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RE: Tour de France fever! - 7/12/2007 7:56:33 PM   
happypervert


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Status: offline 		Desperate chase by Vinokourov, and he still lost a minute. I'm sure he'll have fun riding the next week with that big road rash on his ass.

The sceneery was so beautiful with the hills, trees and fields, but guys were splattered all over the road today. Bad luck for Vino being one of them with only about 25km to go -- it will be tough to make up that time on the other contenders, and the effort he put out chasing back can ake a toll too. But any of the other riders can have a bad day, and he can make it up on someone like Sastre in the ITT.

It just adds a bit more drama to see how it unfolds over the next two weeks.


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Into the Alps! - 7/13/2007 8:41:57 PM   
happypervert


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Status: offline 		It's funny to think that they rode another 120 miles today and it was basically a rest day; nobody wanted to push too hard because tomorrow they hit the mountains. Saturday's stage will just be an appetizer for the twuly tough days to come -- it only has one category 1 climb while Sunday has 3 of them (with cat 4 being the "easiest") . . . and the race will have some other climbs rated HC for "above categories".

This is where the real suffering begins, and it tests the ability of the top guys to recover from a punishing effort one day to do it again the next, and the day after that . . . My legs get sore just thinking about it.

If you're interested in getting more details like maps, profiles, and just about anything you want to know, you'll find it at this site:

Cyclingnews, link to stage 7 preview




< Message edited by happypervert -- 7/13/2007 8:43:09 PM >

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RE: Into the Alps! - 7/15/2007 7:46:44 PM   
happypervert


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Status: offline 		Today was an interesting study in patience, tactics, and stupidity.

When they got to that last climb it was interesting to see how a few guys (Moreau, Mayo, Evans et al) jumped off the main group and then behaved like idiots attacking each other. I think they wasted more energy chasing each other and trying to break away than they would have if they just traded pulls. I think the worst was that lazy wheel sucker Cadel Evans -- too bad he didn't hit the guard rail instead of Michael Rogers. Anyway, they got a lead of over a minute over the group with Vino, Menchov and Sastre, but ended up with only 20 seconds at the end. Dopes!

The Vino bunch played it smart -- they put helpers on the front to set a nice steady pace until they got to the last few kms and then stepped it up all out, and the teams cooperated with Rabobank sharing some of the work. But I think it took a lot of nerve for them to watch guys like Valverde and Mayo taking off up the road and decide it would be smarter to let them go and bet they will pay for that effort later.

And now everyone  must be wondering how Rasmussen will recover from his effort. He's a great climber and has a big lead now, but there is a lot of racing left. A couple of years ago it looked like he could finish on the podium, and then he self-destructed in the last time trial and lost something like 5 minutes.

As exciting as the race was today, I think my favorite part was Arroyo's crash -- all we could see was his bike bouncing along the guardrail and the tops of the saplings shaking on the other side as he bounced off of them. But he was unhurt, scrambled back up the hill to grab his bike, and he ended up finishing 17th.


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RE: Into the Alps! - 7/16/2007 1:28:48 PM   
KatyLied


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Status: offline 		boohoo, I just read that Robbie McEwen is out of the Tour, too late a finisher.

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The Race of Truth - 7/21/2007 11:08:58 AM   
happypervert


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Status: offline 		Vinokourov crushed the field in the first time trial -- only 3 others within 2 minutes and they all finished at least 1 minute behind him. Pretty impressive for a guy who got almost 60 stitches after his crash a week ago.

And some guys who looked like contenders just got smoked -- Valverde had been sitting in 2nd place, but now is in 11th after losing 6 minutes; Iban Mayo had been in 3rd but lost 6 minutes too. Both shine bright in the mountains, but get exposed in the race against the clock.

An impressive ride by Contador -- I thought he might also be "just" a climber, but is now sitting in 3rd place after finishing 7th today.

And tomorrow they go into the Pyrennees for 3 brutal days and a rest day -- it will be fun to see if (or who) runs out of gas and cracks. And if the mountains don't do it, there will still be one more long time trial to settle things.


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The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/22/2007 8:35:29 AM   
happypervert


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Status: offline 		Cadel Evans proved he is an idiot today just in case anyone doubted it. For some reason he thinks he can match the accelerations of brilliant climbers like Contador and Rasmussen even though a few days in the Alps he cracked after chasing down Contador a few times.

So today he tried his same dumb tactic and he paid for it again. The dope chased down every early attack on the last climb, and eventually he cracked big time. Meanwhile, Sastre and Leipheimer rode smart and kept up a hard steady pace, and I really enjoyed watching them roll by Evans while he suffered. Eventually he ended up sucking Kloden's wheel once he caught up, but ended up losing almost 2 minutes to the Chicken man and Contador and a minute to Sastre and Levi..

I sure hope the lesson hasn't sunk through his thick skull yet, because it'll be great fun to watch it happen again and he can ride himself off the podium.


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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/22/2007 8:41:22 AM   
KatyLied


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quote:

Eventually he ended up sucking Kloden's wheel once he caught up


hehe, I knew you'd enjoy that part. 

They interviewed Levi after the race and he said that he just can not do those accelerations and he knows not to ride like that and he was glad that Sastre kept up a steady pace that he could comfortably match.


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Tour de France - 7/26/2007 10:53:17 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		Just checked in to see how the Tour de France thread is doing after, surprise surprise, Alexandre Vinokourov, Cristian Moreni (who was in an ANTI-DOPING demonstration), and Michael Rasmussen have all been disqualified.

And, surprise surprise, no one has said a thing about it.

Guys, I get it, you love cycling--but how can you seriously discuss a sport where it seems that the winner is just the cheater they happened not to catch?

Edited to add: People, I really do want to know why you're still interested in the Tour de France.  I'm not just slinging mud.

< Message edited by Lordandmaster -- 7/26/2007 11:25:13 PM >

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/26/2007 10:55:47 PM   
Emperor1956


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Status: offline 		Yah, LaM is RIGHT.   How can you guys love a sport so bereft of integrity, so lacking in basic substance, so fraught with cheating at every level?

Me?  I just watch a good NBA gam....oh, never fucking mind!

E.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/26/2007 11:00:27 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		Laughing...yeah yeah yeah.  But at least Donaghy never had the gall to attend an anti-gambling rally before getting busted for gambling.  Only a real virtuoso can accomplish that kind of hypocrisy.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/26/2007 11:03:21 PM   
Emperor1956


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Status: offline 		The fascinating thing about Donaghy is that so many of what are now being reviewed as questionable calls were considered sophisticated refereeing.  Now that he's known to have had a wrong motivation, a lot of subtle calls are suspect.  It is much more interesting than some guy jacking up his platelets with his buddy's blood (or his own).

Didn't John McPhee say "basketball is a game of subtle felonies"?

E

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"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/26/2007 11:14:29 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		Unfortunately, there's a lot to the Donaghy case that we haven't been told (Stern admitted as much), and the parts we don't know about sound sickening.  I've heard interviews with refs who did games with Donaghy, and they never suspected anything was amiss.  There have been comments about his temper, his expensive house--but I haven't heard a thing about his actual calls.  For all we know, he didn't even influence any games, and THAT'S what's creepy about this whole thing.  You can't tell the difference between a referee who's influencing a game and one who isn't!

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 5:47:05 AM   
KatyLied


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Status: offline 		Um, you guys do know that there is a culture of doping in professional sports, right?  Cycling is as dirty as any other sport, but they catch more cheaters because they subject riders to a ton of testing.  Knowing that some of the peloton cheats takes nothing away from the beauty of cycling (I also love pro football, convice me those guys aren't on the juice).  The one thing that I hated to see this Tour is that Andreas Kloden has been robbed of a likely podium spot, the Tour isn't nearly as much fun since he's gone.  Anyway, things are looking good for Disco Team, so I'm happy.  

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 5:48:31 AM   
KatyLied


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Status: offline 		btw, Ras wasn't disqualified, he was fired by his team.  I'm not saying it didn't have to be done, just explaining what happened.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 6:37:26 AM   
sublimelysensual


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

Um, you guys do know that there is a culture of doping in professional sports, right?  Cycling is as dirty as any other sport, but they catch more cheaters because they subject riders to a ton of testing.  Knowing that some of the peloton cheats takes nothing away from the beauty of cycling (I also love pro football, convice me those guys aren't on the juice).  The one thing that I hated to see this Tour is that Andreas Kloden has been robbed of a likely podium spot, the Tour isn't nearly as much fun since he's gone.  Anyway, things are looking good for Disco Team, so I'm happy.  


In addition to what Katy said, you have to remember the Tour is the most publicized cycling event, you could liken it to the superbowl..so of course there's media frenzy when someone is caught/accused of doping. What's unfortunate is when everyone that does well gets painted with the same brush. That's like saying everyone in baseball dopes because of people like Bonds and Conseco. I don't watch the Tour to find out who's doping, I watch to admire the extraordinary athleticism of these men, the team strategy that plays out over the course of it, and okay, yeah, maybe occasionally to admire sweet butts in lycra shorts *laughs*. Anyway..don't throw out the whole bushel of apples because one is spoiled... just my two cents..
 
-a

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RE: Tour de France - 7/27/2007 7:10:56 AM   
stef


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Just checked in to see how the Tour de France thread is doing after, surprise surprise, Alexandre Vinokourov, Cristian Moreni (who was in an ANTI-DOPING demonstration), and Michael Rasmussen have all been disqualified.

Rasmussen wasn't DQed, he was fired by his team for lying about his whereabouts in the month preceeding the tour.  If you're going to be a troll, at least be an accurate one.

quote:

Guys, I get it, you love cycling--but how can you seriously discuss a sport where it seems that the winner is just the cheater they happened not to catch?

If you have to ask...

~stef

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 8:58:34 AM   
Emperor1956


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Status: offline 		Katy, sublimely and stef (Now that sounds like a kinky law firm!):

I've heard it said that all the doping/rule bending in pro cycling makes it "less of a competition, and more of an exhibition."   I don't know that it really matters, but what do you think, would you watch the "sport" if it was acknowledged that the riders were juiced, and using the best (even if illegal under current rules) technology?

BTW, the same question goes to NASCAR fans.  NASCAR, by the way, has a culture of rule bending, shaving and cheating that I submit outranks any other "sport"*  So what?  Should we just drop all these weight/output/restrictor plate rules and let the boys run flat out?

E.

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_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 9:32:06 AM   
KatyLied


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Status: offline 		Yes, I would watch, I believe that most of them are juiced anway, especially the top GC contenders.  I think that some teams are better equipped at masking.  I am not naive about doping in professional sports.  Cycling does take an unusually hard line against it and for that they appear to be dirty.  I wish them well with it.  But because of the doping scandals they are losing some of their marquee athletes.  For me, there is more to the Tour than the race.  I enjoy seeing those parts of Europe, the tunnels, castles, bridges, countryside.  I enjoy reading about the cyclists, watching the fans, I think it's pretty cool and it's only been in the past few years that have had any interest at all.

I don't get NASCAR, I find it boring, just like some other people would find watching a TDF time trial boring, but you never know who's going to crash or turn in the time trial of a lifetime.  And with that you also don't know who will stand on the podium and in a few days time be wreckage as a result of doping. 


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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 10:52:02 AM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		I hear that a lot, and I believe it.  I'm sure that if baseball and football (and basketball and golf) had the same stringent testing regimen as cycling, they'd find more cheaters in those sports too.

But I don't believe that every baseball player is cheating, whereas I find it hard to believe at this point that there are ANY world-class cyclists who aren't using some kind of performance enhancing drugs or techniques.  Do you?  If so many of the top cyclists in the world are doing it, anyone who doesn't do it too can't expect to compete.

I think it's a question of a tipping point.  Yes, baseball has had more than its share of cheaters, and they haven't come close to resolving the problem.  But I don't believe they've yet reached the tipping point where you look at a baseball player and simply ASSUME that he must be a cheater.

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

Cycling is as dirty as any other sport, but they catch more cheaters because they subject riders to a ton of testing.

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RE: The Wheel Sucker Gets Worked Over - 7/27/2007 1:23:06 PM   
sublimelysensual


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Joined: 7/25/2005
Status: offline 		Call me naive (and yes, I'll admit to being so about some things)..but no, I don't believe that all the top cyclists dope. If I did, I wouldn't continue to follow the sport. I have this thing about believing in the best in people until proven wrong. And no, I don't think all baseball players dope..but..lol..as I said, I don't believe all cyclists do either, so....
 
Emperor.. No, I wouldn't watch, I would lose a great deal of respect for the sport and athletes therein. I don't watch Nascar either, has never done anything for me, so can't really comment on that.
 
-a

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