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Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 11:19:07 AM

stormsfate

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In another thread that I didn't wish to hijack, BeachMystress said with regard to a Pro Domme:

quote:

Tip offs ... they do not have a selection of toys -part of being a Pro is providing the tools used on the submissive... -

I am curious as to how prevalent toys sharing is. I know plenty of people who don't think twice about it, but we do not share our toys, nor do we borrow toys from others unless we are fluid bonded with them.

When I was first brought into this lifestyle many years ago, it was one of the first things I was taught...have your *own* toys as sharing toys can fluid bond you to someone you may not wish to be fluid bonded with. Someone might have a cut or get one during play, sweat, or if the toy is used in an area where other bodily fluids are present, etc. Leather in particular is porous and difficult to sanitize.

best regards,
fate

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 11:34:16 AM

CitizenCane

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Your approach is maximally prudent, fate. Realistically, however, most pathogens don't survive well outside the body, and to have any hope of surviving for very long would require substantial protection from air and light, let alone soap or bleach. If toys are clean and haven't been used for awhile, there are only a handful of pathogens that could possibly survive on them, most of them fungal in nature. Sharing during a session is, of course, likely to lead to fluid bonding.

I think the main area of concern besides insertables would be leather items worn against the crotch- since the inside surface of leather doesn't clean that well. The outside can be cleaned pretty thoroughly and polished or conditioned, a process that not much can survive. Aside from this, I think the risks are statistically much lower than driving a car. Which is no reason at all to share toys. Be prudent, just don't be paranoid.

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 12:33:38 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CitizenCane

Be prudent, just don't be paranoid.

I feel this way as well. There is guite a lot of justified fear around this issue that can escalate into paranoia. I believe in playing safe, I just don't think I need to be contained in a latex bubble to protect myself...
That being said, as a single subbie, who plays with more than one partner, I DO follow safer sex guidelines. I also came up with a way to ensure my own comfort level...
I supply my own set of toys.
Whartenburg Wheel, Vampire Gloves, vibes...etc. I also keep a handful of condoms in my bag. My partners use these on me as opposed to their own toys.
(Of course, I don't include floggers and paddles as an absolute, if they have their own favourites, but I do have a set of my own for them to use on me. Which also gives them the ease of choosing toys they know I'll enjoy.)
This way, I clean and care for the toys that go into my body, or may get traces of blood on them. This control factor gives me peace of mind.
I think it's important that submissives take responsibility for their health and safety and not shrug it off as "My dom/me will keep me safe. They would never let anything harm me!" That's just plain denial. No one is infallible...

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 12:53:27 PM

stormsfate

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I'll be the first to admit my lack of knowledge in the bloodborne pathogens department, but your post made me curious, CitizenCane, so I thought I'd spend a few minutes looking into it a bit. I learned that HIV is pretty fragile and can't survive outside the body for very long, but Hepatitis, on the other hand, "can survive for long periods of time outside the human body" and "some bacteria that can form spores may survive for many years."

I certainly don't advocate paranoia in this regard (or any other for that matter as I'm simply not that dramatic...lol), but having cleaned toys on a regular basis for an extended period of time, it just seems to me that it *is* prudent to use some care in this area. If someone with Hepatitis C has a pimple on their bottom and it starts to bleed during a flogging...even if the flogger had been wiped down with leather cleaner/conditioner, would you want to have it used on you? Just food for thought :)

best regards,
fate

*Edited to correct user link

< Message edited by stormsfate -- 3/21/2005 12:55:43 PM >

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 4:22:32 PM

CitizenCane

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As I said, be prudent. However, hepatitis and sporulating bacteria generally require some medium in which persist outside the body, or at least to form spores. This reduces the risk of transmission dramatically. Floggers are not easy to clean, and with a leather flogger you can't control which surface (inner or outer) will be making contact, so the issues I mentioned about the inner surface of leather are pertinent. Personally, I don't care to be flogged period, and knowing that someone has hepatitis would reduce my desire to play with them pretty much to nil- but the truth is that risk of transmission from a well-cleaned paddle would be minimal. The kinds of pathogens you are concerned about would be more likely to be spread from, say, bottom to top, by exhalations, splatter, or casual physical contact with bottom or furnishings during a scene, than from bottom to bottom between scenes. A full program of disease avoidance for tops would include Tyvek moon suits and respirators. I'm not saying there is NO RISK from sharing a paddle or a strap that's been attentively cleaned, just that it's low. Dining out is also a risky behavior when one considers the possible pathogens to be aquired that way, but in practice the risk is fairly low. And you don't have a clue what that minimum-wage cook in the back has been shooting up, or who he's been sleeping with, or what's currently running out of his nose. I'm not criticizing anyone who wishes to use only their own toys, or wear protective gear during a scene, or whatever. I like the look of latex, anyway.

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 9:06:54 PM

Gemeni

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I've never been a casual player,and tend to make my own leather toys etc......

I don't keep old toys when a relationship ends-I clean them and get rid of them. I've seen casual playing Tops use the same impact toys on several bottoms in a row at clubs-with NO attempt at cleaning in between-and it makes me shudder to see this level of irresponsibility on thier parts.

Often they do this with TOTAL strangers they just met,and they have NO idea what diseases they may have. I admit that I don't get it. But my paranoia does have one postive effect. I don't have std's, period-and I will not.

< Message edited by Gemeni -- 3/21/2005 9:09:58 PM >

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 9:15:44 PM

Kinkypupper

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Many toys are just to expensive.. I have met quite a few females who will not even sit on a sybian because its been "used" .
As long as all toys are cleaned before and after buy the sub I have no problem with it
But i also do not do blood play at all. And i do not play with just anyone.
It is more of a female based concern then a male on as those "toys" are going IN her in some cases.
If any leather item has been used that draws blood then it Should be segregated to that person even after its been cleaned and sanitized. but as far as other "toys" electrical plugs, clips, insertables.. then as long as the "useder" cleans them both before and after each play that should alay their fears

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/21/2005 11:27:26 PM

SherriA

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kinkypupper

It is more of a female based concern then a male on as those "toys" are going IN her in some cases.

***newsflash*** Men have orifices that can be entered too. ***newsflash***

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/24/2005 4:09:50 PM

FLButtSlut

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I have had this discussion with friends, and we all agree that we don't want "insertables" that have been used elsewhere. I hope that someone would clean their toy before even showing it to me, but it just grosses me out to think of them having inserted that dildo, vibrator, butt plug in someone else!

Having had this discussion, we also have realized that a good portion of the "gross out" is psychological, as we allow a man to use his own "toy" on us. Even with a condom, they aren't completely covered, and certainly we know that (most likely) they have used that somewhere else! Guess I like the mental thinking of any toys brought for play with me were purchased with ME in mind, not the other people he has been involved with in the past.

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RE: Other people's toys.... - 3/25/2005 9:42:32 AM

MrThorns

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I'm very protective of my toys. I have allowed someone else to "try them out" with my supervision, but typically it's someone I know very well and I have a measure of respect for. I wouldn't allow someone else to use my toys in a scene, unless they were being used on my own slave...and of course, with me present to observe.

~Thorns

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