RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate!

RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (Full Version)

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defiantbadgirl -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 2:06:09 PM)
I'm sure that was NOT only meant for my white European ancestors Stef.. However, at that time, there wasn't a combination of both outsourcing and immigration. If the US government wants to accept immigrants, that's fine as long as they ban outsourcing and bring all the overseas jobs back here. That way, there will be plenty of work, for Americans and immigrants alike.

stef -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 2:45:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl At that time, there wasn't a combination of both outsourcing and immigration. If the US government wants to accept immigrants, that's fine as long as they ban outsourcing and bring all the overseas jobs back here. That way, there will be plenty of work, for Americans and immigrants alike. First off, I think you misunderstand what outsourcing is. If you're referring to jobs moving to countries outside of the US, that's not not outsourcing, that's offshoring. There is also offshore outsourcing, but that's another kettle of fish entirely. If you're going to repeatedly rant on a topic, you might want to take a minute and make sure you're actually using the right terms if you want to be taken seriously on any level. Now that we have that settled, you might as well wish for it to rain Krugerrands, because offshoring is not going to be banned and you can't force companies to hire only American employees. If that ever were to happen, you could expect entire companies to leave the US and then you would really have something to cry about. Finally, have you even bothered to look at the national unemployment figures? Since 2003, unemployment rates have decreased each month, each year. Offshoring doesn't appear to be the drastic problem you would have us all believe. Be defiant if you want, but at least try and be intelligent about it. ~stef

meatcleaver -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 2:49:50 PM)
7,000 in a country and an economy the size of the US's can't even be considered a drop in the ocean. It's not even the full compliment of an aircraft carrier crew.

defiantbadgirl -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 3:24:39 PM)
The figures on the unemployment rate are not what you think. Someone can work 10 hours a week and they wouldn't fall into the category of unemployed. Someone can mow two lawns a week at $20 per lawn.......a total of $40/week income and they aren't unemployed. Tell all the IT workers that used to make $60,000/yr and are now flipping burgers that there isn't a problem. Tell that to the auto manufacturers who lost their jobs when the positions were sent overseas. You insult my intelligence when you can't see a problem that's going on all around you. You might be right about companies completely moving overseas if all the government did was ban outsourcing and off-shoring. However, if the owner of the company was banned from moving his company overseas unless he moved overseas with it, I'm fairly certain that wouldn't happen. Could you imagine a company president or CEO moving his wife and 4 children to China where only 1 child per couple is allowed? After all, if he lives in that country, he is subject to their laws.

krikket -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 3:58:24 PM)
I just saw a report on ABC news about the 7,000 Iraqians the government is considering to allow into the country. The article focused on who "some" of them will be -- the people who translated for our armies and are now in danger of being killed. Specifically they interviewed a man who had been badly hurt in while doing his job, who was sent out of his own country for medical help. He's missing a leg and fingers, and he can no longer go about with our troops, and while his face wasn't shown it tore at my heart to see anyone who has been thru the horror he obviously experienced. I don't know how true the story is, but being the eternal optimist i want to believe it's true. If that's the case i don't have a problem with the policy. However, part of my job is to monitor non-resident aliens who want to come into the US to become actors, singers, etc. i see abuse of the system at every turn -- abuse that is often aided and abetted by the people who help them file the papers (attorneys and other visa "mill" companies) so i don't trust too much anymore.

PoisonRoses -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 4:30:29 PM)
some people seem to show their ignorance by trying to appear smart.. ~wink wink stef~ doubt the people who have lost their jobs and benefits and have had to settle for something less find it not to be a 'drastic problem'.

stef -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 4:42:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl The figures on the unemployment rate are not what you think. Someone can work 10 hours a week and they wouldn't fall into the category of unemployed. Someone can mow two lawns a week at $20 per lawn.......a total of $40/week income and they aren't unemployed. No, they're lazy. They might not be able to get their dream job, but there is ALWAYS work out there for people willing to do it. There is no excuse for an able bodied person to only make $40/week. NONE. quote: Tell all the IT workers that used to make $60,000/yr and are now flipping burgers that there isn't a problem. Boo hoo, have a tissue. If an IT worker was making 60k and they could only get a job flipping burgers after the bust, then they might not have deserved that 60k job in the first place. During the tech boom, far too many people ended up working tech jobs that had marginal skills at best because companies needed warm bodies more than they needed skilled workers. Anyone who knew how to install a mousepad could get an IT job back then. When the tech bust hit, guess who was the first to go. So some of them had to take less "glamorous" jobs. Tough titties. In the words of the Honorable Judge Elihu Smails, "the world needs ditch diggers too." If they want a better job, they need to increase their skill set and marketability just like everyone else on the planet. There are still plenty of tech jobs out there. Our company is looking to hire somewhere in the neighborhood of 400 people in the next 12-16 months, 3/4 of them will be hardcore tech positions. We're interviewing people in my group every day for the 16 open positions here alone. I don't expect we'll be hiring many burger flippers though, we're looking for rockstars. quote: Tell that to the auto manufacturers who lost their jobs when the positions were sent overseas. Tell it to the executives that run those companies who are producing such a sub-standard product that they're losing millions of dollars in sales every year. They are trying to save their asses after gorging themselves at the trough for too many years while the other countries' auto manufacturers started producing vastly superior products. Be angry if you want, but at least direct that anger at the right people. quote: You might be right about companies completely moving overseas if all the government did was ban outsourcing and off-shoring. However, if the owner of the company was banned from moving his company overseas unless he moved overseas with it, I'm fairly certain that wouldn't happen. Could you imagine a company president or CEO moving his wife and 4 children to China where only 1 child per couple is allowed? After all, if he lives in that country, he is subject to their laws. First, good luck banning a company from moving. Second, Your CEO fable is irrelevant. That restriction applies to new births, not existing families. Even if it did, I'm sure allowances would be made for individuals who bring profitable companies into their country. ~stef

MzMia -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 8:08:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: krikket I just saw a report on ABC news about the 7,000 Iraqians the government is considering to allow into the country. The article focused on who "some" of them will be -- the people who translated for our armies and are now in danger of being killed. Specifically they interviewed a man who had been badly hurt in while doing his job, who was sent out of his own country for medical help. He's missing a leg and fingers, and he can no longer go about with our troops, and while his face wasn't shown it tore at my heart to see anyone who has been thru the horror he obviously experienced. I don't know how true the story is, but being the eternal optimist i want to believe it's true. If that's the case i don't have a problem with the policy. However, part of my job is to monitor non-resident aliens who want to come into the US to become actors, singers, etc. i see abuse of the system at every turn -- abuse that is often aided and abetted by the people who help them file the papers (attorneys and other visa "mill" companies) so i don't trust too much anymore. I hope you are right Krikket, I find it hard to believe with so many coming that they ALL have Americans best interest at heart.

farglebargle -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 8:11:27 PM)
quote: you can't force companies to hire only American employees If they've applied for a license or permit to do business, or registered as a LLC, LLP, Corporation, etc, then you can impose whatever regulation you wish. No one forced them to apply for special status to conduct business, and the benefits of being an Artificial Legal Entity do come at a price. That price? Whatever The People decide. So it's perfectly reasonable to expect that The People could dictate to companies who they can hire, say to deliver service within New York State. Tariffs are a hell of a lot easier, though. Imagine if the Federal Government was cut only to those things explicitly specified in the Constitution, then via Tariffs, the US Govt could be self financing. I'll repeat that. No Federal Income Taxes.

cloudboy -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 8:25:52 PM)
To some people, the Statue of Liberty has its finger raised to foreigners. I think her insinuation is a sick one.

popeye1250 -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 10:47:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stef quote: ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl Oh my gosh. There are too few jobs for Americans as it is due to outsourcing. The last thing we need is more immigrants. What is the eventual goal, to keep bringing in immigrants until every American worker becomes unemployed because immigrants work cheaper? The New Colossus Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame, With conquering limbs astride from land to land; Here at our sea-washed sunset gates shall stand A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame Is the imprisoned lightening, and her name Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame. "Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door." -Emma Lazarus, 1883 Do you feel that was only meant for your white, european ancestors? Oh my gosh, indeed. ~stef Ok, so a second-rate Poet writes that stuff in the 19th century and some people think it's Policy? That poem is one person's observation of the times. Gee, I guess nothing's changed in this country since 1883 eh? In the 1880's we needed immigration, today we no longer do. Oh, the owners of fast food restaurants need it so they can make a killing then the taxpayers get to pay the medical, dental, and other expenses for those fast food owners employees. And for how long are those 7,000 Iraqis going to be our guests and how much are they going to cost us? The U.S. Taxpayer gets screwed again it looks like. You know Stef, I moved out of the Boston area after having grown up there because of things like the Kennedy crime family, stupid laws, and the nieve, uninformed world view that many in that area hold as well as for many other reasons.

luckydog1 -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 11:04:25 PM)
"If they've applied for a license or permit to do business, or registered as a LLC, LLP, Corporation, etc, then you can impose whatever regulation you wish. No one forced them to apply for special status to conduct business, and the benefits of being an Artificial Legal Entity do come at a price. That price? Whatever The People decide. So it's perfectly reasonable to expect that The People could dictate to companies who they can hire, say to deliver service within New York State. Tariffs are a hell of a lot easier, though. Imagine if the Federal Government was cut only to those things explicitly specified in the Constitution, then via Tariffs, the US Govt could be self financing. I'll repeat that. No Federal Income Taxes. " The right to regulate the citizenship status of employees of private bussiness is not explicitly specified in the constitution. And you are also wrong, the gov does require people to get a liscence to engage in bussiness. In your list you mix corparations with regular bussiness, very sloppy thinking or intentionally trying to mislead. And the people can not decide to impose "any regulation" they desire. The Constitution specifically prohibits that.

Zensee -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 11:07:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 OK, let's all look at this BIG picture here. We're "freeing" Iraq so that those people can live there, correct? If that's so could someone then tell me why we're bringing Iraqis to the U.S.??? I don't know? Maybe it has something to do with the USA fucking Iraq up so badly that there are 4,000,000 displaced persons there now? Or is that picture too big for you? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6339835.stm Z.

popeye1250 -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 11:32:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zensee quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 OK, let's all look at this BIG picture here. We're "freeing" Iraq so that those people can live there, correct? If that's so could someone then tell me why we're bringing Iraqis to the U.S.??? I don't know? Maybe it has something to do with the USA fucking Iraq up so badly that there are 4,000,000 displaced persons there now? Or is that picture too big for you? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6339835.stm Z. Zensee, can you ever answer a simple question or is that too difficult for you?

UtopianRanger -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/14/2007 11:41:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MzMia Wonderful question pahunkboy, Bush will allow 7000 in legally. The ones that can't get in that way....well. Many people never mention that they have caught people from all over the world crossing through Mexico. I don't know why people think only those from South America come through Mexico. Texas Sheriffs Say Terrorists Entering US from Mexico -- 08/21/2006 They certainly come from all over the world and then come into the USA from Mexico. This is why '' The war on terror '' is a complete and utter fallacy. And this why Americans and people in Britain need to wake up and smell the coffee. It's time to see the tricksters for exactly what they are. If there was truly a war on terror and they were worried about dirty bombs, suit case nukes, biological agents or VX gas being smuggled into our country, the first thing to be accomplished by any prudent group of managers in charge of security and the greater welfare of the citizenry would be to tackle all external security measures and secure our borders. They've done absolutely nothing in this regard. Take ten acquaintances that you know on the net, go into a chat room, pose the hypothetical above about protecting our citizenry, assign each person in the group a post in the hierarchy that's committed to the task at hand. Someone here then tell me that a consensus objective wouldn't be to close and maintain the security of our borders. Then ask yourself why our government is not doing what you would do. Trust me….regardless of how much you’ve been brainwashed, it’s certainly not because they are smarter than you. - R

asubmissiveheart -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/15/2007 7:40:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger quote: ORIGINAL: MzMia Wonderful question pahunkboy, Bush will allow 7000 in legally. The ones that can't get in that way....well. Many people never mention that they have caught people from all over the world crossing through Mexico. I don't know why people think only those from South America come through Mexico. Texas Sheriffs Say Terrorists Entering US from Mexico -- 08/21/2006 They certainly come from all over the world and then come into the USA from Mexico. This is why '' The war on terror '' is a complete and utter fallacy. And this why Americans and people in Britain need to wake up and smell the coffee. It's time to see the tricksters for exactly what they are. If there was truly a war on terror and they were worried about dirty bombs, suit case nukes, biological agents or VX gas being smuggled into our country, the first thing to be accomplished by any prudent group of managers in charge of security and the greater welfare of the citizenry would be to tackle all external security measures and secure our borders. They've done absolutely nothing in this regard. Take ten acquaintances that you know on the net, go into a chat room, pose the hypothetical above about protecting our citizenry, assign each person in the group a post in the hierarchy that's committed to the task at hand. Someone here then tell me that a consensus objective wouldn't be to close and maintain the security of our borders. Then ask yourself why our government is not doing what you would do. Trust me….regardless of how much you’ve been brainwashed, it’s certainly not because they are smarter than you. - R I agree the war on terror is a joke, they might as well bring everyone from Iraq to the USA.

meatcleaver -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/15/2007 7:47:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger This is why '' The war on terror '' is a complete and utter fallacy. And this why Americans and people in Britain need to wake up and smell the coffee. It's time to see the tricksters for exactly what they are. I've been fuming since the day of the invasion. The American and British establishments are rotten to the core. Nothing makes me more angry than people who rationalise away the truth about this war. I am never sure if they just don't want to face the truth or truely believe there was justification for the war. If those people who are responsible for this war get away with it, I hate to think of what other wars will follow. I think the whole socio-political systems of America and Britain must be corrupt and rotten for this war to have been allowed to happen. Both countries have lost their souls in this war.

MzMia -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/15/2007 10:59:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger quote: ORIGINAL: MzMia Wonderful question pahunkboy, Bush will allow 7000 in legally. The ones that can't get in that way....well. Many people never mention that they have caught people from all over the world crossing through Mexico. I don't know why people think only those from South America come through Mexico. Texas Sheriffs Say Terrorists Entering US from Mexico -- 08/21/2006 They certainly come from all over the world and then come into the USA from Mexico. This is why '' The war on terror '' is a complete and utter fallacy. And this why Americans and people in Britain need to wake up and smell the coffee. It's time to see the tricksters for exactly what they are. If there was truly a war on terror and they were worried about dirty bombs, suit case nukes, biological agents or VX gas being smuggled into our country, the first thing to be accomplished by any prudent group of managers in charge of security and the greater welfare of the citizenry would be to tackle all external security measures and secure our borders. They've done absolutely nothing in this regard. Take ten acquaintances that you know on the net, go into a chat room, pose the hypothetical above about protecting our citizenry, assign each person in the group a post in the hierarchy that's committed to the task at hand. Someone here then tell me that a consensus objective wouldn't be to close and maintain the security of our borders. Then ask yourself why our government is not doing what you would do. Trust me….regardless of how much you’ve been brainwashed, it’s certainly not because they are smarter than you. - R Well stated I see no real war on terror, except what they are doing on airlines. In fact, if you notice lately you only hear the rhetoric in regards to the Middle East. I guess we have solved the war on terror here.

Zensee -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/15/2007 12:43:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zensee I don't know? Maybe it has something to do with the USA fucking Iraq up so badly that there are 4,000,000 displaced persons there now? Or is that picture too big for you? quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Zensee, can you ever answer a simple question or is that too difficult for you? I thought that because you owe them was a simple enough answer. Seems I overestimated. You still seem to believe that the USA is doing Iraq and the world a favour. Bush's strategy has increased terrorism and decreased security for everyone. Accepting 7,000 refugees is the very least the USA can do to compensate Iraqis for waging war in their country. Z.

farglebargle -> RE: Welcome Neighbors! Bush to allow 7000 Iraquis to immigrate! (2/15/2007 1:00:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: luckydog1 "If they've applied for a license or permit to do business, or registered as a LLC, LLP, Corporation, etc, then you can impose whatever regulation you wish. No one forced them to apply for special status to conduct business, and the benefits of being an Artificial Legal Entity do come at a price. That price? Whatever The People decide. So it's perfectly reasonable to expect that The People could dictate to companies who they can hire, say to deliver service within New York State. Tariffs are a hell of a lot easier, though. Imagine if the Federal Government was cut only to those things explicitly specified in the Constitution, then via Tariffs, the US Govt could be self financing. I'll repeat that. No Federal Income Taxes. " The right to regulate the citizenship status of employees of private bussiness is not explicitly specified in the constitution. True. For the Federal Venue. But look at my example. Nothing says the State can't regulate as they see fit. ( Unless your State constitution has a prohibition. ) And you are also wrong, the gov does require people to get a liscence to engage in bussiness. In your list you mix corparations with regular bussiness, very sloppy thinking or intentionally trying to mislead. And the people can not decide to impose "any regulation" they desire. The Constitution specifically prohibits that. NO. YOU can do whatever you want to earn money, without filing for LLC, LLP, Corporate, or other special status. Just make sure to report your income property. You may or may not need 1099's. Consult your CPA. And you probably need to collect State Sales Tax. Make sure you do that, too. The only thing you miss out on is the limited liability, tax breaks, and regulation. The feds don't count. Think about WHO do you go to register your corp with? That's right. The Secretary of State wherever that corp is registered in. The People of That State OWN your Artificial Legal Entity's ass.

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