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"Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?" - 3/30/2007 10:17:34 AM

Vendaval

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Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?

SCOTSMAN AGENDA

JOHN ROSS

" Patricia Ferguson, the culture minister, who launched the National Plan for Gaelic yesterday, said: "It shows how we can increase the number of Gaelic speakers, how we increase the visibility of Gaelic and how we build confidence so that more people are encouraged to use Gaelic in communities, to learn it, and to pass it on within families."

So what will it do? The plan, the development of which was a statutory duty placed on Bòrd na Gàidhlig, the Gaelic development agency, will target four areas for progress - the home, the community, place of learning and workplace.

It aims to have more Gaelic in the media, the arts and as a tourism attraction. It wants more public and private bodies to develop Gaelic language plans, to promote use of the language to raise its profile. Already a number of councils have adopted language plans, as have Caledonian MacBrayne and the Homebase chain.

The plan wants more pupils taught in Gaelic. The first Gaelic medium education (GME) units opened in Glasgow and Inverness in 1985 with just over 20 pupils, but now there are 2,092 children in 62 primaries, 945 being taught in 37 secondaries and 700 youngsters in Gaelic nurseries, including a dedicated 3-18 GME school in Glasgow. It is hoped a network of dedicated Gaelic schools can be developed across Scotland.

Campaigns will be launched to promote the use of Gaelic in the home, to raise the profile of GME and to establish an effective system for adult learners, while a youth strategy will encourage younger people to use the language. "

http://news.scotsman.com/gaelic.cfm?id=472482007

(Format edit)

< Message edited by Vendaval -- 3/30/2007 10:18:38 AM >

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 11:02:44 AM

bearincuffs

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Quite an interesting article. It is good to see that some countries are trying to revive their native tongue in this modern age. Though I'm not from Scotish ancestry but Irish ancestry, I've always dreamed of learning how to speak and possibly read Gaelic.
Years ago, I did look into the option of learning but here in Canada, the only place where a person would learn is by going to the East Coast provinces. And even there, it's not widely taught in many of the school systems. The majority of the peopl who are fluent usually teach the younger generation in the homes with the purpose to give thier children a better sense of their heritage.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 11:06:38 AM

Vendaval

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Gaelic is definately on my list of languages to learn eventually.
Part of the difficulty is finding anyone who is a native speaker
around here. Making do with DVDs, CD Roms and books will
have to suffice.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 12:00:08 PM

popeye1250

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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

Gaelic is definately on my list of languages to learn eventually.
Part of the difficulty is finding anyone who is a native speaker
around here. Making do with DVDs, CD Roms and books will
have to suffice.

My grandparents from both sides spoke it.
When I go to Ireland I go to Donegal and it's common to hear it there in pubs, stores, or whatever. My father's people come from Donegal.
I play a bit of fiddle so I love to go to the pubs to hear the music live.
I go to Teelin on the southwest coast where my favorite group (ALTAN) owns a pub called Cul a Duin means "back of the fort."
It's a very pretty language to listen to! And right across the road from their pub is a Gailic School where kids go in the summers to learn Gaelic.
The singer/fiddler in Altan, Mairead Ni Mhoeniagh (Mary Mooney in English) grew up with Gailic as a first language about forty miles up the road in Gweedore, Donegal. That's a big Gaeltacht area.
If they're not on tour you can go into the pub and have a pint with Mairead, her husband Dermot the concertina player and his father Tom who's a great source of information! And Kieran Tourish is usually around too.
Vendeval, if you want to hear some really beautiful music sung in Gaelic by Mairead look up some of Altan's music online. "Blackwater" is a georgeous and haunting album!
Also when I go up to Donegal I stop into Enya's father's pub, "Leos" in Crolly. His other daughter is "Moya" (another gaelic derivitive of "Mary") or "Maire" Brennan, lead singer for "Clannad." They do a lot of stuff in Gaelic as well.
Vendeval, give Altan a listen, you'll shit!
If you look at my profile on yahoo (popeye1250) there's a picture of Mairead and me.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 3/30/2007 12:03:09 PM >

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 12:01:51 PM

Vendaval

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Your recommendations sound wonderful, Popeye.
Thank you for sharing.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE

http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 5

RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 12:28:40 PM

Darias

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the way things are in Ireland are as follows .

Gealic ( irish ) is mandatory from primary school through secondry school
it is to my knowledge a requirement in most goverment jobs to have atleast a basic knowledge of Irish
there are a number of Gealix or gealthact ( sp?) areas in irreland mainly along the west coast . in these towns and villages almost all residents and locals go through their daily lives speaking Irish . the majority can speak english but choose not to unless nessicary i.e. to the tourists
there is available a program which allows school students to spend 2 to 3 weeks of their summer living in these gealthact areas

My mother bless her is a teacher . so as with all teachers kids i was brow beaten into doing that extra hour of homework when i could have been enjoying the TV ( i missed out on so many of the kids and teenager shows of my time its just not funny )
as a result when my Irish grades splipped i was packed off to a gealthact for the summer with an extra suitcase full of guilt ( my own son shaming me like this , people will think im raising an ignormaus (( emails for definition of ignormaus if you dont recognise the word )) how will i show My face in town ... and Me a TEACHER ) suffice is to say I was quite happy to be packed off anywhere

i spent 3 weeks imersed in Irish . I got woken up at 7am by the Ban an Ti in Irish ( lady of the house ... each group of students were sent to the private homes of people who volenteered to help the gealthact organisers . we had a bed food etc for half nothing and we got to chat away to our hosts in more irish outside of the school)
monday to friday we had classes from 9am till 3 ( normal irish school hours ) then home for dinner and back in at 5 for a ceile ( irish dancing ) session which lasted till 7. then home for tea and back at 830 ish for an cheile mor ( big cheile dance )

i spent three weeks in this routine and left with a scholarship for the next summer
that year i left with an invitation to come back as a cinneara ( SP?) almost like a student helper . we lived with the younger students and escorted them to and from the school etc .. big brother and sister kinda thing

now heres the sad thing . aside from the school use and my 3 summers in the gealthact at 28 i have had no cause to use Gealic .. in a country where its considered the national language along with english , a bare few can have more than a passing conversation in it . i suspect my own siblings can speak spanish more fluently than they can their native tongue . in ireland it seems the Irish language is dying . in Scotland and wales which share simular roots in the Gaelic language ( though the welsh just screwed it up with their no vowels thing :P ) i can only assume its the same . my question is . in our modern world how long till the same is true of spanish french german and the other national languages ? English ( and american ) is taking over and we must stop it

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 1:17:23 PM

popeye1250

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Darius, yes, I guess it helps to be around it of course.
Last time I was over I stopped in to see a lady friend of mine who comes from Connemara in Galway but lives in Boston, Mass and was visiting for the summer and we went to the pub with a whole bunch of her family and they were speaking half Irish half English.
She said that some things are just funnier if you say them in Irish instead of English.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 3:46:53 PM

LadyEllen

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Its good news for Gaelic certainly, but we must be aware that the reason that it, along with Welsh and Cornish, was stamped out in the first place was to neutralise the nationalistic movements in northern Scotland and in Ireland, to bring coherence of culture to Britain as a whole under the Empire. What happened to people who spoke those languages was awful.

I say be aware, because the rightful restoration of Gaelic and the other two languages of these islands must be managed properly such that it does not result in unnecessary division from and antipathy towards the English speaking culture - especially in southern Scotland, which has as much claim to English as we south of the border and no Gaelic tradition; Scots as spoken in the south is not a bastard form of English - it is a separately evolved form of Anglo Saxon.

E

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 4:17:12 PM

Darias

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From: midlands ireland
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the accuracy of this im not sure on its second hand information but . allegedly the irish goverment is considering making signposts in irish speaking areas Gaelic only . while i would normally agree that steps towards promoting irish speaking are always a good idea i have to question if this one is . for me i learn a language by being told what the foreign word is for te object i know in english .. an road is Bothair ... etc ... but if you dont tell me my word for it how can i know what your word is . so if a signpost doesnt tell me the name of a town in english how will i know where i am ( since all goverment produced maps are in the same language )

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** may you live in interesting times**

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 5:30:52 PM

popeye1250

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Darius, yes, I agree with you on the road signs, it's almost like a mini Gaelic lesson to see a place name in English first and then to see that name in Irish.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 3/30/2007 11:29:43 PM

popeye1250

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Hmm, I just remembered, I bought a course in Gaelic about 10 years ago!
It has a book and tapes too.
It's probably in bedroom #3 that I use for a junkroom.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/1/2007 8:21:06 AM

mixielicous

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fast reply, a little more reading [not in this article] will show that it is officially "irish" does not go by gaelic anymore. i heard all signs in ireland will change along with the mandatory classes to be changed a little bit to motivate kids to continue the learning after its not required anymore. yes all govt proceedings are in "irish" and isnt it also official EU language this year??

in my state of MA only about 4.5K people speak "irish"

there is a nice book online for free with audio msg me if interested.

edit to add: WIKIPEDIA is a plethora of information on this topic

< Message edited by mixielicous -- 4/1/2007 8:22:28 AM >

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/1/2007 3:52:18 PM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mixielicous

fast reply, a little more reading [not in this article] will show that it is officially "irish" does not go by gaelic anymore. i heard all signs in ireland will change along with the mandatory classes to be changed a little bit to motivate kids to continue the learning after its not required anymore. yes all govt proceedings are in "irish" and isnt it also official EU language this year??

in my state of MA only about 4.5K people speak "irish"

there is a nice book online for free with audio msg me if interested.

edit to add: WIKIPEDIA is a plethora of information on this topic

Mix, yeah, my grandmother always called it "Irish" not "Gaelic."
Yes, I read that about all the road signs being changed to Irish only!
That'll be fun with the tourists; "Bali Claith Amore?" Where's that?"
"It's right down the boreen ya fookin bollix!"
My father would call the bar "the Shabeen."
I grew up just outside of Boston (Woburn) so there were a lot of Irish in that whole area. All my mother's uncles belonged to the Ancient Order of Hibernians.
I read a great book a few years back translated from Irish into English by an old woman named "Peig" and that was the title of the book too. Fascinating stories!
Vendeval, did you check out that group "Altan" yet?

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/1/2007 6:00:51 PM

sweetnurseBBW

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Fortunately I have a father in law from Scotland that has taught us more Gaelic than we care to. I feel very blessed to be able to carry this own to our children in the future. Culture is something that has died out in America and not carried on alot anymore.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 10:43:33 AM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetnurseBBW

Fortunately I have a father in law from Scotland that has taught us more Gaelic than we care to. I feel very blessed to be able to carry this own to our children in the future. Culture is something that has died out in America and not carried on alot anymore.

I think there's a big difference between Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
Maybe Darius could tell us.
Vandeval, when you look up Altan on one of those music sharing sites look up the song, "Dulaman"

(in reply to sweetnurseBBW)

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 12:50:48 PM

sweetnurseBBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetnurseBBW

Fortunately I have a father in law from Scotland that has taught us more Gaelic than we care to. I feel very blessed to be able to carry this own to our children in the future. Culture is something that has died out in America and not carried on alot anymore.

I think there's a big difference between Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
Maybe Darius could tell us.
Vandeval, when you look up Altan on one of those music sharing sites look up the song, "Dulaman"

The plan wants more pupils taught in Gaelic. The first Gaelic medium education (GME) units opened in Glasgow and Inverness in 1985 with just over 20 pupils, but now there are 2,092 children in 62 primaries, 945 being taught in 37 secondaries and 700 youngsters in Gaelic nurseries, including a dedicated 3-18 GME school in Glasgow. It is hoped a network of dedicated Gaelic schools can be developed across Scotland.

Yeah I know. This particular part of the article was talking about Scotland. Actually most of it is about Scotland. So hence my repsonse.
http://www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/gaidhlig/ga-ge/coimeas.html

< Message edited by sweetnurseBBW -- 4/2/2007 12:56:26 PM >

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 12:56:28 PM

Arpig

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Dying. No Government can mandate the language it's people speak, Though they do try (vis Quebec). The only thing that can save a language is if people speak it...and unfortunatly for those enamoured of other languages, the future is English. It is already the 2nd language of choice world wide, and it won't be too long (in an historical context) till it becomes the 1st language of choice worldwide.
This is not in any way meant to imply that English is in any way superior to any other language, it is simply due to historical circumstances.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 2:45:22 PM

Vendaval

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Hello Popeye,

I am going to take a bit of a drive this weekend to a store in Cambria
that carries items from Ireland, Scotland, Wales and the Isle of Man.
The lady who runs the place flies over there a few times a year and
hand-picks the articles for her store. She has an extensive music
section and you can listen to sample CDs right there. I will be sure
to look up Altan.

I have some pewter jewlery and a leather checkbook from her
store already. Doing my best to support a local, private business.

Blessed Be,

Vendaval

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE

http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 18

RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 3:59:00 PM

NakedOnMyChain

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Joined: 11/29/2004
From: Indiana
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It's such a beautiful, passionate language. It would be an utter shame if it was allowed to fade away. It's an important part of my heritage that I would dearly love to learn. I say kudos to them for making an effort to bolster and revive it.

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RE: "Gaelic: Dying or on the brink of renaissance?... - 4/2/2007 4:15:38 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

Hello Popeye,

I am going to take a bit of a drive this weekend to a store in Cambria
that carries items from Ireland, Scotland, Wales and the Isle of Man.
The lady who runs the place flies over there a few times a year and
hand-picks the articles for her store. She has an extensive music
section and you can listen to sample CDs right there. I will be sure
to look up Altan.

I have some pewter jewlery and a leather checkbook from her
store already. Doing my best to support a local, private business.

Blessed Be,

Vendaval

Vendaval, good! You'll be a fan I'm sure!
Mairead has perfect pitch and a great singing voice and she can make smoke come out of her fiddle!
I'm thinking about going over for three weeks in August of '08 for the Ballyshannon music (folk) festival.
I like the Donegal "style" of fiddling, more "driving" bow style.

(in reply to Vendaval)

Post #: 20

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