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Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 10:28:16 AM   
patwi


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     So the topic says it all. I'm new..totally new. I have no idea what I'm doing here. I've never had a BDSm experience in my life, other than a bit of MMO RP. I'm completely embarrased and ashamed because I'm starting to realize I have subbish tendancies.  I always thought of myself as a strong person, independant and the like.

    And yes, I've heard the "Oh...submission is strength!" Argument before but I just don't buy it. It seems like doublethink to me, propaganda to get me to just stop whining and bend over.  War is Peace, Slavery is Freedom, Submission is Strength, etc.  "OH sure...you're being really strong right now, I mean it. Now shut the fuck up and get on your knees." I just can't believe that by being submissive I am being anything other than weak willed.  I've been trying to convince myself to be more dominant in my fantasies, but it's just not working. yet.

    So...it took a lot for me to even post here. Please no flaming me.
   
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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 10:30:10 AM   
bandit25


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Nothing to be embarassed about.  I'm not going to flame.  Just to say that I am strong, independent and all that and I'm submissive.  For me, there's no conflict.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 10:59:33 AM   
patwi


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     How do you though, convince yourself that you're strong, when in reality you're submissive? That's what I'm having a hard time with. I thought all along I was this strong tough girl, hell, people even assume I'm a dom when the subject comes up. But that's all just a sort of lie, and I'm too embarrased to tell tehm otherwise.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:04:33 AM   
kyraofMists


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How would you describe a strong person?

To me a strong person is someone who has the strength to be who they are; someone who seeks our their own peace and happiness even if it goes against the grain of mainstream society.

I see many very strong and capable people who are also submissive/slave.

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:24:00 AM   
MstrssPassion


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From: West Palm Beach, FL
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how you figure it out is first knowing that how you interact with the whole world does not define you as a person when you interact with others in a more personal &/or private~intimate manner.

CEO's of major corporations can be & are submissive. Janitors can be & are dominant.... career doesn't define ones role of dominance or submission.

Kinky desires don't necessarily define ones roles nor does it make them a dominant of submissive.

In the end.... look to yourself, don't let someone else dictate to you as to how you should feel... only you can truly determine that.



_____________________________

MstrssPassion


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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:35:36 AM   
bandit25


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I guess I don't need to convince myself.  I just am.  Sounds like you've got that whole doormat syndrome.  I don't understand what's weak about being submissive.  You still have to choose to follow.  It's not mindless following.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:46:09 AM   
tenderfootmaster


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The way I see it, whoever you decide to serve (that is if you chose to) we decide on how far this submission goes. Just because you have submissive tendencies doesn’t mean you’re a sub, you could be a switch. Just relax and try to have fun with it. You may enjoy it! Good luck!


_____________________________

"Never do anything today that you can put off till tomorrow... Most things that you do not have to do today are not worth doing at all." -E. W. Scripps

www.myspace.com/bdsmguy85

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:48:16 AM   
Lordandmaster


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Yes, exactly.  It takes courage to live an authentic life.  It's much easier just to be whatever you think you're expected to be.  The problem here is that there are different senses of the word "strong," and the OP is conflating them.  Strength isn't the same thing as power.  Yes, of course, in one sense, if you're submissive, you're not being powerful because you're submitting to someone else who is taking power away from you.  But it takes a lot of emotional strength to be able to put yourself in someone else's hands and bear the consequences.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

How would you describe a strong person?

To me a strong person is someone who has the strength to be who they are; someone who seeks our their own peace and happiness even if it goes against the grain of mainstream society.

I see many very strong and capable people who are also submissive/slave.

(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:51:24 AM   
MistressNoName


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You know, people who have submissive tendencies are in a very difficult position in this society because everyone is getting the message that being dominant, having a dominant personality, whatever, means that you are strong and strong = good...strong=worthy. And those who are submissive, in our society, are for some odd reason, looked down upon and are not getting the message that submissive =strong=good=worthy. It's difficult for women because we have had to fight so hard for our rights and to be treated as equals within society...and for many, for a woman to look another woman in the eye and say, "I really do think I am submissive, after all," is to take the risk of being laughed at, ridiculed and shamed. To say the same thing to a man is taking the risk of being fucked-over royally by him..."Yeh, submissive betch...come here and let me abuse you!" And submissive men have their own bugaboos to deal with which I won't go into. It's very difficult to be submissive, to actually live who you are and come to a kind of peace within yourself about it. And all I can tell you is that the process of finding that peace within you is well worth it. I would encourage you to explore your submissiveness, in as safe a way as you can figure out and give yourself the time you need to explore all the feelings involved, positive and negative. I would say read a lot and talk to people and try to find a submissive support group in your area.

Best to you,

MNN

(in reply to bandit25)
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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 2:23:29 PM   
patwi


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     This is all very frustrating for me, so please, bear with me. I'm going to have to either come to terms with the realization that I'm not who I thought I was, or else convince myself to forget this submissive stuff and go dom. For me a strong woman doesn't take crap from anyone, doesn't let another person control or direct them, doesn't lay down and let someone do whatever they want. And I always considered myself to be that sort of a person and yet...there are some things which grab my interest about the whole submissive thing.

    The thing that I'm having issue with is what seems to be the degradation of a submissive person. (again, please bear with me, i'm completely new to this. I mean no offence.) I don't -want- to be less than equal. I'm not less of a person than my husband. I'm more than just a few holes for sex. I'm not replacable. *grins* I don't automatically have to kneel to anyone who claims to be a dom.  So really...I have no idea what I am.  Obviously this is something I want to work through, because it's causing me major stress.

    By the way...what are the rules as far as slashing up words and terms? I see O/other, Y/your and various other things, and I'm afraid I'm going to be typing things out wrong and irritating people by not captializing or slashing properly.

(in reply to MistressNoName)
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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 2:29:42 PM   
diz


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I am a strong determine single Mum of 3 kids, I hold down a job and my own business. I do not live near any family and NEVER have time without my kids.... what I am externally to survive does not conflict with who I am inside.. some of my friends know of my submissive tendancies and lol cos they would assume I would be naturally Dominant... its not about that, you have to be strong and confident to love yourself, to respect yourself and to deal with curve balls life throws at you... life, submissive or not is not about being weak willed. Maybe you are confusing weak willed as you call it with the new feelings you are experiencing... time will help and explore, read learn and then you will feel differently.

i wish you all the best

diz

(in reply to patwi)
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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 2:59:03 PM   
patwi


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     I have way to many questions, and I apologize in advance. :)

    Socials..."The Scene"....how do you get into that? I can't help but feel I'd get laughed out of any club when showing up in jeans and a tshirt rather than leather vinyl and rubber. What IS the scene anyhow? Are socials...sex gatherings? What exactly goes on there? I'm too curious a person.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 4:09:47 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Maybe not curious enough, if you've never been to a d/s club.  Find out what there is in your area, and show up in whatever outfit you feel comfortable in.  If people laugh at you, tell them to fuck off.

quote:

ORIGINAL: patwi

    I have way to many questions, and I apologize in advance. :)

   Socials..."The Scene"....how do you get into that? I can't help but feel I'd get laughed out of any club when showing up in jeans and a tshirt rather than leather vinyl and rubber. What IS the scene anyhow? Are socials...sex gatherings? What exactly goes on there? I'm too curious a person.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 4:13:39 PM   
patwi


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   Actually I looked online, and couldn't find any clubs or thing nearby.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 4:17:36 PM   
Lordandmaster


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That's certainly possible.  I don't know where in PA you are, but there are regular events in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh.  Also Baltimore, which isn't so far if you're in the York area.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 4:24:30 PM   
patwi


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   I hadn't even thought of that. *facepalms* of course, I'd never be able to tell my husband I was heading to Philly to go to some BDSM club.

    So about the slashing and capitalization of words...what are the guidelines there?

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 5:41:36 PM   
MisstressNboytoy


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I've always assumed the slashing thing was to show you were addressing both dominants and submissives. Does your husband not have any idea about your feelings toward BDSM?

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 5:43:08 PM   
patwi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MisstressNboytoy

Does your husband not have any idea about your feelings toward BDSM?


No. I really have no idea how to address it. I bought a book of erotica and left it laying around but, he's not exactly one to pick up on subtle hints.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 6:21:26 PM   
MisstressNboytoy


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At the risk of angering the male population here...what is the percentage of men who pick up on subtle hints? Maybe it would help you become more at ease about your feelings to at least discuss them with him, even if the two of you don't decide to act on your bdsm interests. Sounds like you need a little reassurance that submissive tendencies aren't correlated with being weak or needy. I hope that the people here can convince you of that.

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RE: Embarrased. - 6/24/2007 11:15:59 PM   
MistressNoName


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I'm gonna try to answer some of your questions, patwi...but first I'm gonna say, "chill," just a bit. You're questions are normal, reasonable and not too many by any standard. You wanna learn, so give yourself a bit of a break so you can learn, ok?

The slashing of the pronouns was started by I don't know who...but the general consensus seems to be that it started on the internet as a way of distinguishing Doms from subs...and in a public forum like this, some people like to do the slashing thing as a way of extending general respect to all who might be participating here. There are some people who care a great deal about the slashing and caps, no-caps...there are others who could care less. You do what suits you best and leave the rest...that's generally how it works around here.

What's "the scene?" Well, again, generally speaking, this refers to the larger community of kinky folk and the stuff that we do and where we do it. And sometimes we refer to the goings-on in a particular region by saying stuff like, "oh, check out the Philly scene!" or, "Yeah, I'm into the NY scene..."

Now, as for social gatherings....there are so many kinds. Sometimes socials are play parties where kinky ppl get together and flog one another...or spank, or cane (you can tell where my tendencies lie...) sometimes sex happens, but most times not. Depends on whether it's happening at a public club or someone's private affair, usually. Always check this out before attending so you can determine whether you will feel comfortable going. There are also munches, which are usually lunch or dinner gatherings of kinky ppl...meeting at some diner somewhere and sometimes talking about kinky stuff, sometimes not. Then there are club/organization meetings. Here in NY there must be every kind of kinky/fetish/leather club ever conceived of in the world. And there are also bdsm/leather events of every kind all over the country and the world...As to showing up in jeans and t-shirt to a club...I've never seen anyone get laughed out of any club for being so attired...NEVER! There are some people for whom that's their usual gear!

Let me share a little of my beginnings. I started out by just reading and trying to find out as much as I could about this bdsm stuff. Next, I started finding out about local clubs and groups. Then I started looking for play partners...now I'm getting involved in the NY leather group scene...The trick is to take it all at your pace...and explore what interests you...And eventually, but asap, I believe you should talk to your husband about it.

Now one more thing I wanted to address...You are equating submitting to someone as being something a strong person does not do, when in fact, simply because submission is so difficult, it actually does take a lot of strength to give over one's power and control to another individual. But giving over one's power and control is not the same as taking crap from someone. I would never recommend that. No, in this life, the power exchange must be consensual or not at all. It's agreed upon and it's negotiated and the limits are understood. If not, at least for me, we don't play. But you may discover in your explorations that you are not submissive. Perhaps you simply desire to bottom every now and then...that's ok too. You can submit or bottom in a particular scene, but not fully submit in the relationship...ppl do this all the time. One person, Diane Vera, wrote an article suggesting there are 9 levels of submission. So don't go thinking there is only one way to do it.

Well, that's all I'm gonna write for the moment. Let you digest it. I hope this is helpful and that I haven't confused you further...but if I have, just ask more questions!!

MNN

< Message edited by MistressNoName -- 6/24/2007 11:19:51 PM >

(in reply to MisstressNboytoy)
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