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being submissive and life conflicts that can surround it - 3/9/2007 6:46:49 PM   
pissdoll


Posts: 343
Joined: 5/25/2005
Status: offline 		so the major thread in this section over the past day has made me reflect on my own life.

there are periods in my life where i have been "submissive to the world" or disregarded my own best interests because i have a deep need to make those around me happy or feel good.

how many second or third dates have i been on in the past where i really didn't like the guy....but i couldn't bear to hurt his feelings and tell him that?   ugh, too many than i want to admit!  how many men have i met in the first place, when i was fairly sure there would be no connection?  again, too many than i want to admit.  have i ever put myself in potential danger by wanting to trust and, more than anything else, to please, when... if someone else had told me the story, i would have been appalled at the lack of judgement?  not recently...but if i said never, i'd be a total liar.

i go through periods of time where i make huge steps in acknowledging what i need and want and deserve.  but at the same time, i recognize the problem in myself of being more than willing to jump in head-first...sometimes without considering the consequences to myself, and sometimes KNOWING them at the time and feeling angry at myself because the logical part of my brain is shouting out but the emotional part is behind the wheel and can't for the life of her find the brakes.  The need to serve and be a "good girl" just overwhelms at times.

this holds true for other areas of life...not just in terms of "dating."  i'll volunteer to make the cupcakes for a birthday at work.....even when i know i don't have the time...and as my alarm goes off at 3am, i wonder (although i KNOW the answer) how i got myself in to that.  i could give many more examples, but you get the drift.

so what to do?  i try not to make rash decisions.  i don't jump into things anymore.  i force myself to rationalize what i am about to do....and if it's not in my best interests, it's not going to happen.  sometimes i err on the other side...of being too careful, too skeptical, to practical.   and that bothers me too.  but it's a work in progress.
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 7:39:04 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Thank you for your candid OP, and I can say I have done this too, been reluctant to hurt a guy's feelings, dated men there was no spark with, volunteered my time to everything and then feel like I was going to do a rubberband snap.

I think I have outgrown a lot of this. I am not a perfectionist anymore, and I have a hard time even being in that mindset. It is a relief to have one person I am submissive to, and I do not have to worry about anyone else.

About hurting another person's feelings, I just do not see myself as powerful enough to hurt anyone. They put themselves in the position to be hurt, and if I do not feel for them then I will let them know. My ego used to be huge and I thought I was "hurting" men by rejecting them... I am thinking they got over it without a hitch. I maybe special, but no one is so special that they permanently affect someone's chances of recovering...lol. I find I feel responsible for my emotions as I get older, and I expect other people to be responsible for theirs too.

People pleasing is not necessarily a bad thing, but pleasing others at the expense of ourselves, even strangers, is not a good thing in my opinion. Like I said, it is a relief to submit to one person and not the entire planet anymore

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to pissdoll)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 8:29:43 PM   
servicewithsmile


Posts: 55
Joined: 2/6/2007
Status: offline 		>Like I said, it is a relief to submit to one person and not the entire planet anymore

Oh yeah.  I know what that is all about.  And I am ridiculous about over-committing myself at my own expense, sometimes so much that it gets in the way of being functional.
When I'm looking for the brakes, I start asking myself, "If I do this, am I still functional in a healthy way?"
(I sometimes forget to look for the brakes though, life is pretty fast oncoming traffic sometimes.)
I love that - not submitting to the entire planet.
I wrestle with the reason why?; Because of my religious upbringing -more virtuous to give than receive?
Do I just have a sexualized martyr complex?
Am I codependent in some sinister way that does not allow me to live for myself?
It is a relief to be with a Master that sets the priorities, but then I wonder, is this really a cop out because I can't/won't/don't want to be a grown up and handle life?
Have I made a fetish out of not wanting the buck to stop here?
There is no denying how juicy I get when roped up, but that is just sensation play.  Does my desire to please a Dom intimately/personally/exchange power have any validity if I am really passing the buck?  Is there a better question to ask myself than, "Am I functional if I do this anyway?"
While somewhat competitive, I am not overly ambitious.  I do lack the killer instinct.  I'd much rather get along than lay down the law in a group dynamic.
Perhaps if I were more educated I would understand the logic behind my decisions, until then, I resort to, "Am I functional/self-sustaining if I serve my fellow man this way?"  Reason does not always wash out the emotion.  And don't get me started on guilt. lol (shrug) 

(in reply to juliaoceania)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 8:40:03 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		I think this tends to be more a female issue rather than a submissive issue, though they certainly co-exist.  We're perfectionists who crave approval, and are uncomfortable seeking attention directly so we try through indirect ways of service.  Saying no cuts off approval and our outlets to gain attention.

It can be hard, but the only way to be happy is to know your boundaries and to stay true to YOURSELF.  If you can't feel free to say no, then your consent to say yes is rather pointless.



_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to servicewithsmile)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 9:40:16 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
What I tried to tell the OP of that other thread was: being submissive does not mean accommodating others at your own expense. One should only be submissive in ways one wants to be submissive.

Ergo, if some fuck won't tell you his real name, then explaining to him, "Sorry, w/o your real name, I'm not coming," is not un-submissive. It is, in fact, the submissive's job to be proactive in educating others about where the limits are, where the comfort zone is, and what is and is not acceptable. Anything short of this is essentially dishonest and misleading communication, which does neither sub or DOM any favors.

In closing, a good sub knows how and when to say NO. This is the best, most important info any DOM can ever receive, and it also demonstrates submissive strength, self awareness, and confidence. (At least when we're on our game....)

(in reply to pissdoll)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 10:26:16 PM   
servicewithsmile


Posts: 55
Joined: 2/6/2007
Status: offline 		>It can be hard, but the only way to be happy is to know your boundaries and to >stay true to YOURSELF.  If you can't feel free to say no, then your consent to >say yes is rather pointless.

Good point! lol
And I do say no to many when it comes to doing foolish things that easily raise a red flag. 
But what about the fellows (and ladies) that are high on the consentual non-consent trip?
Is that all just blather, or when they say they want you to get to the place where you're not functional without them, one should run screaming?
Do you believe in consentual non-consent and if so, how do you define it?


(hope this is still considered on topic!  )

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 10:41:40 PM   
servicewithsmile


Posts: 55
Joined: 2/6/2007
Status: offline 		I think this tends to be more a female issue rather than a submissive issue, though they certainly co-exist.  We're perfectionists who crave approval, and are uncomfortable seeking attention directly so we try through indirect ways of service.  Saying no cuts off approval and our outlets to gain attention.

I disagree (for me).  I believe service is worth doing, in and of itself.  I don't need approval/a pat on the head/the "good girl" each and every time I do it.  Really good service does not bring attention to itself, at least, I don't think it should if I do it right.
I do not give "effort A" to obtain "reward B".
I actually like helping people whether they know or not, whether they say thank you or not.
Of course, then again, maybe I just don't like people that much. lol  Overly effusive or chatty folks get into my mental space really quick and I shoo them out just as quickly.  I like to do my good deeds from a benevolent distance and am uncomfortable if I am constantly getting a thank you for each and every thing.

But that is a mundane issue, not about the power exchange issue which my little path to self-discovery is mainly rambling on about in my previous post....

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/9/2007 10:49:11 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servicewithsmile
Is that all just blather, or when they say they want you to get to the place where you're not functional without them, one should run screaming?
Do you believe in consentual non-consent and if so, how do you define it?

I absolutely believe it, I lived it.  I define it as giving someone a carte blanche in authority over you.

But the issue is how did you GET to that point.  It can't just be assumed by anyone or given to everyone or even anyone blindly. 

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to servicewithsmile)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/10/2007 5:48:03 AM   
raevnn


Posts: 152
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servicewithsmile
Do you believe in consentual non-consent and if so, how do you define it?


I want to chime in as well, if that's okay: I live with consentual non-consent. I gave up my right to say 'no,' willingly. My owner may (and has) asked things of me that I cannot physically make myself do (usually painful or humiliating) and then, when I could not bring myself to even move my body in that direction, he has forced me. I consented to it, in a sense, by saying, 'yes, I need to be pushed at times, I know this... please do it if you wish, even if I say no," at the beginning of the enslavement.



(in reply to servicewithsmile)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/10/2007 6:07:02 AM   
onestandingstill


Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pissdoll

there are periods in my life where i have been "submissive to the world" or disregarded my own best interests because i have a deep need to make those around me happy or feel good.

KNOWING them at the time and feeling angry at myself because the logical part of my brain is shouting out but the emotional part is behind the wheel and can't for the life of her find the brakes.  The need to serve and be a "good girl" just overwhelms at times.


so what to do?  i try not to make rash decisions.  i don't jump into things anymore.  i force myself to rationalize what i am about to do....and if it's not in my best interests, it's not going to happen.  sometimes i err on the other side...of being too careful, too skeptical, to practical.   and that bothers me too.  but it's a work in progress.


Wow pissdoll,
Get out of my head and heart will YA!!!!
You're singing to the choir here for sure missy.
Geeze I need to fix this balance in my life more than I need a lot of things.
Thanks for the pearls of self evaluation you fed me today.
I needed them even though they are hard in my mouth.
suzanne

(in reply to pissdoll)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/10/2007 6:37:55 AM   
eyesopened


Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline 		i have learned that it is horribly cruel to NOT break things off early if you are just not feeling a connection with Someone.  i had an experience about 6 years ago where i was with a very decent man but for some reason just felt absolutely nothing for Him whatsoever.  We were at a place where the TV was on and i heard someone on the TV say "It's not up to me to decide how much truth he can handle...." and i took that as a sign from the gods. 

Very recently i met another great person and probably a decent Dom but again i felt nothing.  Nothing bad but nothing good.  i don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but it's not up to me to decide how much truth someone can handle so i simply told Him that i did not feel the level of connection i need to feel.

The good news is that i have provided Him with the opportunity to find someone who is actually into Him and i have had the opportunity to find the One i have been seeking for all these years.


_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to pissdoll)
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RE: being submissive and life conflicts that can surrou... - 3/10/2007 7:12:02 AM   
catize


Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline 		When a person gives to the point they feel empty, resentful and taken advantage of, the word martyr comes to mind rather than submission.  There is much that I will suffer gladly for my master, but I refuse to sacrifice myself to the world. 

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to pissdoll)
Profile   Post #: 12
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