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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 8:09:01 PM   
DominaSmartass


Posts: 961
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: This month? Maryland
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All I can say is that if I were ever hurt on the job due to the person training me deciding to not tell me something and just setting me up to get hurt because he assumed I wouldn't heed his advice on the proper way to do something to begin with, I would be bringing the issue to the highest level of management for some sort of disciplinary action. It doesn't matter to me if it was a paper cut or an amputated limb, the fact that you didn't give him the chance to do something correctly but chose to let him do in incorrectly out of ignorance seems amazingly wrong to me. I'm glad you think you're such a great teacher though and it is beyond me why you would pose this question to the forum when you're already convinced you were right in what you did. To answer the original question which was not regarding right or wrong, no I don't believe it was consensual either.

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“These S&M people ... they are bossy! There’s also a creepy connection between leather sex, ‘Star Trek’ and the Renaissance Faire.”

- Comedian Margaret Cho

(in reply to tade)
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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 8:16:26 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DominaSmartass

I would be bringing the issue to the highest level of management for some sort of disciplinary action.


       LOL.   What are they gonna do?  Fire me?

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 8:34:59 PM   
Mystique567


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As bad as it is I laughed when I read it as well.

I manage a business that people cannot be allowed to make their own mistakes. I sometimes wish they could learn that way.

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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 9:25:55 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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     It occurs to me, Domina, that your suggestion is far more sadistic than what I did.  Send him running off, his second day on the job, to whine to the office geeks about a boo-boo.  They know how often this stuff happens, they order the first aid supplies.

     I let him learn a good lesson the hard way.  You would get him permanently labeled as a pain in the ass if not simply let go for his first mistake.

     You're MEAN.  I like that.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to DominaSmartass)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 9:54:51 PM   
Sirandlittle1


Posts: 538
Joined: 12/22/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

   So I'm training my replacement at work (it's a good thing) a role you have agreed to do.but he's a complete rookie as you were once. to the kind of equipment we run.  I've been doing this, off and on, for better than 20 years.  And thus very skilled, and perhaps the best teacher of this skill to a rookie.There's no way to transfer my experience, but I'm trying to give him a foundation to build on,sure you are and drive home the importance of keeping safety the first prioritythe importance of which appear wasted upon yourself.  I have 3 more days to do this.

   But the sadist is creeping out.  I found myself today, NOT giving him an important tip when performing maintainence, just so I could watch him get frustrated and skin a knuckle.  I can rationalize it any number of waysyour post is littered with them my dear:  Scratches and scrapes are a way of life in this gig, we need to know if he's going to be a total wimpwhy? you should be accepting of the risks, but doing all you can to minimise the negative impact;  I wanted to assess his mechanical problem solving skills; that lessons learned the hard way 'stick' betteronly for masochists i think you'll find, as we only learn by having behaviour re-inforced.  I'd be lying though.Really?

    I knew he was going to rip the skin right off his knuckle the way he was doing it, and I decided to watch< right there! that's where i got squicked..  He showed up 20 minutes late with a lame excuse instead of an apologyProbably.  It cost him This is how i see it deteriorate, at this point..

     I was in a hurry to get done and come home today.  Tomorrow, I'm looking to put a few hours of OT on that final paycheck.  He might have a very hard day.Im unsure if you are suggesting that you are going to financially give him more money for payment as your pain taker. Or you are going to work extra hours, to give you more access to the rookie.

     The question is this,  Since I'm the teacher, and he asked to be the studentAnd you accepted the task of having him by consent. All be it from default, you never spoke up and said, no, i cannot do this, can my smirking sadist methods of instruction be considered consensual? Catagorical NO. Hot, maybe. In some fantasy. Had you asked him if you could injure him for 'kicks' and he said, yeah, go ahead, then it would of been consentual. But you did not get consent.

so, to sum up?
You are playing dangerously. You are on the edge. And that's marvelous for you. A thrill seeker myself, i can see the motivation to play on the edge. But unlike me, you doing so without the other's consent. And  you could end up in a lot of trouble. As could someone that inadvertantly gets 'toyed' with in your path. I would shy away from non consentual in the real world. Folk dont like it in any country generally. Think of it as a social norm. Your not allowed to pray on people. Get it?
little1
12.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/25/2007 11:45:25 PM   
MissPlease


Posts: 12
Joined: 11/19/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
......    But the sadist is creeping out.  I found myself today, NOT giving him an important tip when performing maintainence, just so I could watch him get frustrated and skin a knuckle.  I can rationalize it any number of ways.......... I'd be lying though...........
.............He showed up 20 minutes late with a lame excuse instead of an apology.  It cost him..........
...........  I was in a hurry to get done and come home today.  Tomorrow, I'm looking to put a few hours of OT on that final paycheck.  He might have a very hard day.........

     The question is this,  Since I'm the teacher, and he asked to be the student, can my smirking sadist methods of instruction be considered consensual?


Sigh....   The lack of self-discipline not to keep sadistic tendencies within the confines of a D/s relationship is scary in a bad way.  To me, every day life's relationships are not  bdsm scenes, and I am sadist.  I trained folks worldwide on many things.  I trained my boss. I didn't like it, but I didn't wish harm on her.   I distinguish between training/disciplining children and sadomasochism, too.  I struggle to one day see sadomasochism wiped from the DSM's list of mental illnesses, but I can see why they are slow to acheive this when such misinterpretation and misapplication of  masochism and sadism exist outside a loving relationship between two inter-dependent adults interacting in an adult sexual relationship. 

quote:

ORIGINAL:   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadistic_personality_disorder :
"Sadistic personality disorder is a pervasive pattern of cruel, demeaning, and aggressive behavior, beginning by early adulthood, as indicated by the repeated occurrence of at least four of the following:
  • Has used physical cruelty or violence for the purpose of establishing dominance in a relationship (not merely to achieve some noninterpersonal goal, such as striking someone in order to rob him or her)
  • Humiliates or demeans people in the presence of others
  • Has treated or disciplined someone under his or her control unusually harshly.
  • Is amused by, or takes pleasure in, the psychological or physical suffering of others (including animals)
  • Has lied for the purpose of harming or inflicting pain on others (not merely to achieve some other goal)
  • Gets other people to do what he or she wants by frightening them (through intimidation or even terror)
  • Restricts the autonomy of people with whom he or she has a close relationship, e.g., will not let spouse leave the house unaccompanied or permit teenage daughter to attend social functions
  • Is fascinated by violence, weapons, injury, or torture
The behavior has not been directed toward only one person (e.g., spouse, one child) and has not been solely for the purpose of sexual arousal (as in sexual sadism).

I am looking forward to the day when the APA's DSM accepts adult sexual sadomasochism as a healthy way of sexual expression between consenting adult lovers (as they did with gay and lesbian so long ago) and not a detriment to society as a whole.  I fear with this exhibited type of misinterpretation, I may never see that day and that I will forever remain a misinterpreted anomaly.  I do have hope, however, in that the APA's criteria did make the distinction of sadism that is "solely for the purpose of sexual arousal."

Peace,
MissPlease








(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: The Sadist Within - 4/26/2007 1:40:43 PM   
DominaSmartass


Posts: 961
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: This month? Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

    It occurs to me, Domina, that your suggestion is far more sadistic than what I did.  Send him running off, his second day on the job, to whine to the office geeks about a boo-boo.  They know how often this stuff happens, they order the first aid supplies.

    I let him learn a good lesson the hard way.  You would get him permanently labeled as a pain in the ass if not simply let go for his first mistake.

    You're MEAN.  I like that.


Yeah, I can be mean and sadistic but I am a stickler for playing by the rules.  I guess if I were in the situation that you put your trainee in I'd have to weigh the costs of being seen as a pain in the ass vs. the benefits of reporting someone who was acting negligently  - or the risks of not reporting them.   I know that you are certain that he was only at risk of getting a boo-boo but life can sometimes throw a curveball and the most unlikely of things can and do happen. All it takes is a split second of negligence and serious consequences can be incurred. 

I'm glad you like me though... But you did pose this to the masses here and it seems many agree that it is not smart to take chances like.  IMO, not smart, not right, and most of all, not consensual. Or were you joking about that to begin with?


_____________________________

“These S&M people ... they are bossy! There’s also a creepy connection between leather sex, ‘Star Trek’ and the Renaissance Faire.”

- Comedian Margaret Cho

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 27
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