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BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:15:14 PM

SimplyMichael

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Joined: 1/7/2007
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This has been rattling around in my head since I noticed it. The largest BDSM playspace in San Francisco is hosting a dedicated D/s event. The promo has some cool lines like

quote:

Come out and celebrate the joys of Domination, submission, and protocol.

Once again, Master John and majordomo keri will open the doors of the Citadel for couples, triads, or other groupings, to enjoy an evening of protocol and play. The last Cuffs and Collars was a great success and we hope that you will come out and join us for another wonderful evening!

This party is to celebrate being collared, or having someone collared to you, and the protocol that you share. Enjoy your rituals in an environment where they will be honored. Share your own unique traditions with other Dominants. You will be able to scene in a space where what happens before and after the play is respected just as much as what happens during the play.

So sounds cool and I hope to attend. However, the following is also included and it just rubs me the wrong way....

quote:

"There will be a submissive safe space for networking, bonding, and support from fellow subs, both male and female. "

Why?

No singles will be allowed so who exactly do the submissives need a "safe" space from? It isn't like we have seen marathon non-stop D/s events and we might have to worry about exhaustion and need to give them rest. If someone needs a safe space in order to endure an evening of D/s with their presumed partner, what exactly is that saying? Since one would presume most could manage to offer up a single night of servitude in public, D/s events are so rare, AND there are many support groups for submissives it just strikes me as odd.

I consider submissives my equal on a conceptual level and fully expect them to be functioning adults able to inform and defend their various boundaries, again, what exactly is the need for this space? Not sure if the idea is just silly, insulting, or just not my cup of tea.

I am curious to hear others thoughts.

Post #: 1

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:20:11 PM

Viridana

Posts: 754
Status: offline

I think the general idea is to have a place where subs can chat up without having doms to "bother them", sort of a sub-café. Calling it a safe space is a bit badly worded because that is something I connect with a haven for abused people and so forth. But I don't think the idea is in the sorts that it sounds like.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 2

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:33:34 PM

velvetears

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Joined: 6/19/2006
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i would interpret it as just a place for the subs to let their hair down so to speak and not have to be in "submissive mode" but a place where they can relax and just hang out with their fellow subs and chat... maybe even gosssip a bit about the big bad doms out there lol

_____________________________

Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

(in reply to Viridana)

Post #: 3

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:37:48 PM

Copulo

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Joined: 5/3/2007
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Sounds great Michael

We sometimes have D/s rooms at our club. We have a pit where a sub can take public humiliation in front of a whole audience of people. It often becomes very interactive with people being pulled in out of the audience but then we don’t stop single subs coming to our club.

I think the safe zone is more like a crèche. It’s a place you can pop your sub in if you for example wanted to go off and do some interactive play with another Dom and his sub or just wanted to go to the loo for a long job!! A sub having to stand around on her own will feel far more vulnerable in a D/s enviroment than they would in a normal play club.
I agree that its not worded at all well and would be perhaps inclined to pull them up on that one.
All clubs rely on customer feedback to get things right.

(in reply to Viridana)

Post #: 4

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:42:07 PM

earthycouple

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Joined: 2/19/2006
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I agree, Michael with the first two posts in that "safe" is a VERY bad word and connotation. I would venture to presume they meant a place for subs to network and learn from each other. It would really rub me wrong to see my local play space suggest that subs need a "safe place". A chatter box, a resting room, a networking area...but safe? please...my slave is safest when in my presence as far as I'm concerned and I'm sure he would agree.

_____________________________

D~

Seeking, searching, hoping, living, loving, jumping. So what's new with you?

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 5

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 4:50:50 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Copulo

I think the safe zone is more like a crèche. It’s a place you can pop your sub in if you for example wanted to go off and do some interactive play with another Dom and his sub or just wanted to go to the loo for a long job!! A sub having to stand around on her own will feel far more vulnerable in a D/s enviroment than they would in a normal play club.

But even that definition comes off as downgrading the notion that subs or slaves are "mature, functioning, consentual adults".

Its kind of like saying... "Drop your kids off at our playroom so you can go off and do adult things with other adults without having to worry about your kids getting underfoot, making a mess, or crying because they are alone with all these strange adults."

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 6

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:02:34 PM

Copulo

Posts: 268
Joined: 5/3/2007
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Yes I agree with you MadRabbit but I also have to admit that when I first started going to clubs and didn’t know people, if was left alone for any length of time then I was afraid and Im dominant!! I look feminine, I am small, dainty and I have had opportunist men trying it on. I once got pulled into a dark room by a big guy.
Even recently my partner had to nearly poke a guys eye out because he was using his brawn to intimidate me in a come on sort of way. All I can say in these sort of situations is thank goodness I know people because if I didn’t then I would not want to be standing on my own in a club.
In a D/s environment you can smell the testosterone

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 7

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:05:09 PM

MadRabbit

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Joined: 8/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Copulo

In a D/s environment you can smell the testosterone

Well...that I can agree with it.

I can smell it here.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 8

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:10:55 PM

Copulo

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Joined: 5/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

But even that definition comes off as downgrading the notion that subs or slaves are "mature, functioning, consentual adults".

This has nothing what so ever to do with maturity. When a man tries it on with a vanilla girl in a club because her partner is at the bar or in the loo, what happens?
More often than not a fight or at least a conflict between the two guys.
Remember also that in a vanilla club the girl is fully dressed. In a D/s club the girl could well be naked and we all know what naked does to people. It makes them feel vulnerable.
Consenting yes, but consenting to her partner and not some smarmy aggressive Dom that thinks he can step right on her partners toes.
Most subs want to feel safe and it is our responsibility as a dominant to ensure they are safe.
There are well weathered subs that can look after themselves but there are new subs coming into this that will need looking after just that bit more.

edited cos I can't spell!

< Message edited by Copulo -- 5/24/2007 5:12:17 PM >

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 9

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:12:34 PM

MagiksSlave

Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Copulo

Sounds great Michael

We sometimes have D/s rooms at our club. We have a pit where a sub can take public humiliation in front of a whole audience of people. It often becomes very interactive with people being pulled in out of the audience but then we don’t stop single subs coming to our club.

I think the safe zone is more like a crèche. It’s a place you can pop your sub in if you for example wanted to go off and do some interactive play with another Dom and his sub or just wanted to go to the loo for a long job!! A sub having to stand around on her own will feel far more vulnerable in a D/s enviroment than they would in a normal play club.
I agree that its not worded at all well and would be perhaps inclined to pull them up on that one.
All clubs rely on customer feedback to get things right.

Im sorry but when Master goes off to the bathroom or to play with another at a club I feel no need for him to drop me off at daycare... this sounds like the nercery at the gym that you drop you Unmentionables off at while you work out.. I dont know about the other slaves but Im a fully functioning adult and dont need to be droped off anywhere by Master while he goes about his busyness if I did I dont think Master would be takeing me out.. He wants his slave to be an adult!! Im kinda tired of people acting as if sub/slaves are no more then children!!

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 10

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:24:38 PM

Copulo

Posts: 268
Joined: 5/3/2007
Status: offline

Well we have never had such a place in our club but many many times I have been handed a sub to look after whilst her/his Master/Mistress go off to do something and many times I have handed my sub over to be looked after by a friend whilst I go to do something.
The reason I do this is part of the D/s head trip and nothing to do with weather or not they can look after themselves. I know my subs will be safe within a club because they know a lot of people but I hand them over all the same!
Believe it or not MagiksSlave, many subs actually enjoy this.

If we want to be all grown up and mature about it then why keep our eyes downcast or remain on speech deprivation. I mean why not be allowed to talk when you can converse as intelligently as the next person!!!

My subs are not only fully functioning adults too but are also articulate, well educated and responsible. But when they are in a club environment with me they are kept on an extremely tight reign. The dynamics of who they are in the outside world changes and they become submissive.
If your Master does not desire to do that then fine. If I desire to do that then that’s fine too.

< Message edited by Copulo -- 5/24/2007 5:31:48 PM >

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

Post #: 11

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:45:15 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

It perpetuates the idea that subs are not fully capable adults and want to be coddled.

And there's a lot of subs who enjoy living up (down?) to that idea.

I can see if you wanted an "age space friendly area" or a "sub only friendly are" or a "whip cracking area" but the "sub safe area"??? cmon.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 12

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 5:51:39 PM

Suleiman

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Fast reply and first guess off the top of my head, not every D/S relationship includes the right to speak freely and openly. Maybe the safe space is there so that the subs with speech restrictions or other similar requirements get a chance to let their hair down and say hello to their friends. Maybe it's supposed to be the submissive equivalent to a dog run at the park. Maybe someone just thought it was a good idea, and nobody had the time, energy, or mental acuity nessesary to consider the idea in any depth. Maybe they expect some folks to be wearing velcro collars, and they need a spot set aside for when this stops being fun. Maybe subs are just special and get additional perks and priveledges. Who knows? Have you actually contacted them and asked?

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 13

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:00:02 PM

MagiksSlave

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Joined: 9/11/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Copulo

Well we have never had such a place in our club but many many times I have been handed a sub to look after whilst her/his Master/Mistress go off to do something and many times I have handed my sub over to be looked after by a friend whilst I go to do something.
The reason I do this is part of the D/s head trip and nothing to do with weather or not they can look after themselves. I know my subs will be safe within a club because they know a lot of people but I hand them over all the same!
Believe it or not MagiksSlave, many subs actually enjoy this.

If we want to be all grown up and mature about it then why keep our eyes downcast or remain on speech deprivation. I mean why not be allowed to talk when you can converse as intelligently as the next person!!!

My subs are not only fully functioning adults too but are also articulate, well educated and responsible. But when they are in a club environment with me they are kept on an extremely tight reign. The dynamics of who they are in the outside world changes and they become submissive.
If your Master does not desire to do that then fine. If I desire to do that then that’s fine too.

This is where you are assuming to much about my relationship, I dont keep my eyes down cast and Im never on speach restriction Master allows me to cary on intelagent and sometimes even just silly convos with all others when we are at events... I dont see how it is Domly to treats ones slave like (unless of course it is for roleplay, because me and Master do do that sometimes) a child but thats just me!!

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

(in reply to Copulo)

Post #: 14

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:00:31 PM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

If this is a heavy protocol event then the idea of a sub room only is a good one. Frequently high protocol types have the rule that a sub cannot approach anyone else. Which means that if the dom is sitting down for a fantasy baseball league talk with his friends then the sub will be standing there with no interaction for an hour. Whereas in a sub only room he/she can talk and make friends.

But the wording is dreadful.

(in reply to Suleiman)

Post #: 15

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:07:29 PM

SimplyMichael

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Joined: 1/7/2007
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How much "high protocol" is there if a submissive is left alone some wolf will have his way with her? Same goes for the little twit if standing or waiting for an hour is "too much" for her/him.

(in reply to Celeste43)

Post #: 16

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:08:17 PM

earthycouple

Posts: 4462
Joined: 2/19/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

quote:

ORIGINAL: Copulo

Well we have never had such a place in our club but many many times I have been handed a sub to look after whilst her/his Master/Mistress go off to do something and many times I have handed my sub over to be looked after by a friend whilst I go to do something.
The reason I do this is part of the D/s head trip and nothing to do with weather or not they can look after themselves. I know my subs will be safe within a club because they know a lot of people but I hand them over all the same!
Believe it or not MagiksSlave, many subs actually enjoy this.

If we want to be all grown up and mature about it then why keep our eyes downcast or remain on speech deprivation. I mean why not be allowed to talk when you can converse as intelligently as the next person!!!

My subs are not only fully functioning adults too but are also articulate, well educated and responsible. But when they are in a club environment with me they are kept on an extremely tight reign. The dynamics of who they are in the outside world changes and they become submissive.
If your Master does not desire to do that then fine. If I desire to do that then that’s fine too.

This is where you are assuming to much about my relationship, I dont keep my eyes down cast and Im never on speach restriction Master allows me to cary on intelagent and sometimes even just silly convos with all others when we are at events... I dont see how it is Domly to treats ones slave like (unless of course it is for roleplay, because me and Master do do that sometimes) a child but thats just me!!

Magik's slave

Oh for goodness sake she didn't mean YOU specificall, MagiksSlave...she meant general protocols that are adhered to by some...and she's right.

_____________________________

D~

Seeking, searching, hoping, living, loving, jumping. So what's new with you?

(in reply to MagiksSlave)

Post #: 17

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:09:32 PM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

Standing with no interaction for an hour might lead to poor headspace so that when his favorite piece of furniture becomes available, she can't tolerate play. For some of us, tolerance is dependent on mood.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 18

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 6:09:40 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

When I read that it makes me think that if you aren't collared or have someone collared that you shouldn't bother to show up. Don't even get me started on the entire subs needing a safe place. Everyone here knows how I feel about people needing to put on their grown up pants!

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 19

RE: BS or D/s - a long winded question? - 5/24/2007 7:16:14 PM

daddysprop247

Posts: 1712
Joined: 6/24/2005
From: DC Metro area
Status: offline

it is poorly worded i agree, but actually what bothered me most when i first read it was the implication that this will be a "no Doms allowed" space, and i'm not comfortable with the idea of anything that restricts Dominants in such ways, especially in regards to their own property. of course they may not mean that at all...that's just what came to mind upon reading those words.

it is true that some submissives are indeed vulnerable people, who if left alone in an environment like a lifestyle club, even for a few minutes, could be harassed or molested by other Dominants. this happened to me the very first time my Master took me to a bdsm club. He left me standing alone while he used the restroom, the second he was gone a strange man came up behind me and proceeded to grab and grope me, shove me against the wall, and fingered me, which is how my Master found us when he returned. my Master was irritated with the man and dealt with him, but he was proud of me for showing no resistance and just being still as he had taught me. after that experience he always hands my leash to another trusted Dominant if he needs to step away for a bit.

then there are relationship protocols, as someone else mentioned. at such events, i am not permitted to speak to any man without first being spoken to, and with my Master's permission. i cannot speak while he is speaking (for instance if he is speaking to a Master in a M/s couple, i cannot speak to the slave). i also cannot leave his side and wander around on my own. so interaction with other submissives or slaves can be next to impossible under such conditions.

so with all of those things considered, the idea of there being a space set aside for submissives to interact with one another sounds very appealing.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 20

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