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"Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:01:32 AM

spankmepink11

Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
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I've noticed an occurance here, as well as on other sites, and even on the yahoo message board/group that i belong to. It's been something i've often wondered about. To preface this, i will state that i do not want to appear "one true way'ish" or elitist, however when i read the words "somebody please teach me to be a Dom/sub" or i read....." i want to try to be...." (Dom/sub), it kind of makes me wonder.

I almost have the knee jerk reaction of thinking...."if i have to explain...you wouldn't understand"

My personal epiphany came when a friend who i knew was involved in the lifestyle, suspected that i was submissive, gave me an indepth description of a "scene" ( for lack of a better term). By the time he was half way through his description, i could identify so strongly with the sub in his tale, that i was correctly predicting her reactions. From that point on...i read everything i could find on the subject....not to learn how to be myself, but to kind of validate that my feelings were not only very real, but that i was not alone in feeling the way i did.

I think my main curiousity here is to know what the people who pose such a question are really asking for. And also, what life experiences lead us to identify with the labels we project on ourselves...ie...Dominant, submissive, switch.

Thanks in advance for any replies...

Post #: 1

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:06:42 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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They want to fit in, they want there to be a "one true way" so they can stop feeling confused, they want it to be easier, they want to not have to think, they want to surrender to their frenzy, they want to FIT IN, they want to just be told what the rules are and follow them, please please please.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 2

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:12:38 AM

SimplyMichael

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Joined: 1/7/2007
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LA,

I completely disagree. I think that while SOME ask that question for your reasons, others do so because learning often involves being taught and thus asking to be taught does not imply being a mindless follower.

By that definition going to classes or seminars or even reading a book is wrong.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 3

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:29:46 AM

spankmepink11

Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
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I think thats an interesting insight to consider LA.

Michael, while i understand your point of view, i don't think thats the implication
"By that definition going to classes or seminars or even reading a book is wrong. "

I guess what i may be reaching for, is if identifying as Dominant or submissive is something one is "taught" or is it inherent.
Can some one who does not have natural tendencies toward Dominance or submission...be taught to be such, even if it goes against their natural tendencies? And can it be done successfully?

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 4

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:36:20 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

The first few message boards I joined had all the answers of how exactly to be, talk, behave and act.... I did not last long on them because I got bored. The dom I was with did not belong to them at all, but encouraged me to. He would find it entertaining when I would speak in third person, and other devices to denote my submissive "condition". It was a game we played for entertainment purposes only

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 5

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:36:55 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11
I guess what i may be reaching for, is if identifying as Dominant or submissive is something one is "taught" or is it inherent.
Can some one who does not have natural tendencies toward Dominance or submission...be taught to be such, even if it goes against their natural tendencies? And can it be done successfully?

Being one is innate.

Being a very good one is taught.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 6

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:39:07 AM

onestandingstill

Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
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Some people when they first hear of D/s get it fully.
Others see it, go gaa gaa over it, and start learning the whole scene one thing at a time and then add new pieces to the puzzle as they go along.
I am like you where the lights just came on and I started having a hell of a party in this new house in my mind.
I have friends that were the other approach.
Their desire to learn was as strong as mine, their attraction to the BDSM world was as strong as mine, but when the lights came on they stood in the door and started dealing with investigating each tile before they'd walk into the room fully.
It is a different approach, but it's just how you've been hardwired.
I don't think it means they are any less motivated or intelligent, they just get there by a slow moving train vs the jet that broke the sound barrier like you and I did.
suzanne

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 7

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:39:24 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
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quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11
I think my main curiousity here is to know what the people who pose such a question are really asking for.

When I first acknowledged I was a vampire, I bugged Vi to death. It wasn't that I didn't know who or what I was but that I didn't (and in a lot of ways still don't) know where to turn to 1) learn the actual mechanics of it and 2) to have a community that I can handle (role playing isn't going to work for me here when it comes to actual discussion and such).

So, sometimes, they're simply asking which direction to head. If I wanted to be a professional chef and I didn't know about Culinary schools, I'd start asking around about chefs and how they got to be chefs.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 8

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:40:02 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
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From: UK
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When people come into wiitwd, there is a tendancy to fall into the 'onetrueway' trap - or the 'real' trap - and like any new venture, there is a certain amount of wanting to be 'trained' or 'mentored'. Personally, I am not a great believer in such practises, although I do not think there is anything lost by going to seminars or demos... but learning from one single individual does have it's set backs. Personally, I believe it is much more enlightening to learn with ones partner or partners, seeing as each relatonship is as individual as those within it.

I don't think theres anything wrong with people asking - reading threads here one can see how insecure many people are when they first start our or have even been around for a long time, but it isn't a particularly healthy way to go about things either. Asking questions is good - following and copying others isn't.

Peace and Rapture

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 9

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:41:36 AM

imthatacheyouhav

Posts: 1259
Joined: 4/16/2007
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for me i "identified" as a sub/slave and THEN tried to find out more about "myself" and i have asked for help....so if you are asking can you be taught to "identify" as one or the other....i have no clue...if you already have that identity then yes of course you can learn ....(imho)

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 10

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:48:46 AM

spankmepink11

Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

So, sometimes, they're simply asking which direction to head. If I wanted to be a professional chef and I didn't know about Culinary schools, I'd start asking around about chefs and how they got to be chefs.

Master Fire

Thanks MasterFireMaam, i understand the need for "technical" education for those who plan on implementing specific acts, be it vampireism, throwing whip safely ...etc. Maybe i'm more curious about internal motivation to identify with an orientation in general. (or maybe i'm just an idiot who can't make my point well)

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 11

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:49:42 AM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

Get a woman to trust, then spank or flog her until she spaces and she will look for avenues to do it again. Ask her if she has always had feelings of wanting to be the prisoner when she played games and she will start to buy into the whole D/s, M/s, BDSM thing while she looks for someone who will flog her again. From that we can get into a Rasputin, Shamic and spiritual type order of D/s if you want. The submissives on here are not alone, almost any woman can be steered here. The ones on CM were just the lucky ones to have found it early and realized that decent Doms were out there.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 12

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:52:07 AM

spankmepink11

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Joined: 9/28/2005
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Thanks suzanne, i sure hope i did not imply that either was less intelligent, motivated, or sincere, because that's last thing i would want to do.

(in reply to onestandingstill)

Post #: 13

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:52:09 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11

Thanks MasterFireMaam, i understand the need for "technical" education for those who plan on implementing specific acts, be it vampireism, throwing whip safely ...etc. Maybe i'm more curious about internal motivation to identify with an orientation in general. (or maybe i'm just an idiot who can't make my point well)

If it is about wanting to identify as an orientation as in Dom/sub/slave etc in a specific sense - then it goes back to what Em stated and it is about (most) peoples need to belong. To be a part of something. To feel involved and noticed.

To just 'be'.

Peace and Rapture

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 14

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 9:55:19 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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Yes, they want to fit in. They beg for a box to settle comfortably into.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 15

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 10:00:12 AM

SusanofO

Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
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I think asking questions is fine. I am trying to learn about being a Mistress, for instance, and I ask Qs on the "Ask a Mistress" forum all the time. Those women are really great about answering them, too. Or, are we talking about asking questions of a specific Dominant (as in, the one you're with?) In that case, it might be a little awkward, I imagine.

I find it difficult to imagine a scenario wherein asking questions would be considered wrong. If someone is trying to learn about something it is natural to ask qeustions. I'd not necessarily consider that a sign anyone wanted to be anything in particular (unless they said so), but maybe that they needed a bigger selection of reading material, or something. They're probably sufferring from a lack of exposure to the entire sub-culture, is my guess.

I understand what the OP meant (and mean no disrespect). I am also one who doesn't necessarily buy the whole idea of someone being a "natural" or "born" submissive. I think it is possible, and would agree it seems the vast majority on these boards seem to have inclinations in one direction or another, but am not sure what that really implies, if anything.

I certainly think that entire area is definitely debatable. There are people who do this (practice bdsm) for a few years, after all, and then just stop. There are people who are in one "role" at first, and then migrate to another, and those who try it out, simply because they are curious, and those who are "life-stylers" almost their entire adult lives - and I don't think any of those things is particularly wrong.

Good questions from the OP, too bad there are lots of suggestions, but no hard and fast, quantifiable data that people are "born this way". I think maybe they are, but even if they are, that wouldn't mean (to me) that many other people aren't necessarily going to be trying it out, and who knows why, or that they do it for years, or for just 2 weeks, or a lifetime? I'd just give them lots of books, and maybe take them to a munch or party, and let them decide what to do with it all, I guess.

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 4/20/2007 10:35:00 AM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 16

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 10:01:15 AM

spankmepink11

Posts: 1310
Joined: 9/28/2005
Status: offline

Thanks for the input Julia, i can sort of relate. Often in the recent past, i have wondered if i myself am really "true" mainly because high protocol trappings or a laundry list of rules is not something i seek. For me...it's just living in a way that i feel the most natural in a relationship with a person who's natural inclination is to have authority over his mate. S&M of course is a very welcome enhancement to the relationship i seek.

Dark.....ExSteel, imthatacheyouhave, Thank you as well for the thought provoking replies...

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 17

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 10:06:23 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11
Maybe i'm more curious about internal motivation to identify with an orientation in general.

Some do it because they're curious, but they think that they have to be a certain role in order to 1) play how they want to play and 2) be who they're expected to be. The former deals with maso/sadist identification with the "default" for most of the community being maso=sub and Sadist=Dom. Some of us don't agree with that and seperate the physical from the mental/spiritual role. The latter deals with perception and, a lot of times, insecurity about themselves. I thought I had to be a Bitch Goddess for a while. It just doesn't fit me (unless its morning and you're telling me to "smile". FY and go away.). I've also met a LOT of het men who find that they are submissive or masochists when they feel they have to be Dom and Sadist in public or they're not "real men".

Of course, there's any numerous reasons for it.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 18

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 10:45:53 AM

onestandingstill

Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: spankmepink11

(or maybe i'm just an idiot who can't make my point well)

What I gathered from what you wrote is you asked if we see some subs are driven by the motivation to submit, and some seem not to be, but are more motivated by extenuating circumstances to be submissive even though it does not seem to be their nature.

My response was both desire to be submissive, some it's instinctual and some work twice as hard to master it.

I think most are seeming get what you asked just fine if that is what you implied.

I thought after I responded another angle of an answer for me would be yes, some fake submission for the sex, for attentions, or for gifts it affords them.
Their motivations are not to submit, but to tolerate having to act under submissive behaviorsthemselves to be able to obtain their underlying motivations.

LOL in the end it's is it live or is it memorex?
suzanne

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 19

RE: "Teach me to be a....." - 4/20/2007 10:49:09 AM

SusanofO

Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
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Good point, IMO onestandingstill(suzanne). I'm not sure how anyone discerns this, but am confident that a Dominant will eventually figure out (or maybe know from the beginning), if the submissive he's got is the one he thinks he needs and wants. Ditto, IMO for Mistresses, and vice-versa for subs and slaves.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 4/20/2007 10:52:23 AM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to onestandingstill)

Post #: 20

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