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Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/21/2005 7:08:40 PM

harmony3709

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I have difficulty completely letting go during a scene, and for the purposes of this question/topic, I am specifically talking about in a scene versus a relationship. I may go very deep and reach subspace, but typically I will kind of float in and out, because there is a part of me that is still hanging on and will sort of awaken and pull me back out as I go deeper. I've also been told that it appears I am holding back. This happens even with a Dom who is a close friend and my ex-Dom and I trust with my safety. I have met other submissives who also have had this problem, either occasionally or like me, the majority of the time, and the discussions usually end with most of us expressing frustration at the problem and the lack of any possible solution.

My question is, is this something that can possibly be overcome in a scene, perhaps one particularly intense? Or is this something that is better handled out of scene or even just will come with experience and time? Can this be viewed as a boundary that needs to be crossed and negotiate a scene with a (trusted) Dom who could use the desire to completely let go as a goal for the scene?

I noticed that as my play experience increased and I had achieved sub space, it was easier for me to go deep and go into space, so I look at that as learning to let go to some degree. That is is why I thought that maybe a scene planned specifically with the goal of completely and totally letting go might sort of break that barrier.

Any thoughts or suggestions very much appreciated.

harmony

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/21/2005 8:21:14 PM

FangsNfeet

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Advice is to take things one step at a time. Build up to it. Let's use anal sex as an example. Maybe you don't was to take it all the way so you first start with the head, then half way. Later you might build up to taking it all. Same with blow jobs and deep throating the cock. It may just take time to stop your gag reflex.

Unfourtonatly I don't know where the line is being drawn. All I can say is to continue to communicate with your Dom and see about slow building up to whatever you plan on letting go of.

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/21/2005 8:54:36 PM

sweetpoison

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greetings to you.....

in my experience i have seen this many times as we all perhaps from time to time may have experienced this as submissives...the mind/body naturally holds back to a point of the unknown.....with a hint of insecurity or fear... until the body...mind and soul is conditioned to let go .......are on the same level.....of security...and assurance

it can be a learning process.....small steps......within a scene....perhaps a simple scene that can take you to the levels of subspace and then back again...... with each time allowing you to go deeper and deeper..as the next step in the scene become more intense... the scene should be very well thought out and discussed in complete detail so that the mind can obsorb the facts and knows that all will be controlled and secure.

just my thoughts only.....best of luck to you....

blessed eve and safe journeys always,
sweetpoison

< Message edited by sweetpoison -- 3/21/2005 8:56:25 PM >

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/21/2005 10:16:37 PM

harmony3709

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I like the idea of small steps even during one scene, and going deeper a bit at a time. I hadn't thought of it quite that way and that could help me to explain what it is I'm looking for in negotiating the scene. Giving up completely is something I've struggled with for about a year, since that was when it became apparent to me that I would reach a certain point and then kind of plateau there. I am not involved in a relationship at this time, but I have several Doms/Tops I scene with occasionally (one being an ex-Dom of mine) and they are who I have considered asking to do a scene with this in mind.

Thanks for the input, sweetpoison and fangs.

harmony

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 5:45:48 AM

topcat

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quote:

My question is, is this something that can possibly be overcome in a scene, perhaps one particularly intense?

Middear Harmony-

It's very simple. No matter what, just don't think of a blue elephant<g>.

But seriously, being aware of the fact that you are not letting go keeps you from letting go. There are a few ways to get past this, but it's going to take a certain level of intensity that I might balk at in a casual scene. Pain is easy and effective in most cases- but not 'everyday' sort of pain. Deep, prolonged agony, sustained at a high enough level will break down any barrier to your surrender.

Outside of that, I'd consider a long period of enforced helplessness, firm but not uncomfortable bondage, a blindfold, a small bit of torment applied with an certain impersonal air on the part of the top. Time consuming, but definately effective.

The real question is- do you really want to go there? the bonds formed in such a scene can be shockingly deep, and amazingly persistent. Proably worth the price of the self discovery involved, but something to be considered.

Stay Warm,
Lawrence

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 8:23:18 AM

ProtagonistLily

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quote:

I have difficulty completely letting go during a scene, and for the purposes of this question/topic, I am specifically talking about in a scene versus a relationship. I may go very deep and reach subspace, but typically I will kind of float in and out, because there is a part of me that is still hanging on and will sort of awaken and pull me back out as I go deeper. I've also been told that it appears I am holding back. This happens even with a Dom who is a close friend and my ex-Dom and I trust with my safety. I have met other submissives who also have had this problem, either occasionally or like me, the majority of the time, and the discussions usually end with most of us expressing frustration at the problem and the lack of any possible solution.

Harmony, you may have personal expectations for yourself that may not be achievable. I think one of the most important things I try to remember is that I can't compare myself to other submissives and how they react to their sessions. Physiology plays an enormous part in how we react to WIIWD, and some of us, for what ever reason, may not be able to achieve a level of space that others may. I think it's counter productive to a degree to expect yourself to react in ways that you aren't, and to feel bad about that is more pressure than you deserve.

quote:

My question is, is this something that can possibly be overcome in a scene, perhaps one particularly intense? Or is this something that is better handled out of scene or even just will come with experience and time? Can this be viewed as a boundary that needs to be crossed and negotiate a scene with a (trusted) Dom who could use the desire to completely let go as a goal for the scene?

Topcat offered some excellent suggestions on how you might force yourself to alter your reactions and achieve a deeper space. Though I'm not so sure that following those techniques will help you achieve what you appear to want. As you described above, your reactions vary with both casual and close Tops. There may be a reason that your psyche is holding you at bay and not allowing you to go where you'd like. I don't know if that's true, but it's certainly something to consider.

quote:

I noticed that as my play experience increased and I had achieved sub space, it was easier for me to go deep and go into space, so I look at that as learning to let go to some degree. That is is why I thought that maybe a scene planned specifically with the goal of completely and totally letting go might sort of break that barrier.

A scene planned with a specific goal might be what you need to go to this place you want to. However, I think it's important to realize that it may not help you go there too. With expectations high, you may be disappointed and the let down may not be something you want either.

My personal feeling is, there is no magic recipe to go into sub space. I have had satisfying scenes where I didn't space or deeply space. I've managed, for what ever reason, to enjoy 90% of the scenes I've ever done regardless of whether I hit space or not. For me to expect to hit subspace every time, for that space to be identical from scene to scene for me is unrealistic.

I have found in my experience the fewer expectations I have about a scene, the easier it is for me to enjoy the moment, be present and allow the Top to dictate where the scene goes.

My 2 cents worth,
Lily

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 3:46:00 PM

harmony3709

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quote:

Outside of that, I'd consider a long period of enforced helplessness, firm but not uncomfortable bondage, a blindfold, a small bit of torment applied with an certain impersonal air on the part of the top. Time consuming, but definately effective.

I'm curious about the "impersonal air on the part of the top". While I think I understand what you mean by that, I'm not sure I understand the why behind it.

quote:

The real question is- do you really want to go there? the bonds formed in such a scene can be shockingly deep, and amazingly persistent. Proably worth the price of the self discovery involved, but something to be considered.

This is a good question and one I have asked myself often. I admit that I am concerned about all the aspects of the after effects of a scene such as this one and am debating on whether as you say, it's worth the price of the self discovery. I think that the discussion with whomever I may ask to do a scene like this with me will focus on the potential of some fall out from the scene, as well as if they are willing to assist with that.

What I am hoping for is not only this one scene and reaching a point I haven't been able to reach as of yet, but also that by doing so, scenes in the future will be more fulfilling (for lack of a better word), although I realize that of course that every scene isn't the "Calgon take me away" kind of scene, lol.

Thanks for the input, your comments are very much appreciated.

harmony

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 3:56:59 PM

harmony3709

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quote:

There may be a reason that your psyche is holding you at bay and not allowing you to go where you'd like. I don't know if that's true, but it's certainly something to consider.

This may very well be the case and I admit that this is why I have wondered whether to just kind of "let it go", meaning don't TRY to get to a certain point, just take each scene for what it is, or possibly not even scene at all for a while. (Although I only occasionally play now, nothing on a regular basis.) However, the last couple of times I played, one of which as fairly intense, I literally was much more aware of it. I guess I was thinking of the blue elephant, lol.

I understand what you mean by not comparing to other subs, and as a rule I don't, the only thing I found rather strange is that for those I have talked to who understand this feeling of holding back or not letting go completely, they feel the same frustration that I do and also this kind of just dealing with it, as opposed to doing something constructive to possibly move past it.

I have had Doms who have worked to help me push through limits or overcome boundaries, etc., with very good results. I guess that's why I thought that perhaps if I looked at this in the same way, I might have a similar outcome.

Thanks, Lily, and you gave me some things to think about, which is something I always appreciate, as well as constructive advice.

harmony

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 4:33:04 PM

topcat

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quote:

I'm curious about the "impersonal air on the part of the top". While I think I understand what you mean by that, I'm not sure I understand the why behind it.

Midear Harmony-

well consider- you are bound, blindfolded, helpless- you have to ask for help to go to the bathroom, to drink or eat. Then, when he hurts you, it's done with an off hand, impersonal air- not becuase you want it- not even because he wants to so much- it's just something he is doing- not really careing that it hurts you-

What does that do to your head?

What happens when the scene isn't really about you at all- when it is just something happening and you just happen to be the thing it is happening to?

Stay warm,
Lawrence

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 10:22:56 PM

harmony3709

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Lawrence,

I think I understand what you mean now and I don't think I've ever had a scene like that, but the idea is certainly one to consider and I will talk over in the scene negotiations and discussion. Sort of taking the whole focus off myself and my own thoughts, and especially if I don't feel the top's attention on me as directly as I normally do, becoming detached maybe? Maybe even doing something a bit more unusual for me, such as you described, might also help to keep me from being able to just focus on control and letting go or not letting go, or even what to expect, etc.

Thanks for the advice, you've definitely given me some things to think over and discuss.

harmony

(Trying to stay warm but dang Chicago weather is still way too cold! Think Spring! Think Spring!)

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RE: Completely Letting Go In A Scene - 3/22/2005 10:25:44 PM

baileythorne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: harmony3709

I have difficulty completely letting go during a scene, and for the purposes of this question/topic, I am specifically talking about in a scene versus a relationship.
Any thoughts or suggestions very much appreciated.

harmony

harmony,

For what it's worth, I've never been able to "let go" with someone I wasn't in a relationship with. I seem to need that feeling of future to bare my soul. Possibly because I want to know the person I'm with will be there for me, even if it is just via conversation, if I want to understand, re-visit, or celebrate what we created together.

Also, as an aside, I disconnect quickly when I do not have eye contact with my partner. Flog my back (with no mirror to see behind me), put a hood on me, blindfold me... I'm off on my very own little trip, but I'm disconnected. I also disconnect if there is limited touch. The more that connects me to my partner, the more focused I stay on "us", and the easier it is to make the world go away.

It might help you to understand the type of relationship (teacher, friend, lover, ...) that works best for you and to pay attention to the type of actions that help you focus your attention where you would like for it to be.

--bailey

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