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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 3:21:06 PM

perverseangelic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

I know two people who abused the shelter on a regular basis. There is legitimate abuse, then there is fabricated abuse. I have read all the handouts they pump out. More than half of them just sound like excuses to keep the government money flowing. The greatest percentage of the women are there on trumped up nonsense from what I found out. There is a percentage that are there for legitimate reasons and truly they deserve O/our compassion and concern. The rest of them should be booted out so they can come to grips with reality and either reconcile with their husband or find alternative accomodations. Those accomodations are for people that are in genuine trouble.

This is the number one reason why I refuse to support any women's shelters, until they completely revamp their mandates.

I would rather the shelter system be abused than the criteria be so stringent that legitimately abused women are turned away.

I would rather pay taxes that go toward housing -anyone- who claims spousal abuse, than have such abuse be so stigmatized that women and men don't seek help.

I would rather accept that some will abuse the system than make the victim "proove" that the abuse was "bad enough" to warrent leaving.

I would rather tolerate those who don't -require- the help than make a victim feel that she, in -any- way caused, brought about, or deserved the abuse.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 3:25:15 PM

siamsa24

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Exactly. Even if the system were to be "revamped" that would take time, money and people and it's not going to happen by individuals withholding those things. Personally, I agree with perverseangelic. I would rather that there be people that use the system and not need it then to turn away someone who does.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 6:40:17 PM

SirKenin

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Well I agree to a point. There quite obviously has to be a revamping of the criteria along with the mandate. If your spouse is yelling at you because you got into a fight, too damn bad. There's a woman right beside you that is trying to break up with an alcoholic that has been threatened with death if he ever catches her. There's a woman that had herself slammed into a door because she would not make dinner. There's another woman whose kids were beaten because they did not clean up their room.

There comes a time in every woman's life where they need to learn to suck it up and deal with the consequences. Not getting money for a fur coat is not abuse. If you are going to cry about that, go stay with your mother. Leave the spacious rooms, hottubs, bullet proof glass and free food, money, furniture and clothing to a woman in genuine need. It is because of people like you that those that fear for their very lives or those of their kids get turned away at the doors.

I know. I have heard all about it and been given first hand accounts. I know of women that have been turned away. They only have a limited number of spaces. For pete's sake be considerate of others besides yourselves and leave the space for those that are in desperate need of protection. It is sad to say, but there are more than enough of them to fill the rooms and overflow into the hallways. It is pathetic, that is true. It is sad, that is equally true. But that is life. There are a lot of loser husbands and boyfriends out there that need to meet the business end of a baseball bat.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 6:49:52 PM

siamsa24

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But who makes the choice of what is abuse and what is not? Is it going to turn into something where the woman has to prove that she was the victim (like rape, by the way)? Are a bunch of crazy law makers in Washington going to decide what is abuse and what is not?

Sorry, I get a bit fired up about this.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 7:08:20 PM

SirKenin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: siamsa24

But who makes the choice of what is abuse and what is not? Is it going to turn into something where the woman has to prove that she was the victim (like rape, by the way)? Are a bunch of crazy law makers in Washington going to decide what is abuse and what is not?

Sorry, I get a bit fired up about this.

That is ok. I do too. This is one topic I am passionate about. The way I see it, if the State is paying the bill, the State should call the shots. If Joe Public foots the bill, let Joe Public decide the guidelines and mandate. Seeing as how Joe Public is dumping the whole problem on the shoulders of the State the way they always do, they lost their say. Now it is up to the State to decide.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 7:13:31 PM

siamsa24

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So you are saying that some man a hundred miles away should decide what is abuse and what is not? I 100% disagree.
I believe that if changes are going to be made they should be made by the people that are actually a part of it. The poeple that work in the shelters, for example.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 8:34:45 PM

SirKenin

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Then if that is the case, they better dig deep into their own pockets to pay for the operating budget too. You do not get to have your cake and eat it too.

There are shelters all over the continent. There is no reason why a centralized panel can not make a set of unified and standardized guidelines to be applicable across the entire portfolio.

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RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 8:42:48 PM

siamsa24

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But not every case of abuse is the same. I think that emotional, physical and mental abuse are all abuse, but not everyone agrees with me.

The people that work in the shelters see abuse cases every day while the poiticians most likely have never even seen a case in real life. Not all cases can be solved academically by a comittee.

Besides, if there is going to be some kind of process in order to allow women into a shelter that far fewer women would go through the process. And the chances that these women are actually being abused is very high. When I was in an abusive relationship the last thing that I wanted and needed was someone asking me personal questions about it. The reason that I got help is because they gave me help and support, no questions asked.

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Post #: 28

RE: is it abuse - 4/21/2005 10:41:49 PM

SirKenin

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I think W/we are both sitting on opposite sides of the fence on this one and an agreement will never be reached. As such I am happy to agree to disagree.

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Post #: 29

RE: is it abuse - 4/22/2005 3:28:42 AM

CelticPrince

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babygirl,

I think there are two issues here, his withdrawal appears to be his method of showing displeasure and not wanting it to escalate further. Seems that is a well used vanilla method also.

You have been together R/T and that might be the tip off in that you Master is extending what worked r/t to on line.

You indicate that your relatively new; is he?

The other issue is this, why bring on the result with bad behavior? are you reverting to vanilla tactics?

CP

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RE: is it abuse - 4/22/2005 5:37:08 AM

siamsa24

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

I think W/we are both sitting on opposite sides of the fence on this one and an agreement will never be reached. As such I am happy to agree to disagree.

I can handle that

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Post #: 31

RE: is it abuse - 4/22/2005 12:59:29 PM

SweetDommes

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CelticPrince

The other issue is this, why bring on the result with bad behavior? are you reverting to vanilla tactics?

I didn't get the feeling that she was misbehaving on purpose at all. Sometimes people make mistakes, it happens - unintentionally.

My question to you is, why did you assume that she is intentionally misbehaving?

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Post #: 32

RE: is it abuse - 4/22/2005 1:59:29 PM

masterstrict

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sweetdomme i agree with you it sounds as if she should get out and find a more caring master we all have our ways of doing things but this is far from the norm and will hold back the development of slave i do not treat bmy slaves like that but i know other masters who use the same kind of thing but not to the extent that he does it is very hard to say with out all thge facts what is right or wrong but i feel as you it does not sound right

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Post #: 33