissive, but damn they are strong submissives. Speaking as a fellow brother in arms, we are the best, and there are many submissive lifestyle military men and women. This doesn't only apply to military members, I was just speaking from my own stand point.



liltxsubby -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/4/2005 1:38:52 PM)

My Dom has often siad that one of the things he finds attractive about me is that i don't take crap from anyone. That's something reserved especially for him. haha Actually, i don't take crap from him either. If i don't agree with something, i make sure he knows it. The decision ultimiately is his, but i voice my thoughts.

With others, i can be a sassy lil chit. He has earned my respect and trust and therefore i'm not (as) sassy with him. I learned early that up to a point it's cute but if i cross the line retribution is swift. I expect that from him, but if anyone tried walking all over me, no way i would let them.



krikket -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/4/2005 5:23:58 PM)

i, too, am a strong woman and a strong submissive. It's amazing the number of men who contact me promising that they don't like doormats, but when faced with a woman who doesn't bow down just because they call themselves doms or masters, they usually just fold.

The simple fact is, i love life. i love to explore the world around me, to share it with those i love and to laugh. i don't consider myself a S.A.M. i offer repect willingly and freely unless or until they prove differently (trust takes longer), but i have no patience for whinners and liars. i don't even mind wannabe's since i figure at some point in our lives most of us "wanted to be" something or other, and had to earn our stripes.

Because i haven't always looked at myself as a strong woman, now that i've discovered my own strengths, i don't plan on giving them up. For the right man, however, i know i can surrender and submit to him, and dream of the day that will happen. However, it's not something that's going to happen over night. i think that the strength i've discovered, when i do submit, will make it that much more meaningful than if i offered to everyone who came down the pike (so to speak..lol)

peace ~ joy
jiminie



PlayfulRaquel -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/4/2005 9:16:21 PM)

I agree with you. I use my strength as a test to find the right dom. I think it is my job as a sub to make him take control not simply give it to him. I find if he is the right dom he will appreciate the challenge and rise to it. I personally find doms that can handle strong submissives to be much more creative and interesting. As a dom put it to me. It is like putting a puzzle together. He enjoys finding ways to make a girl submissive without destroying her inner strength.



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 8:21:01 AM)

Well I agree that challenging people are more interesting, but that doesn't mean I MAKE myself into a challenge as a "test." This is a life relationship for me, life will test us more than enough. I find the idea of forcing things to be very unnatural and distasteful. If you can't find out someone's character and how you work together naturally, then it's not worth the effort to me.

MAKING the dom do something, even taking control, is essentially topping from the bottom to me. Any dom who would rise to that bait would be the wrong Owner for me. My job isn't to create trouble for them.

Strength is not equal to challenge. Strength can be quiet and unseen.



strongnsubmissiv -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 8:32:17 AM)

It's rather simple for me. I like being number 2. I enjoy being aggressive in sport and i'm far from passive in my professional life. This doesn't mean i'm not polite, i'm just not passive. I have opinions and don't mind sharing them. However in a word, i'd yield totally to the right person, number 1.

sns



GrandpaLash -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 3:52:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Manawyddan

I enjoy firey, intelligent partners who can speak their minds. Anyone else isn't worthy of my time. On the other hand, someone who consistently resists domination (once we're in agreement that we'll be participating in DS) past a certain point ... simply bores me. I don't feel the need to 'prove' how dominant I am to someone I am just beginning to know. My inclination would be to dismiss them and tell them to find someone more patient than I.


Precisely - a challenge to subdue, but not constant all-out war.

Grandpa Lash



Sunriselady -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 5:47:45 PM)

I too need to be assertive and in total control in my professional life. But with Master, I yield total control, willingly, because of the trust that is there. But I am NOT submissive or weak to any other. Master has told me he would have me no other way. For one reason it points out to others that one must be deserving of my submission, and He is. Also as He points out, if I were not strong with others, it would reflect on Him and His worthiness as Master.



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 7:32:42 PM)

Why is service to random people considered weak?

I am pretty much up for grabs, for service, for sexual use, for anyone anytime. It does not make me weak, it does not take away my worth, it only makes me what I am- an object to use as the Owner sees fit.

I understand the issue in people PRESUMING things that they should not, asking is always polite and simply allowing someones presumptions to go unchecked could lead to nastiness later. I also understand possessive owners, or not wanting to BE weak in terms of not being able to speak up for yourself and make yourself heard when necessary.

But I'm proof that you can serve anyone and everyone, be EXPECTED to service and be of use to everyone around you, and still be strong, still be polite, still be considered very valuable.



sterlingsweet -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 8:18:25 PM)

Hello Darthbetta.
I am an intelligent strong personality outwardly,
when I am with a Domina though I am very submissive.
But also my Domina has to be of the ilk to find temperance
with my "non-doormat" submissiveness.
I am not weak of mind and I need to communicate my truths.
So I feel like most others...My submission is a gift, and when I give
it I work very hard at making the dynamic fruitful, growth producing
and most of all worth my intermittent objections [:)][;)].



Alexander -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/5/2005 9:04:45 PM)

This is a hard one for me. Agreeing with what several people mentioned I think that age experience and obviously expectations play into this. I think that its also a consideration of individual style. When I used to spend my time at bars and bands and barbeques, I was all about the baddest ass punk girl I could find. I remember a hazy evening saying to someone, "shes the punkest girl I've ever been with." Now that I am older and moving along a professional life and treating it as if it were a conquest of it's own (to borrow one posters analogy), I need a girl trained in precise movements and mannerisms who can put them to work when appropriate. I'm being obvious I know. Basically I could just write, context matters. And it's an entirely different conversation if a girls strong spirit involves a continual effort to test or top. You have to start asking, how much of this is her personality and how much of it is willfull disobediance? In that equation, when does disrespect begin and how long do you want to keep asking yourself that question? Eventually she's running you if she's always got the initiative to test you.

Alex.



kyakitten -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 8:02:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

Well I agree that challenging people are more interesting, but that doesn't mean I MAKE myself into a challenge as a "test." This is a life relationship for me, life will test us more than enough.....Strength is not equal to challenge. Strength can be quiet and unseen.


EmeraldSlave,

I agree with you completely! Sure, challenge is interesting, but if life doesn't throw you enough challenges, try battling poverty, hunger, injustice, <<privacy invasions, groupthink, even the insanely high price for a high speed internet connection!>> - something that really deserves all your strength and power. Fighting your dom - unless for a very good reason - is just useless drama. Haven't we all got better things to do?



PlayfulRaquel -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 9:05:47 AM)

Well maybe it is just me but I have had my fair share of doms who claim to be strict in emails and on the phone, but when you meet them in real life they are anything but strict. I do believe a dom has to take your submission because if he values it he should earn it. I also think I have a duty as a submissive to keep him on his toes so to speak. Its not to say that once someone has proven to me that he is #1 that I don't fall inline because I do. When I'm being willful and chanllenging and he doesn't back down or shy away from this I know he is the right one. I know he is worth my gift of submission.



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 9:17:07 AM)

Ah that's a difference in outlook then.

It's my job to make LESS work for the Owner, to INCREASE their joy and happiness and be compliant with him at all times.

Creating a challenge, being consciously defiant and pushing him for my own judgements is absolutely wrong for me to do.

I agree that lots of doms couldn't take appropriate authority over me. But I don't need to push them and challenge them to find that out, I just get to know them and their style. I think the people who push tend to WANT the dom to react like they want, and instead of just accepting right off that they aren't for them, they see if they can force the issue.

This makes sense, before we get into bdsm the only way we can geto ur needs fulfilled is to try and push someone into it or be passive aggressive about it. When first getting into the scene, these habits stay with us and instead of being secure and waiting, we fall back onto those habits of trying to force the partner to do what we want- be authoritative, rather than just letting them be who they are and moving on.

If the person isn't who they are naturally, pushing won't solve the problem, it just makes me NOT obedient and serving my purpose, it makes them confused and irritated and they still won't be the right one for me.

I'm not suggesting slaves roll on their back every first time they meet if they dont feel like it, but actively challenging and becoming a nuisance doesn't help either. I know some doms LIKE being forced and topped in this way, so that would be a great match for the ones who like to force the issue.



RiotGirl -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 11:54:24 AM)

Access Denied



suberic -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 12:14:01 PM)

Well, I've skimmed this thread, so forgive me if I'm posting something that has been said already.

I'm reminded of some commentary from Shogun (the book) where the head Samuari (Toranaga) mentions that he likes controling peole and making them choose to come to his hand like a falcon.

And I think that's the key. I know I have a very strong will, and unless I was ordered by my lady to allow another to use me, I would look to her for everything. She took a lot of pride in displaying my submission to her in front of others, but I was expected to speak my mind to all those present, including all the doms. I was expected to have my opinion and to state them when necessary, but to submit to her orders and her wishes every time.

So having a strong will is not an issue, it's whom you choose to submit that will to when you finally pick a dom/me. I have chosen to submit to my lady. I defer to her in most things, speak my mind whenever I choose to, to serve and take care of her. I don't automatically bare my throat to any dom that comes along though.

I have chosen my pack leader, all others need not apply and will probably be attacked if they come around and try to boss me. It's not through anger or hatred or lack of submission, it's property rights.

A dom who does not own a particular sub/slave who tries to act as if they are the owner is stealing, pure and simple. No different than if a person went to another's home and used their razor and took home a punch bowl. That's theft. Same thing for the Sub who is being bossed by another Dom.

Just a series of thoughts, not even sure what I'm saying now. [:)]



stormiKnightBEAR -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 12:24:32 PM)


In reading this post, stormi must admit she sees more of herself than she truly wants and that leaves stormi feeling a mixture of failure
and sadness. That said somethings have come to mind that stormi would like to throw out for responses as well if you will allow. These
questions are the results of some of the responses posted so far.

Responses from both Masters/Dominates and submissives/slaves.

----If you are "testing" your Dominant to see if the strength is there to deal with a strong personality, are you with the right Dominant?

----If the answer is yes then why do you feel the need to "test"?

----How does one decide that the Dominant has "passed the test" and then manage to quit "testing" over and over?

----If you are active in the lifestyle do you not act like yourself all the time or are you only in "sub/slave" mode
when the Dominant is around? Note: the exception to this question for stormi would be work or vanilla settings.
That said even in vanilla settings it is still stormi's job to serve Master, order His meals and verify they are correct.

----What is the "attraction" to a Dominant to be tested daily? What makes a sub or slave worth the fight?

----When is it time to give up on a sub or slave that "test" you?

If you believe any or all of these are out of line, then please believe that was not the intent.
stormi is curious. stormi understands the personality, she has that hard as nails don't take the bull
if you can't hold the horns attitude. But stormi has found that she always has to have a "plan"
for the "if" Master decided He no longer wanted her. stormi has a need to retain some control in her life
because the fear of letting all control go and then being alone again and not knowing how to pick
up the pieces of herself and put them back together is overwhelming. As long as there is some sort
of place she can hold on to then she has a "starting" point.

So as you can tell.... stormi's weaknesses are fears of abandonment, being alone, never being slave
enough, never being a good reflection, and those are at the same time the very feelings that cause
disruption in stormi's life.

Please feel free to respond on or off board.

Off board you can reach stormi thru email - [email protected]


thanks
stormi
property of Master Bear







Youtalkingtome -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 1:04:45 PM)

This is why I am seeking a slave more than a submissive.This topic reminds me of my past marriage.I thought it was vanilla.But I have been learning that it wasn't.We were both Dominant and it was a battle for the entire seven years.I wouldn't want to be in another relationship and be in a battle for control.Hence the slave that I am looking for.She should test me in the begining and get to know one another to see if I am worthy of her submission but after that it shouldn't come up again.I am always Dominant even when I shouldn't be.Like at work with my boss or when getting pulled over for something I didn't do by the police.I am not intimidated by anyone or anything.I have been in the middle of a dog fight before.One being mine and a stray.It is not an on and off thing.I am always Dominant unless I am being very,very nice.Then you could say I am still Dominant because I am being very ,very nice for some reason.So I am still in control.
This reminds me of most vanilla marriages where the man is in control only when she lets him be.
And my two dogs.One being a female 8 year old mix and one being a male 18 months old.He thinks he is Dominant being young and bigger.But when she has had enough of his crap she puts him in his place.
So i do agree with a few posters like EmeraldSlave2,Alexander,kyakitten,RiotGirl,and stormiKnightBEAR.And maybe one or two others.
In no way am I putting down subnovi or DarthBetta.
Just not the relationship for me.Seams more like a Dom/switch than Master/slave relationship to me.



domtimothy46176 -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 2:01:35 PM)

For myself, it's an easy equation. I want intelligence, sophistication, capability, education and resourcefulness in a girl. I'm very clear about who and what I am and what I feel I have to offer. Beyond that, it's her choice whether or not she's interested in serving me. If she likes the package, great, we call discuss the details. If not, good luck to her with her search. I'm not playing needlessly melodramtic power games with anyone. If she doesn't want to serve in the approved manner, she can take her games down the road. I don't consider myself strict or intolerant, insensitive or cruel. It's an exchange and she either wants to make the deal or she doesn't. Once she signs on the dotted line it's only a question of whether or not we each hold up our respective ends of the agreement. Testing is something that takes place in the weeks and months prior to making a commitment, not afterwards.
Timothy



PlayfulRaquel -> RE: Strong Submissives (3/6/2005 7:57:24 PM)

I think this is a matter of miscommunication. lol I use my strenght to test the dom before becoming his submissive. I'm not trying to push anyone anywhere. I think your wrong when you say life is already a test why should this be as well. This is one of the things that should definately be a test. You are giving someone a great deal of trust to let them make decisions for you. And they in turn are taking on huge responsiblility to be accountable for your safety and security. If anything in your life should be a test this should. And how do you know how someone would truely react in a situation until they are in it. This lifestyle is full of great actors who tell you everything you want to hear but seldom do they ever live up to the hype. I think maybe our experiences with the lifestyle may differ and that is where the our different views seem to be coming from. But I also think that for every different kind of dom there is a different type of sub. I believe in serving and being obiendant. I just want to make very sure the one I do this for is worth it.



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