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Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 4:19:52 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Santa bought my son a Warhammer set for last xmas. Its a wargame with little plastic guys that you move about a battlefield, rolling dice to resolve fighting etc.

I have a major problem with it. The little xxxx keeps winning at it! No matter what I do, I lose; whether I take one side or the other, whether I keep my little guys where they are or send them into battle, I lose!

Does anyone play this game that might have tips on how to defeat my darling offspring please?

E

The two sides, for info; (warning - this will only make sense if you know the game. Probably)

Goblins vs Dwarfs

The Goblins have 20 archers, 40 spearmen, a troll, a wizard and a king, plus ten groovy goblins that are riding giant spiders like cavalry
The Dwarfs have 10 musketeers, 10 warriors and 10 miners (tougher than the warriors for some reason), plus two cannons and a king

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 5:12:01 PM   
fergus


Posts: 1110
Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		Okay, I am an old school Orc and Goblin player - no doubt you are talking about the new Skull Pass thing, but I am not current with the game.

If you are playing the goblins, get yourself a good Giant, some Orc Characters, and Fanatics!  Lots of Night Goblin Fanatics!

The idea of winning againt dwarves is NOT to try to face them one to one - but, you can't sit back and wither them with fire either, because they SHOOT better than you! (sneaky lil bastards, beardy too)

So, you gotta get to grips with 'em quick, and that means out flanking them - set two units against one, one to charge the flank of their unit, and one to hit the front.  The spider riders should be fast enough to get around tot he flank, as they are faster and the dwarves have no cavalry to counter.

Good luck,
fergus

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 5:22:51 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Thanks Fergus. I've tried the spider riders thing with charging them, but I start with ten and end up with them running away after losing half their number en route to the dwarfs, but you have given me some ideas there.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 5:29:18 PM   
fergus


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Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		Try keeping you general within leadership range of the spiders ...

and, don't charge the dwarves with your spiders in the front! - They will be soundly beaten, you have to hit them in the flank or rear - they lose their rank bonuses and you stand a chance of winning the combat.  Does the wee one like to charge in with the dwarves?  If so, the thing to do is to put the spiders IN RANGE of a dwarvish charge, with the spearmen and general behind the spider riders ...

then, when he declares a charge into the spiders, delclare running away asa charge reaction, it MAY just draw the dwarves out into a charge into your spears - with multple ranks to fight with and a general's leadership, you should be okay! - and as for your fleeing spiders?  If they are still within 12" of the general, they will be able to rally on his leadership (hopefully).

Also, your shaman - don't hold back, get him to cast as many spells as possible, he is one of those things the dwarves can't answer too well.

Now, perhaps the most important part - PAINT YOUR ARMY!  Psychological?  Who knows - Mythical/magical?  possibly.  But for whatever reason, painted minis do better ;)

fergus

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 5:39:22 PM   
HydroMaster


Posts: 4786
Joined: 9/24/2005
Status: offline 		Alright, I don't play gobies or dwarves but have played against them both.  Feign your attack.  Move everyone forward to where they are just out of range if his attacks.  Hold your ranged units behind until you spring the trap.  When he moves his units forward to set up his charge have your fighters start moving back.  Hopfully he keep moving forward to try to pursue.  When this happens unload with your ranged attacks.  He'll weaken himself charging through vollies of arrows.  Reform the fighters and either wait for a charge or charge yourself if you're in range. Also, try holding the spider riders  around the flank....but not the first turn.  Just moved them half the full distance so he thinks you don't know what your going to do with them.  The whole game is more manuevering and psychology than force.  If  none of our suggestions work burn the game and tell him you don't know where it is or you can cheat....fudge your rolls by making the dice land behind terrain where he can't see them lol....you didn't hear that from me.  If you get him a Warhammer 40k game come see me. I'm undefeated in that lol.


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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/19/2007 5:47:27 PM   
fergus


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Status: offline 		When will you be getting some Warhammer historical?  A little Saxon vs. Viking is good, though I am partial to my Celts beating up Romans!

fergus

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 5:45:56 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Thanks everyone.

The wizard - yep, he's the best bet for victory if I'm goblins, though both of us have now worked out that whichever side we choose, the first objective is either for the cannons to blow the wizard to bits, or vice versa. Last weekend, my wizard got destroyed in the first turn!

The problem I have as the goblins really, is that the dwarfs' cannon has a range of 48' so it can blast my goblins more or less from where they start. So really, I have no choice but to try to get my wizard in range (his range is 24' for his fireball spell - but then thats also the range of the dwarf muskets so then he's really up against it as a prime target, with two cannons and a pile of muskets shooting at him). Meanwhile the goblin archers have a range of only 16' so they get two volleys of dwarf musketry at least before they are in range. As the goblins, the only choice really seems to be to get to the dwarfs asap and engage in close combat with two ranks of spears against each dwarf - but before that happens, the cannons and muskets usually kill enough that the goblins flee! I even made up a rule to say that the troll could throw rocks, and even that didnt help. I think overall I have the right idea with getting to the dwarfs quickly, but I think the flanking attacks are going to be the only way to do it. Meanwhile, if my cherished offspring is the dwarfs, he doesnt move much as he knows he can destroy my army from range!

Mind you, there is also to factor in the fact that I must be the most unlucky roller of dice in the history of mankind, whilst he is the opposite. Usually with all my archers shooting I score one or two hits out of 20 shots - I scored 18 hits with my archers on his 3 cannon crew last weekend, trying to put it out of action, of which 9 were wounds; so he then rolls 9 sixes as armour saves! Nine dice, all rolled together, nine f'in sixes! Grrrr! I wonder what the age limit is in Las Vegas?

40K - yes, thats coming for his birthday at the start of April (well, its here already). I expect I'll have to learn the rules for that too next, and lose repeatedly LOL!

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 11:07:57 AM   
fergus


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Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		Okay, seems like you have a handle - get to grips quick.

So, here's some tips to help you refine that.

One - If your wizard and general are part of units, they can no be targeted by the dwarf handguns.  If the cannon DOES happen to hit one of your characters WITHIN a unit - he gets a "look out, sir" roll - that's where one of your rank and file gobbos shouts "Look out boss!" and pushes him out of the way (unless you roll a "1") - you still loose a gobbo, but not general!

No fanatics?  you need some Night Goblin Fanatics - they are VERY destructive - to your opponent and to you.  But, if a fanatic kills 1 dwarf and three goblins you have come out about even ;) - also, once he knows how destructive the fanatics are?  he will direct his fire at them and give your other pieces a chance to advance.

About the dice - Warhammer six sided dice are cheaply made - they often have air bubles in them that thrown them off balance - so SOME players check them to see which ones tend to roll "6" more often and try to use them (another beardy move).

If you have good quality dice, and you STILL roll badly, those dice are cosmically 'tired' and need a rest.  Put them in an old sock, ball it up, and place it in the back of some drawer for a few months not to see the light of day.  The break will do them good.

fergus

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 12:39:42 PM   
shynewboy


Posts: 47
Joined: 2/7/2005
Status: offline 		Heh, you sound like a really cool mom. Yes, buy your own dice, and dont let ANYONE ELSE touch them. Its good luck, really (not guaranteed good luck) As for the actual game, the only other thing I can think of is good maneuvering- if you put everyting at just the edge of his fire range, you can possibly swarm things better by either waiting till you have everything perfectly in place and charging, or, at the very least, hopefully giving them less turns to have to run through fire. Divide and conquer!

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 1:15:32 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Fergus - youre a genius! I obviously misread the rules on the "look out sir" thing, thinking that wizard boy couldnt slot himself into the grunt spearmen and hide!

So, this coming weekend then (there's a battle every weekend, usually following the battle to get school homework done) its

Spider riders way out to the edge, ready to gallop (if spiders gallop?) forward and then come in on a flanking charge on cannons then muskets.

Wizard nestling in unit 1 of the spearmen (20 in 2 ranks of 10), advancing steadily in a frontal attack, until they get within spell range. He then detaches whilst they move on, so he doesnt consume them when his spell backfires (given my dice rolls!)

Unit 2 of the spearmen (the other half) advancing likewise with unit 1, with the archers unit tacked onto their side, advancing too. Archers stop when theyre in range and spearmen continue.

Mr Troll doing as the spider riders, but on the other side of the field.

I'll try to remember to tell you what happens!

E

PS - thanks Shynewboy for your ideas too, and for your compliment!

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 2:32:28 PM   
HydroMaster


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Joined: 9/24/2005
Status: offline 		Ooh, E's been studying hard.  I too have the bad roll luck. ....ahem, refer back to cheating advice in my previous post lol.  The other trick for dice(and I have no idea why but this seems to work) is to roll the dice one at a time....yes I know, you have ten billion dice to roll a turn but damn woman do you want to win or not?!


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I walk the lonely road,
the only one that I have ever known.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 3:55:34 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Do I want to win? There's a question...... on one hand, yes I do as my little darling is far too damned smug. On the other, is he going to sulk endlessly if I win, making life a misery for all? Oh, the dilemnas of parenthood!

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to HydroMaster)
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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 4:48:25 PM   
HydroMaster


Posts: 4786
Joined: 9/24/2005
Status: offline 		Hmm, no kids here.  I'm still in the destroy them all with no remorse regardless of age and experience phase lol.


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I walk the lonely road,
the only one that I have ever known.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/20/2007 5:55:27 PM   
fergus


Posts: 1110
Joined: 6/22/2005
Status: offline 		two ranks of ten?  oh HEAVENS no! not for spearmen (er .... speargobs?)

You want MAXIMUN rank bonuses going into combat - go in with FOUR ranks of five (that way you get the maximun rank bonus of +3 AND are a little more manouverable than with a frontage of ten).

good luck, sounds like battle plans are forming!

fergus

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/21/2007 5:05:43 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Rank bonus? Are you saying I have to read more of those rules!?

Thanks for the tip though

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/23/2007 5:58:54 PM   
HydroMaster


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Joined: 9/24/2005
Status: offline 		I have discussed your situation and stategy with the gamers at the store during my supply run today.  We are all in full agreement...to win you must cheat and cheat vigorously.  Then again I didn't realize you didn't know about rank bonuses.  They'll help keep your little green cowards from running as easliy.  Just remember that is he gets maneuvered around you you'll lose it.  Its only good for attacks from the front. I've also given your concern about his reaction to losing some thought.  He's going to have to learn to deal with disappointment eventually.  Just consider it a chance for his personal growth and crush him.  I'm sure you're a gracious winner so it shouldn't scar him or anything. 


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I walk the lonely road,
the only one that I have ever known.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/23/2007 6:12:34 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Thank you HM.

Of course I'm a gracious winner.

If you deem jumping up and down, pointing at him with one hand and making an L shape for loser with the other, whilst chanting "loser, loser" repeatedly in a sing song fashion, winning graciously.....

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/23/2007 6:22:15 PM   
HydroMaster


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Status: offline 		Why yes, that is what I consider gracious lol.  How did you know my victory dance?


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I walk the lonely road,
the only one that I have ever known.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/23/2007 6:25:28 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HydroMaster

Why yes, that is what I consider gracious lol.  How did you know my victory dance?



I think its on page 583 of the rule book somewhere

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Warhammer - tips anyone? - 3/25/2007 12:05:31 PM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Well...... we had another match today. My goblins lined up against his dwarfs...... a big block of spearmen in the centre, the archers to the right with wizard boy in their front rank, the spider riders out to the left with the troll between them and the spears.

The spearmen took volley after volley from the dwarf muskets, and shot after shot from the cannons, but advanced to slay the musketeers. The spider riders made it round the back of the dwarfs and slaughtered the miners. The troll took out one cannon crew. The archers thinned out the dwarf warriors as they advanced, though in the only real disaster of the day the warriors massacred my archers - which was OK as in fleeing the archers drew the warriors so far from the rest of the battle that the warriors were out of it.

Yes, I won. And without using the wizard at all - since I totally forgot about him, hidden as he was amid the archers!

I won, I won, I won!

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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