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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 3:23:30 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline 		It is all entirely dependant on the people involved...a collar in-and-of-itself means nothing...its meaning is dependant on those involved in the collaring

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 3:31:27 PM   
pissdoll


Posts: 343
Joined: 5/25/2005
Status: offline 		if you uncollar her, thus placing her "back into consideration," she has every right to simply just leave.

if this is an acceptable outcome, then move forward.  but going along with the whole "every action has an equal and opposite reaction" concept, you could end up alone when all you simply wanted to do was prove a point. 

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 5:14:41 PM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline 		I have over 50 years of habits ingrained in me. Being told once to change just won't overcome 50 years of training. And being punished for a mistake caused by ingrained habits instead of him taking the time to retrain me, no thanks.

My oldest got a ticket for not being seatbelted last week. My response is to find a new way for her to remember to buckle before starting the engine instead of afterwards. I've suggested a piece of cardboard with the word BUCKLE to lean against the steering wheel for a month. Retraining. I didn't punish her nor did I say I'm selling the car because she has a bad habit her father taught her when he taught her to drive.

He gives me a learning curve and he finds ways that work to teach me, he doesn't just give me an order and expect me to solve the problem.

You can take the collar off but can you convince her to put it back on? Because once she feels you're removing it at any and every opportunity, she will have lost trust in you.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 5:19:12 PM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		Daddy revoking my collar would equate to a divorce. plain and simple.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 5:53:33 PM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		i wouldn't have much trust in a dom who would threaten removal of my collar as punishment. i would feel his committment to the relationship was weak and he wasn't very creative in his approach to promoting change.  Why would the dom want to only own what's good and positive in a sub? i think when you collar a sub you should know her well enough to understand her weaknesses and faults as a human being - no one is perfect.  Once it was threatened i don't think i could even take wearing it very seriously anymore - his using it as a threat would cheapen it, it would loose it's value - i would more then likely hand it back and just say sorry we made a mistake, it obviously held different meaning for each of us.  It really reeks to me also of manipulation and that's someting i just would not tolerate on any level.

< Message edited by velvetears -- 5/23/2007 5:55:08 PM >

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 6:08:16 PM   
SireKane


Posts: 105
Joined: 1/22/2004
Status: offline 		Corporal punishment is the ultimate behavior modification. If you don't know how to use corporal punishment,  find a master who will mentor you. Spare the rod spoil the slave.


Kane

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 6:34:36 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SeargentDave

My sub disobeyed me and I wanted to send a clear message that this behavior would not be tolerated. I did punish her accordingly and told her that if there was a repeat that I would take away her collar. It did get her attention but I was wondering if taking away one's collar was symbolic of breaking the relationship altogether. From a Dom's point of view, is this an acceptable punshment or should it only be done when the relationship is terminated.


Frankly if I remove someone's collar (symbol not just pure object here) then I have said "get the f out of my household".

I would never ever do this unless I needed to end the relationship but reflects the value of "collar" to me and to those I have owned.

When I started I fell into old patterns of threat and manipulation. I used to deny a sub or slave some service that meant a lot to them. Then a very wise slave (one part of a leather family I admire) talked to me about that. I realized that doing this was strippng me of my dominance may making into an angry manipulator instead of the owner I was trying to be.

It was not an easy pattern to break because I, at least, was raised to hold onto feelings and act out passively or subtly.

Let me tell you, I feel far more dominant, far more healthy, and far more myself when instead I simply state I am displeased, require correction and then more on together.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 6:58:54 PM   
Shylahgirl


Posts: 167
Joined: 8/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SeargentDave

My sub disobeyed me and I wanted to send  a clear message that this behavior would not be tolerated. I did punish her accordingly and told her that if there was a repeat that I would take away her collar. It did get her attention but I was wondering if taking away one's collar was symbolic of breaking the relationship altogether. From a Dom's point of view, is this an acceptable punshment or should it only be done when the relationship is terminated.


I am not a Domaniant, I am an owned and collard submissive, but I will give my opinion.

If Master were to take a way my collar I would concider it the end of the relationship. He has told me that removel of a symbole of ownership, I wear several symboles, which I worked to get, would mean that I am no longer owned by him... with the exception of a session collar/party collar of course.

If your sub has earned and put work into achiving her collar, it shouldn't be taken away as a teperary punishment, it would be almost like taking away the protection the symbole of the collar makes her feel, in my view. Another form of punishment may be better suited for the situation. I would give some more advice on that, but I don't know what the infraction was. If she has already been punished for the infraction and you have scared her with the threat of loosing the collar, she most likely will not comite the infraction again out of fear of harsher punishment (i.e.: Revoking the collar) that punishment in my view would feel like death for the time the collar was gone.

Shylah

< Message edited by Shylahgirl -- 5/23/2007 7:02:53 PM >

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 6:59:13 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SireKane

Corporal punishment is the ultimate behavior modification. If you don't know how to use corporal punishment,  find a master who will mentor you. Spare the rod spoil the slave.


Kane


This is a funny thing to say to a board full of masacistic slaves!!!

oh and we all love when we are compared to children!!!!

Magik's slave

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:14:10 PM   
shyinini


Posts: 550
Joined: 5/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: darkinshadows

It shouldn't be used as an empty threat, and to me - ends the relationship.  Not to be used as a punishment, because you are just whipping away any security and taking away trust.  Collaring is a commitment, not a punishment tool.
 
Peace



From anothers submsivvies perspective.
 
General consensus is that having a collar means a D owns a girl. 
I would then ask...if you intend to take her collar away, will you release ownership of her?
 
The authority and control of a D is only equaled to obedience, IMHO.
If you have set the  foundation of your relationship on her obeying you and she has defiantly disobeyed, not just once but several times, then I think you need to question her heart's intent.
 
For our relationship, yes he does punish for infractions and uses suitable discipline in each, but he also knows it is NOT ever, nor will it ever be to defiantly disobey. Personally, I cant see myself ever wanting to.
 
Obviously, only you know your girl.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:21:06 PM   
RandomGAGirl


Posts: 57
Joined: 3/16/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		I suppose it would depend on how the people involved in the relationship viewed the collar.  To me, as a sub, it would mean the end because I hold a lot of stock in collaring.  It is a sign of a serious commitment and that the sub/slave is formally bound to their Master/Mistress.  If I were wearing a collar right now that was never meant to be removed and my Master took it off I would probably faint dead away and/or start packing.  I know people have different opinions on this but the one that is going to matter is your subs.  There is a chance if you threaten to take away her collar for every infraction  she could start feeling insecure and opt to end things rather than live in fear of having her collar taken away.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:26:59 PM   
Calandra


Posts: 725
Joined: 11/22/2004
Status: offline 		I'm going to answer this without reading the other replies because I have encountered similar threads and I know I am not in the majority.
 
A collar is precious. Many people equate the collar with a wedding band, and I understand that similarity, however many people confuse the symbol with the actual relationship. 
 
My slaves know from the outset that the relationship comes into existence prior to any collaring. The relationship is negotiated and is already well developed before I place My collar around their throat. My collar doesn't supplant the relationship, it is a symbol only. I as the Dominant do not need to wear any symbol at all, yet that does not mean that I am not just as committed in the relationship, so why would anyone think that removing a collar for a time negates the relationship???
 
I explain to a slave early on in a relationship that they have an opportunity to reflect (good or bad) upon themselves and, by extension ME. They earn the priviledge of wearing a public symbol of My ownership (the collar) each and every day by the way they conduct themselves. I always make sure that My slaves know they are loved and valued. I prefer positive reinforcement, however if nothing else will impress My displeasure adequately, I will, as one of the last resorts, remove My collar.
 
I have found that if a slave knows from the outset exactly what My collar means and how it is to be viewed in the course of our relationship together then if and when a collar is removed as punishment, they double their efforts to repair the damage with Me. They also realize that I will do exactly what I say I will do, regardless of emotion and they gain respect for My principles. They feel the loss of the collar and realize how much they have taken it for granted. IF they don't feel that loss, they have no business being in My service.
 
Is the collar important? Oh yes!
Does removing it nullify the relationship? Hell no!

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:29:37 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

Addition:

Thinking about this topic more...like what would be wrong wtih hanging the collar on the wall somewhere, seeing it in a high place, symbolic of somehwere she needs to reach again...the collar isnt a wedding ring...it has more meaning to me than that, a collars meaning is defined and earned..even if someone had to go through a lot of rigmoral (sp?) to get it..does that mean they can just rest on their laurels after getting it?


If I work really hard for a promotion at work and get it, nobody, including me, expects I can just rest on my laurels after that.  Nor does anybody, including me, expect that if I blow it because of a learning curve, the boss is going to revoke my promotion.  For many, the collar is a symbol of ownership.  The OP talked about "revoking" the collar, not just simply not letting her wear it for awhile.  Such symbols can carry great weight with people.  I know after I left my husband, I couldn't remove my wedding ring for a year.

To me, threatening to revoke the collar is threatening to revoke ownership.  The last Dom I submitted to did that a lot.  It left me on very shaky ground, unable to trust that there was any foundation.  I finally told him since he couldn't seem to decide whether or not to keep me, I was deciding for him, and left...with LOTS of baggage.

Now, maybe the OP meant something different by "revoke" and only meant he'd not let her wear it for awhile.  In my relationship, I once asked if I should remove it because I didn't feel I deserved it.  My Master did wish to punish me, but didn't feel that doing something which seperated me emotionally from him was in our best interest.

I would recommend not toying with this option.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:37:52 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline
quote:

I would recommend not toying with this option.


yeah, I guess what it comes down to is, knowing your slave and what the repercussion would be if he enacted his threat.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:40:19 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

quote:

I would recommend not toying with this option.


yeah, I guess what it comes down to is, knowing your slave and what the repercussion would be if he enacted his threat.


That's really exactly what it boils down to.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:45:10 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		The question is can he swollow his pride admit he was wrong makeing that threat and tell her that while he was wrong with makeing that a punishment she will not go unpunished...While I agree you cant make idle threats it is so importent that when you make one that you then deside was not a good idea you are open and honest about it and instead of following through with something you know isnt a good idea you admit your mistake and come up with something better.

Magik's slave

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If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 7:52:11 PM   
TemptingNviceSub


Posts: 3054
Joined: 10/1/2005
Status: offline 		Pretty much as most state here..remove the collar and I am out the door.Removal to me would say that I am worthless and the Dominant is finished.There are way to many ways to punish for any to use this route. Use your imagination, your creativity, do not always go for the jugular!.Now if you wish to take away all sense of security and trust in your relationship..demean and demoralize her..well then HEY!..uncollar away..and enjoy the probable repercussions.To me, for one to use the collar as a threat or as punishment is simple not one I would stay with...Tempting

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/23/2007 8:14:56 PM   
WiseCracknSadist


Posts: 163
Joined: 10/27/2006
Status: offline 		It all depends on what the collar means to you and her and how much it means to her to wear it.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/24/2007 12:56:43 AM   
littlesarbonn


Posts: 1710
Joined: 12/3/2005
From: Stockton, California
Status: offline 		It really depends upon how your relationship is structured. For me, a collar symbolizes the relationship. Many years ago, my mistress took back my collar (she had found another service submissive she was convinced could replace me) and sent me on my merry way. A few months later, she contacted me through community friends saying she had changed her mind, the other relationship didn't work out to her specifications, and she was willing to "give me another chance". I accepted an offer for graduate school across the country and never spoke to her again. She had already ended the relationship.

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RE: Revoking your subs collar - 5/24/2007 1:07:56 AM   
HeavansKeeper


Posts: 1254
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

disobeyed me and I wanted to send a clear message that this behavior would not be tolerated. I did punish her accordingly and told her that if there was a
quote:

ORIGINAL: SeargentDave

My sub disobeyed me and I wanted to send  a clear message that this behavior would not be tolerated. I did punish her accordingly and told her that if there was a repeat that I would take away her collar. It did get her attention but I was wondering if taking away one's collar was symbolic of breaking the relationship altogether. From a Dom's point of view, is this an acceptable punshment or should it only be done when the relationship is terminated.


I did this to My Pet ONCE.  It was horrible for both of us.  It was like waving divorce paper's at a wife.  It screams "This relationship is not important to me."  It is an example of relational aggression, the same as saying "then I won't be your friend anymore."  The sub's collar is her (or his) most sacred posession.  To take it away as a punishment can only fit crimes that make you want to end the relationship. 
 
My Pet and I call the night I did that "the bad night." It was a huge mistake.  The only good thing that came from it was I got to feel the weight of My Pet's collar.
 
I suggest you don't do it.  You can't undo it once you have.  My Pet will always look at me as someone who has taken off her collar.  Even if it never happens again, she will always consider it.  I regret it.

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