Rituals (Full Version)

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Erusvi -> Rituals (1/14/2004 10:04:01 AM)

A few days ago, in chat, I tossed out the following, in the interest of sparking conversation. I did not expect the discourse that followed:

ErusVI: "Have you ever done something for yourself, simply out of habit, like wash a dish or open your car door.. only to turn around and see your slave distressed that she didn't get to do it for you?"

ErusVI: "I almost feel kinda bad about it sometimes".

MistressX: "But you don't feel bad for long, I bet :)".

ErusVI: "Well, I don't lose sleep over it ;o) "

subX: "Well, why would she open the door for you? Shouldn't you be opening the door for her?"

ErusVI: "Because she's my slave, and that's part of her duties. It's a show of respect."

subX: "What? Why don't you respect your slave?"

ErusVI: "I don't respect my slave??? Where do you get that?"

subX: "I just don't know why a so called Master needs that kind of validation - having his slave open doors for him."

ErusVI: "I don't think our views on protocol agree, subX"

At this point, the conversation spiraled into inanity. I was so affronted that this girl was being harshly judgemental of something that's an integral part of my interaction with my slave. I was amazed at the vitriol that rolled off of her virtual tongue. I asked her if she was collared. She said that she wasn't. I was hardly shocked to hear it.

This girl has since posted a warning to other submissives in her profile, "do your best not to follow those that tell you things like you must open doors for them to be sub or slave".

I am still amazed. People can be entirely disappointing sometimes.

All of this (was a bit of blowing off steam and...) was a lead in to the following question:

What kinds of rituals and practices do you integrate into your daily lives as master and slave? These are things above and beyond obedience and reverence. These are things that are physical/verbal acknowledgements of the roles in your relationship.

I thought this might be an interest exchange of ideals and philosophies, and how they are played out in your daily routines.


Something to ponder...



shai^tana -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 10:19:20 AM)

good day
in response this girl would offer that she has noted some who are in various places along the continuum of slavery. It seems that there are some who still struggle with how the "woman" and the "slave" manifest together, especially in the brilliantly illuminated outside world.

A Man would be conditioned to open the door for a woman, and to act in the way He has been socialized to do. A Master would set those protocols and preferences Himself. It is His obligation to set a manner of behaviour for His slave that provides her the security and comfort of knowing who she is at all times, thus giving her a comfortable place to exit. This is even more important when they are in the public eye. These routines/protocols/etc also allow the Master to view her as his slave even when surrounded by others, and are perhaps even un-noticed by others. This speaks loudly to both of how they are vastly different from people around them, and serves to integrate who they are with the general population.

if a girl might make the observation that at times the traditional socialization roles, and the roles within the slave can be in conflict.

It is a broad lifestyle, and people enter it where they wish, and take from its tenets what they feel enhance their own existance, and bring them joy. Perhaps we need take care not to be too judgemental of others except to turn away from anything that makes us feel less committed or less at peace within our own lifestyle choices. We must reject that which has no relevance for us personally, yet allow that others may not be at the same place in the continuum as we are.

this girl is long familiar with the judgmental attitudes of others who would judge her chosen path. Yet it is one that has brought much joy as struggles have been overcome and progress made. Many judge the Gorean way badly and can be more hostile than they have a right to be.
The lifestyle has brought great joy over several years now, where the Master Owner and this girl both live and work within the public community.
shai^tana



Erusvi -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 10:30:20 AM)

Nearly flawlessly put, shai^tana. You reflect well on your master. Give him my regards.

I say 'nearly' flawless only because you didn't answer the question. Gorean tradition is thick with rituals. I have incorporated some of them into my routines, in fact. What kinds of rites has your master prescribed for you, if any?



shai^tana -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 10:57:51 AM)

this one has to smile and shake her head. Saw the forest...forgot the trees.

rituals can be small and almost seem to be senseless to others. Some of the routines, or prescribed methods of behaving (which ultimately influence how one thinks and sees themselves and the world) usually involve methods of speaking. This is certainly true of most Gorean slave training.

This is a powerful ritual when you consider that one has to stop and think carefully not only about WHAT one says, but HOW one says it. This is rarely done today, as seen by people who let slip a profanity in conversation, or who are heard to say such things as:"that isnt what I meant...I meant to say", or..."forget that - this is what I really wanted you to know", or..."ok ok I didnt mean to make you angry".More and more people spend time and energy on the Content of what they want to say, and give less thought to how they say it.

So....when one has to think about HOW they say it, more importantly perhaps than the content, it makes one stop, go slowly and think clearly about how it will be received. How will it appear to others, and more so, how will others see me as a result of it. The feedback of others cannot help but reflect on this girl and from that one gains definition. This girl is somewhat different from others in public, yet many friends cannot put their finger on why that is so. For this girl, the greatest way that it is possible to honour Master is to speak with thought and with the utmost respect. Much of the early training was focused on these matters. Even at times when the behaviour may need correcting, the expression of how well this girl knows her place, is intact.
How?....well....here are a few examples.

  • a girl does not ever call to her Master, unless to warn of danger. Whether in public or not, this girl goes to where He is, becomes acknowledged, then speaks.

  • this girl uses creative terms to address her Master as opposed to using His Christian name when with others. These are often interpreted as amusing, yet they require this girl to think and to be appropriate.

  • absolute textbook verbal manners are required. Thank you, please, no thank you, and the use of "Sir" to any gentleman who is in positions of authority, or in age should be afforded such a courtesy.

    There are some matters which are relaxed in certain settings. In the business world where this girl functions, it would be difficult and misunderstood to stylize speech. There are also no acknowledged Masters present who would identify with what was spoken. In short - it is inappropriate. However, other speech is NOT inappropriate and keeps this girl focused on who she is even when surrounded by those who do not embrace similar lifestyle choices. Small things perhaps, but have been incorporated into language which this girl uses in the workplace.
    A girl does not use words which are slang or colloquial in nature, and takes care to look directly at anyone speaking to her. At no time is the voice to be raised, and no anger is permitted to show.This shows respect and a presence to speak properly thus reflecting well on Masters training of this girl.

    It is difficult to discuss more of these here specifically, yet manner of dress, jewellery, routines upon arriving home from work, schedule of activities in a day, evening routines, hygiene routines are some of the arenas in which routines apply.

    This girl hopes this more properly answers what was posed.
    shai^tana



EStrict -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 1:43:26 PM)

Hello Sir,

Some rituals or routines I have known within the lifestyle:

My first Dom was one who enjoyed the protocol of me waiting beside a door on in a car for him to open the door. When he arrived home from work, I was to get him a drink, and bring it to his chair, kneeling beside it until he decided what was next. Sometimes, it was something to pleasure him physically, sometimes it was to draw him a bath, or cook dinner.

Some of those things transfered into other lifestyle relationships I have had.

With my current Master, there are actually less routines. He expects me to think and do whatever I need to do make his life run smoothly. He expects short explainations, not every detail of things I did or do. He expects me to deal with the daily aspects of our life, taking care of the problems, and only giving him the resolutions unless there is a choice I feel he would prefer to make or an issue I need his help dealing with it.

Master *expects* me to get his drinks or food, and I am very use to it, so, like your slave, I look surprised when he goes out to the kitchen himself. On the occassions he decides he wants to cook (a habit he got into in his many years as a bachlor), he fully expects me to understand he can change the rules at any given time, and my *new* routine is to clean up the inevitable mess. ::laughing:: 'cause he is self-taught in cooking things he likes, but sees no reason why he should be the one that cleans up afterward.

Though it may not sound like a routine, that I think is the one he enjoys the most. Telling me I am not *allowed* to do something I usually do out of habit, or to help in a project he wishes to do himself. I am getting better at watching, but I see his smile when he can see I'm practically bouncing up and down wanting to help.

Sandy



Erusvi -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 2:49:12 PM)

shai^tana:

Absolutely brilliant. From what I have read, you have a very impressive grasp on your role as a slave. You said it very well, "the greatest way that it is possible to honour Master is to speak with thought and with the utmost respect". Our communication skills largely affect the way that we are perceived and regarded by those around us. More importantly, they also affect the way that we carry ourselves. Laziness in speech, posture, and bearing speaks poorly of one's self-esteem, and in the case of a slave, reflects poorly on thier master/mistress. You, kajira, do your master good service in this regard.

Estrict/Sandy:
It's all part of the challenge of being a slave: "he fully expects me to understand he can change the rules at any given time". I, for one, couldn't do it. I'd have to stop and say, "alright, look.. either we're doing it this way or we're doing it that way. You're making me dizzy. You've got to make up your mind".

But then, I'm really not slave material. Hats off to all of you who are not only able to do it, but thrive within that role.



strictandcruel -> RE: Rituals (1/14/2004 7:35:13 PM)

Erusvi

I agree with what you are saying and this is spot on

"It is a broad lifestyle, and people enter it where they wish, and take from its tenets what they feel enhance their own existance, and bring them joy. Perhaps we need take care not to be too judgemental of others except to turn away from anything that makes us feel less committed or less at peace within our own lifestyle choices. We must reject that which has no relevance for us personally, yet allow that others may not be at the same place in the continuum as we are. "

It's that old "my kink is OK, your kink is bad" that I find to be such a turn off. The sad part is that the ones like you were talking to can't see what they are doing or saying.

Personally my parents taught us to be very polite to others and from that I have learned to except others wherever they are in their learnings and life, if they can't understand me and my ways I simply put them on ignore and move on. I think you handled it well.


shai^tana

Well said. your Master must be very proud of you for reflecting so well on his training of you.

My last live in long term slave was not allowed to use my given name which made her be creative in public when a vanilla facade was called for, she was not allowed to ever disagree with her master but was expected to offer alternative ideas when asked, this made her think through what she was going to say before saying it.

Like you she was expected to act toward and speak politely to others in public thus reflecting in a positive way on me. It was not hard for her to learn to do this because she is from the South and brought up to use "Yes Sir or Yes Ma'am as was fitting.

When she spoke out of place I would give her a order of silence which would bring her close to tears at having displeased me.

Thank you both for sharing with us


strictandcruel



strictandcruel -> RE: Rituals (1/15/2004 7:16:19 AM)

Trees what trees? I don't got to see no stinking trees...

OK to answer Erusvi original question..

Yes being a polite person I often hold doors open for vanilla others and even for my slave on rare occasions when distracted out of habit and yes it did bother her making her feel denied her place. *shrugs* It's ingrain into childhood upbringing.

The new one if she kneels and begs for my collar will have to learn the lessons on protocol and no doubt I will shock her by being first to the door and holding it open for her from time to time when my mind is on other things.

strictandcruel



Voltare -> RE: Rituals (1/15/2004 9:33:22 AM)

Erusvi,

I read your scenerio with a bit of a chuckle, almost like it was deja-vu. What I finally reconciled myself with, was that there really is no 'wrong' way for a submissive to be - just wrong for me. In talking with some submissives, I usually ask a few questions along the lines of "how important is protocol to you?" "Do you enjoy ritual as part of service?" I've found that a substantial number of submissives are looking to simply enjoy a 'normal' household that one might have found on Leave it to Beaver in the 50s, where the Dad is the stern, bread winner, the Mom the loving, gracious housewife. For this sort of relationship, it would be the man opening doors, lifting heavy things, and generally doing things 'for himself' while mom tends the domestic duties. By contrast, most slaves I've encountered say they would happily serve without question in the bedroom, but in todays age where she's probably working outside the home, would prefer an even split of domestic chores.

I enjoy ritualism in my life, seeing a woman on her knees is truely beautiful to my eyes. I enjoy the small things, having her fetch a drink, or cook a meal, or washing my hair and shaving my face. I can shave myself in less then 90 seconds, and it takes most women nearly five minutes - so it's hardly a matter of being 'lazy' or convience. It's simply one way to take an 'ordinary' activity, and turning into one more way to share the day with her.

Stephan



pinkdiamond2 -> RE: Rituals (1/15/2004 9:41:57 PM)

Hello Erusvi......

So i see that my statement to you seemed to upset you, and made you forget what was really said. This is understandable being as you felt the need to down me in the room and i simply stated my opinion, which last i checked is allowed in O/our country.

Yes, i asked you why you felt the need to have a woman open the door for you that i do not dispute. This choice is yours there is no doubt of this, i asked you why you felt the need to do so was the question. This you obviously took offense to which is also your choice. Would appear it got to you, thinking about it is a good thing!! To react and lower yourself to trying to belittle me (the part you forgot to add in your statement) was also a choice you made.....but keep in mind i did not once lower myself nor disrespect you, i simply asked a question of your "standards".

Those answering this, i respect Y/your opinions greatly!! But, keep in mind the whole picture was not at all presented to Y/you. i asked the question (very resepectfully, ask A/anyone that was there) and i got attacked by Erusvi about a collar which i have choosen not to take as of yet, once again because of a "so called Master" that i did belong to for two years and devoted myself completely to Him only to have my servitude and soul ripped out from me. i am back and i am ready to decide along with Another to devote myself once again to who i am completely. This, Erusvi, you didn't take the time to learn, you made the choice to attack as your manhood was challenged. i know who i am and what i am, i don't need societys acceptance let alone yours Erusvi any more than you need mine. What i am saying is if O/one is going to tell a story, tell it all!! Your attack on me was totally uncalled for and A/anyone there except you and your sub/slave (forgive me i know not which she is) agreed and that is what set you off on this need to once again try and get me to back down to you. You do not own me therefore i can respectfully speak whenever i so choose. If you care not to listen, this is once again your choice of course.

i stand by my original opinion that a Gentleman will open the door for His lady/wife/lover/sub/slave. Now, this is not to say that should it be decided between the T/two in a certain situation this will change, but for the most part a Dom/Master/Gentleman will always treat what is His as a princess in front of O/others unless with O/others of the lifestyle and she has misbehaved or the situation calls for such behavior. To take her to the mall and walk in before her, making her carry all the packages shows a small man in my eyes. Slaves/subs are people, women, men, mothers, fathers from all different walks of life. W/we are all adults and should behave as such with the respect for A/anyone around U/us vanilla or in O/our chosen path of life. i gave you that, you didn't and still don't with your partial story give me any.

With this i will say to E/everyone out there, i am very proud of who i am, what i am and will always be!! i Thank Y/you for taking the time to read this and would also add that i wish Y/you A/all happiness in whatever paths Y/you take!!

Erusvi, if you were to take the time and not be so defensive and be honest with yourself and O/others here you will admit that not once in that talk did i show sarcasm or disrespect to you. But i cannot say that of you.

Respect is earned!! To get it O/one has to give it!! It isn't just handed over because there is a Capital letter at the start of a name or Dom/Lord/Master etc.

Once again i stand by my words as i always do.....

pinkdiamond2



Erusvi -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 10:49:59 AM)

Note, pinkdiamond, I did not mention your name in the post above. If I were out to 'belittle you', that would not have been my gambit, eh?

I have no problem whatsoever with the question of "Why do you have your slave open your car door for you?" That is a fair question that I would be pleased to answer.

You didn't take that route. You launched into an attack, first on that practice, and then on my character. To wit:

quote:

"why would she open the door for you? Shouldn't you be opening the door for her?


and then the attack on my character:

quote:

"I just don't know why a so called Master needs that kind of validation"


You seem to feel entirely comfortable ripping into something that you don't understand. You didn't ask this question searching for clarification. You piggybacked this question on the denouncement of the practice. It was far more about casting aspersions at me than it was about seeking enlightenment.

I asked if you had a collar. That query began as a line of questioning into ritual and symbology and why they were beneficial. It was supposed to be a point of reference from which I could explain the reasoning behind the practice of having my slave open my car door for me.

You said that you didn't, and why did that have anything to do with anything, and why was I attacking you?

Well, at that point, It was clear to me that you were not interested in hearing me out. I decided that you were no longer worth my time. I said that I was hardly surprised. You pressed for further banter, at which point I told you that this entire conversation had become ridiculous and I was quite content disregarding your existance.

Your cheering section contained a man who you've obviously been carrying some sort of on-line parley with. You'll have to forgive me if I attribute his support to the pre-established relationship with you.

I'm not here to find slaves. I'm not here recruiting. I'm here to share and learn and meet with others in this amazing lifestyle. I give as I get. Respect warrants respect. Decency warrants decency. You attacked me, pinkdiamond. You had no reason to.

You said it quite well...
quote:

W/we are all adults and should behave as such with the respect for A/anyone around U/us vanilla or in O/our chosen path of life.


Saying it is one thing, pinkdiamond. You might want to take it into practice. You'll get a lot farther in life, I assure you.



Voltare -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 11:47:33 AM)

greetings pinkdiamond,

in the snippet of the conversation posted, your name was not included; thus the example shown did not appear to be a veiled attempt to attack your character, but to simply express frustration. If he did actually down you in the room, that's between you two as the rest of us weren't there. You mentioned that you did not disrespect him, only questioned his standards, yet comments like

"What i am saying is if O/one is going to tell a story, tell it all!! Your attack on me was totally uncalled for "

"To take her to the mall and walk in before her, making her carry all the packages shows a small man in my eyes."

"Erusvi, if you were to take the time and not be so defensive and be honest with yourself and O/others here you will admit that not once in that talk did i show sarcasm or disrespect to you. "

strike me, personally, as intentionally offensive and sarcastic indeed. I hardly lay claim to never speaking out of anger or frustration, and it's not my intention to judge you for your opinions, as you are, indeed, entitled to the opinions.

Five months ago, I arrived at the station to meet for the first time a woman I had met online in another personals site. She immediately grabbed for my bags, and carried them out to the car. She quickly opened the door to the car for me, put the bags away, and then stored the luggage. Until that point, I had never met a slave who had ever done so - and was more then a little surprised. In the car we talked about it, and she explained that it was a strong desire of hers to do these things for a man. At first, it was actually annoying sitting there in the car waiting for her to move around to my side to open the door. I prefer to walk next to a girl when in public, but she insisted on walking two steps behind me. I thought "well, it's her thing so I'll give it a try." In the end, it just didn't work out with her for other reasons. I *do* like to do things for myself, but I also enjoy letting a woman do things for me, if it makes her happy. I don't see this having anything to do with my size, manhood, or any other matter save for the way a consenting adult and I enjoy interaction.

In truth, I do understand what your concern is. A submissive/slave/etc doesn't have to become a servent per se to be submissive. Submission has nothing to do with shaving a dominant, holding the door, lowering one's eyes, or kneeling. An expression of submission can be any of these things, or any thousands of other expressions many of which would only be known to the two in the relationship, subtly, even unconsciously.

Sweeping statements such as 'any Dom who expects...' and 'any sub who expects..' invariably has more exceptions then it does rules. Women needn't be doormats to be slaves, but neither do they need to be pitbulls. There will, of course, be people on both ends of the spectrum. As you stated yourself "and A/anyone there except you and your sub/slave (forgive me i know not which she is) agreed..." Truth be told - who else matters?

Stephan



EStrict -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 1:14:30 PM)

hi Pink. I want to make comments about 4 things in your post:

You say that ErusVI made you look bad in his post. I didn't see him mention you. I am sure you are not the first (or will not be the last) that feels it's ok to slam someone else in a room for their beliefs. And that is what the post was actually about.

You say that a gentleman will open the door, ect. My grandfather is not in the lifestyle, but he will tell you that treatment was deserved by women of the 50's who made their men their lives, and were treated as princesses in return. When they started wearing pants, insisting on working and expecting men to do *woman's work*, they traded the treatment for what they wanted, and they can't have it both ways.

You mention that any man that makes a woman woman walk two steps behind and carry packages looks small in your eyes. Are you aware there are other cultures throughout the world that is expected and the woman would feel insulted if you dared to say she was being misused or that he was wrong?

On a different note, for as long as I recall that was a rule for my children. I would take them shopping, but they had to carry their own bags. They were smaller and younger than me. Does that mean I am a woman who abuses her children for making them be responisible for their own purchases?

Also, Master hates shopping. His mother moved to town for a few years (she left the year I got here), and he would go with her, and being the dutiful son, he would carry the packages for his more elderly mother. One day, he told her he would go, but that SHE had to carry her own packages. She wasn't nearly as willing to *window shop* and waste time when that occured. Master made that the rule with me, and what I hear you saying is it wrong for the dominant to *allow* their property to shop with the condition they are responisible for carrying things? He goes with me, and I am not limited to what I can get as long as it's within the budget. When people within the lifestyle are so judgemental in something as simple as this, is it surprising people are in arms about how bondage and floggings are abuse?

Finally, you say respect is to be earned, and it isn't decided by a capital letter. Do you not think you are contridicting yourself when you type a post doing Y/you, W/we, O/our? Basically you are throwing out blanket respect for anyone you might offend for not capitalizing every pronoun.

Sandy



pinkdiamond2 -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 7:24:03 PM)

First off i did not at any given point did i say that he didnt respect me to the point of saying my name.....i said it..because what i stated i am not afraid to back. Secondly i did not say anything about walking two steps behind as i will do that for my Master also and have. Once again everything is taken out of context and run with....what i refer to is the talk that W/we had in the room.....and Erusvi....if you recall....the room did not back you and that is T/their choice. i care not W/who back this statement what i am saying is A/all are commenting about something that they weren't even there for.....and of course there are two sides to every story as W/we all know.

Now, once again i did not even jump Erusvi with this so called language that rolled off my virtual tongue. Y/you all are jumping me as if i was being sarcastic and yet that coupled with the utter disrespect i received from him in the room that Y/you all didn't witness Y/you feel the right to judge. Go ahead.....i happen to find that taking care of my Master is something i thrive on and live for.....but not O/one of Y/you have taken the time to even begin to understand except to tell me i disrespected him when first he did it to me. i do not wear his collar therefore as i stated before have every right to state my opinion as long as it is respectful, which i will state once again.....i did!!

Even my post where i said with whom he was talking about people have to find a way to twist it saying he didn't say my name.....which if it was read i stated was the first and only time he showed me any respect. i piggybacked nothing nor did you ask me anything about ritual and symbology and why they are beneficial. you threw at me and i quote "well i can see why" when i said i wore not collar at this time. Please once again....you didn't like my question, this is fine.... i do not condemn those that do this i asked so that i could understand and you chose to take the path of attack. If O/one cannot ask questions to learn then there is no point to this so called online world is there??

Anyhow, again i say, if Y/you weren't there it is hardly fair to post anything about the conversation on either side.....i know what was said and how it was said along with many O/others that i do respect. They explained several circumstances to me as clear as could be that W/we all discussed and how W/we felt about them. (but of course this is not mentioned, and Erusvi found it necessary to leave as this was going on)

As for my online parley......i do not play online......what you do not know (as you put forth to me) you have no right to comment on. i have met this Man and He deserves respect as does Shadow and the O/others in the room whom though i treated you very respectfully and were in agreement on this.

As for practicing what i say.......your little banter here does not change a thing....you are still looking to down me and for self gratification. i hope you find it and move along to something else as this is rather sad banter for a man that claims to live life and tosses out that i do not. i will tell you right now, your total disrespect for a Dom in my life is not right. i did not down your sub/slave for what she does and you have no right NONE to be disrespectful to a Man that is caring, loving and (smiles) very sadistic. What you do not know about, please keep quiet about. i ask that with all do respect. i am not attacking anything here but your lack of the whole conversation and the way you twist it. While once again you personally attack me and the Dom in my life. Do it to his face....if you have something to say to him that is the way it should be done

If O/others find it ok to stretch the truth and to twist it i cannot change this....If O/others find it ok to disrespect A/anotherd Dom/Master or sub/slave i cannot stop this either, but it goes to show the lack of respect that is in this world. You wish to say anything more to me Erusvi why don't you come to me and say it?

Please be well A/all !!

pinkdiamond2



MizSuz -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 7:24:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Voltare

At first, it was actually annoying sitting there in the car waiting for her to move around to my side to open the door.



It seems I'm destined to quote Stephan tonight.

I really had to laugh when I read this line. Boy can I relate. I also smoke and found that I also very much disliked waiting for someone to either bring me a cigarette and/or light it.

The rules of engagement are thus: If you want to open it, bring it, light it or carry it - you better get there before I do. Otherwise, I'm inconveniencing myself for the sake of your pleasure...and that just won't survive.

If it's important to you you'll get there...and if you can't always get there then when you do it will be heartfelt and special...for both of us.

No waiting! ;)



MizSuz -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 7:28:10 PM)

Why do I find myself wanting to open a vein after reading very much of this???



Erusvi -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 7:47:51 PM)

I can't imagine why, Suz ;)

I'm with you, to a degree, on the 'no waiting' policy. Initially, she would open the car door for me both coming and going. After a time or two sitting there waiting for her to get out of the car and around to my side... well, I stopped that practice on account of the impracticality. Yet, there are some things worth waiting for.

pinkdiamond:

I do not feel the need to carry on this dialogue. Have a nice day.



EStrict -> RE: Rituals (1/16/2004 7:48:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkdiamond2

As for practicing what i say.......your little banter here does not change a thing....you are still looking to down me and for self gratification.


reply:
Pink, please be specific. Exactly where does Erus (since your post was in reply to his) or anyone else do this? I think you are reading too much between the lines personally,,,

Sandy



Facets -> RE: Rituals (1/17/2004 5:52:38 PM)

This girl found herself fascinated and delighted with the topic of conversation, namely, what part do rituals play in the relationship.

A girl wishes to learn, and enjoys hearing the thoughts of others - and so was troubled that this topic has been nearly "hijacked" several times by pinkdiamond.

If a girl might remind pinkdiamond, these forums are not the place for any personal issues one might have with another on this site; perhaps such would be better dealt with one-on-one, through the e-mail system here?

In reply to the original question of the post, this girl has only begun her training and so has few rituals that Master has set her - one being to enter in her journal for the previous day before any other task, another being to call Him either "Master" or "Sir" in every thing she speaks to Him, i.e. "No, Sir, the girl has......" or "A girl would ask XXXX, Master?"

To this girl, it seems the rituals are both a sharing, and a reminder of what is a very special, unique relationship. The very foundational principles of such a relationship, to whatever degree, are under constant attack in a thousand small ways everyday, e.g. "stand on your own feet," "you don't need anyone else," or "don't let your rights as a woman be taken from you." This girl sees rituals as one way in which T/two reaffirm between them that they refuse to accept such thinking, a way of confirming and affirming T/their difference from the mold society would impose.

facets



strictandcruel -> RE: Rituals (1/17/2004 7:37:16 PM)

*Smile*

Well said facets

I also place such rituals in my M/s relationships and for the same reasons as your master. I thrived withing the relationship and so did my slave, it was a erotic reminder in everyday life for us both. It was also a challenge for her to obey the rituals and yet appear vanilla when being open about the true nature of the relationship was not socially acceptable.

In my next relationship it will be the same or the relationship won't happen.

The best to both of you

strictandcruel



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