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RE: Leather slaves - 8/9/2006 11:33:17 PM   
MisPandora


Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kisshou

Thanks Ianwolf for the explanation.

MisPandora,

that term has cropped up a few times recently in the Gorean Forums so I started wondering about it. I thought it referred to a slave owned by a leather Master or in a leather family (am not sure of the correct terminology)

I asked in the forum because I wanted to hear from someone who might be living that type of lifestyle. To see if all people into the leather shared certain philosophies. It never occured to me that it might be all people who had a leather fetish for articles of clothing made from that material.

Thanks amoretta for the website links. This is such a huge BDSM community here on CM I thought I would get more answers.

Perhaps that's what the person who said it to you meant.....(re gay) but I don't know.  You might just ask them, no?

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to kisshou)
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RE: Leather slaves - 8/10/2006 1:56:50 AM   
amoretta


Posts: 57
Joined: 7/23/2006
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Leather slaves generally may have indicated gay male 40 years ago.. maybe even 20 years ago.. but is much more across be gender and sexual orientation board now...

My first post on this thread has an essay on what it is to be a slave in leather and while it is written by a gay male it is not just for gay men. I know heterosexual males and females that follow it as well.

(in reply to MisPandora)
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RE: Leather slaves - 8/10/2006 2:55:03 AM   
JustaDom


Posts: 84
Joined: 1/1/2004
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Thank you for the links, amoretta.

By the way, if you google "SlaveMaster" you will get results for two very, very different people. The first is John Edward Robinson of Olathe, Kansas. He was the one who made a lot of news in 2000 as a man arrested and later convicted for luring women over the internet for “sex and S&M,” killing them and storing their bodies in barrels. This man is a prime example of why the Leather/Gorean/BDSM organizations tout safe calls before meeting someone. He frequented chatrooms with the nick “SlaveMaster” and the gory details are at http://www.snopes.com/horrors/madmen/slavemaster.asp .

The SlaveMaster amoretta referred to has a very good reputation and is by every account I have heard of, an amazing public speaker. I believe he was at APEX last year and gave a very moving presentation on spirituality and how it integrates with the Leather lifestyle. I was taking a break from the scene at that time but I wished I had gone to that one.

Again, please keep in mind that these are two very different people. John Robinson is safely in prison.

Leather slaves are people and as such, there is an incredible amount of variety. Typically a Leather slave is well mannered, with military bearing and knowledge of Leather protocol. Leather protocol is somewhat based off military protocol and there is more to it than I can get into in this post. The rough gist of it for a Leather slave is like an enlisted member of the armed forces at a formal event and protocol for a Master is similar to a military officer. Protocol between two Leather slaves is often more informal and between a Leather slave and a well respected Master can become a bit like a Private addressing a full bird Colonel.

Another excellent resource is Jack Rinella. He's a gay Leatherman based out of Chicago and is the author of several books worth reading. They are written from his perspective as a gay Leather top/dom/master/etc. but I found a lot of what he writes about is applicable to any kind of dominant/submissive relationship.  I had the opportunity to talk with Jack at Ms. World Leather in Dallas three years ago. He seems to be a hellava guy, friendly and very easy to talk to. His website is http://www.leatherviews.com/ and he also writes a weekly article that is available on his website and via an email subscription.

Not everyone in the Leather lifestyle is a gay man with a leather or uniform fetish – I'll admit it can seem like that, it is a popular combination. They wear their leather with more style then is shown in the media, it isn't like the Blue Oyster bar in the Police Academy movies. There are plenty of lesbians, bisexuals and there has been a steady influx of heterosexuals as well. Gay men are the most visible and still seem to me to be the largest percentage of any single group but they are no longer a majority – at least at the events that I have been to.

I know some heterosexuals are leery due to the gay male/biker/whatever reputation that the Leather lifestyle has. There are some events and bars that want to remain gay only but overall heterosexuals are welcome and are sometimes the majority so don't let it stop you from going. I have never been hassled for being a heterosexual at a leather event, for bringing a girl to one or taking a girl for a walk on a leash at the Folsom Street Fair. (I highly suggest a leash at Folsom, it helps when things get crowded.)

I have been hit on though and while that took some getting used to for me, I've learned to take it as a complement. Gaydar isn't 100% accurate and I can't fault anyone for good taste.

Joe
(edited for formatting)


< Message edited by JustaDom -- 8/10/2006 2:59:02 AM >

(in reply to amoretta)
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RE: Leather slaves - 8/10/2006 4:16:14 AM   
kisshou


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thank you very, very much JustaDom I really appreciate you taking the time to contribute such a great answer. It is interesting to learn about other cultures that you didn't know existed, here and there I have heard leather mentioned on this site but you have painted a picture of it for me with your post.

(in reply to JustaDom)
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RE: Leather slaves - 12/24/2006 11:31:54 AM   
carolsea


Posts: 185
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: North Carolina
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i just re-read my own post and realized how stupid it is. Don't know what i was thinking, because i do know what a leather slave is. i must have been in a weird mood!

i sincerely apologize and am grateful to those of you who posted such excellent information!

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RE: Leather slaves - 12/24/2006 12:39:10 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: enigmabrat

I dont know what a leather slave is


In one of Robert Rubel's latest books he defines leather versus BDSM community on the basis of common versus individual protocols. In the Leather community there are some (not a lot) of standard protocols. If you go to a leather events you can see them in action -- however most leather events are for gay men who learn these protocols through their club contacts and generational training.

Of course as soon as non-gay men or non-leather trained anyone goes to these events they start to change.

In general I'd say that it seems more formal and more military than in BDSM, het, or pansexual events.

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Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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RE: Leather slaves - 12/24/2006 2:12:49 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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Joined: 10/25/2005
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My answer is similar to Archer- I would take "leather slave" to be "a slave who identifies as part of the leather sub-culture."

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RE: Leather slaves - 12/25/2006 8:01:14 PM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

Really you have to research what the leather sub culture is and what it's values and history are to get a good idea of what a leather format slave is. But Ianwolf discribed the real basics pretty well.


His descriptions work well for some of leather culture, but not all.  Just had to throw that in.

But I really quoted Archer for this line:

quote:

What their lives are like depends very much on the owner just as the daily life of any slave depends more on the specific owner than the format the owner uses.

Other than the fictional based dances and possitions names and such I think you'll find they live pretty similar lives to any other slave.


What he said.

I'm a leatherwoman.  I'm a slave.  That, I guess, makes me a "leather slave".  I'm not all protocol-y, social hierarchy-y, etc - I'm just me.  My owner is a (mostly) het man, I am a (mostly) gay woman.  Together, we're queer :)  And we're both leather.


(in reply to Archer)
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RE: Leather slaves - 12/26/2006 9:14:30 AM   
classykindasassy


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Joined: 12/13/2005
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hey - come to Dallas the weekend of Feb 22nd - and see all about leather/m/s life at South Plains Leather Fest, one of the best leather symposiums out there. Look it up on the net!



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RE: Leather slaves - 12/26/2006 6:32:05 PM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: classykindasassy

hey - come to Dallas the weekend of Feb 22nd - and see all about leather/m/s life at South Plains Leather Fest, one of the best leather symposiums out there. Look it up on the net!




I was there in 2006 - parts of my leather family often teach there :)

Thanks for the invite!  We're not going this year, though.

(in reply to classykindasassy)
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RE: Leather slaves - 12/26/2006 7:29:07 PM   
dawntreader


Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: amoretta

http://www.bornslaves.com/literature.html
Born Slaves Web site Literature link (by SlaveMaster) **best link listed I think**
(Really I would suggest reading all over this site..)



Very good link...thankyou!

(in reply to amoretta)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Leather slaves - 12/26/2006 8:02:20 PM   
erebus


Posts: 169
Joined: 1/15/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JustaDom

I know some heterosexuals are leery due to the gay male/biker/whatever reputation that the Leather lifestyle has. There are some events and bars that want to remain gay only but overall heterosexuals are welcome and are sometimes the majority so don't let it stop you from going. I have never been hassled for being a heterosexual at a leather event, for bringing a girl to one or taking a girl for a walk on a leash at the Folsom Street Fair. (I highly suggest a leash at Folsom, it helps when things get crowded.)



I've been to more than a few 'leather' events and the ones I've been to are more than welcoming to het men and women in the lifestyle.  I've also been to the Folsom Street Fair and found that maybe 1/2 or so of the crowd seems heterosexual.  The 'old guard' leather folk may have been predominantely gay, and the story goes that it largely dates to post-World War II guys who had this elaborate hankie signaling system.  However, this is controversial, and I've not been convinced that there was that large of a group that constituted the 'old guard'.  I also don't believe that the heterosexual crowd didn't exist before, say, 1970, though some would have you believe it.  Look at the popularity of Bettie (or is it Betty?) Page. 

Count me in if there's another 'leather' event.  I've enjoyed myself at them.  There is somewhat of a connection between the gay leather folks and the het bdsm and/or D/s crowd, at least in Sacramento. 

(in reply to JustaDom)
Profile   Post #: 32
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