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RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 5:39:24 PM

Grlwithboy

Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
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Yes, everything people said about him is accurate. None of this is "your fault" - he sounds like he's being an assumptive boor.

However I have to agree that "my place" is not a location I'd pick for a second date - it doesn't necessarily read as "guarantee of sex" for all people, but it may for some. I really recommend hanging around public spaces till you're sure you'd like to be the meat at some future point, maybe, or at least you're comfortable with that person. If there's anything of the uneasies I don't really like that person knowing where my turf is let alone hanging out on it.

(in reply to dovie)

Post #: 21

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 6:04:13 PM

mrzip035

Posts: 3
Joined: 12/17/2006
Status: offline

Keep it simple....dovie has it exactly right....run. run away....don't look back...

(in reply to dovie)

Post #: 22

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 6:16:38 PM

TemptingNviceSub

Posts: 3054
Joined: 10/1/2005
Status: offline

There was another thread not too long ago...pertaining to this same issue, she had invited a Dominant over, and he took it to mean "playtime"..she in essence had to literally kick his booty out!..So, obviously when you invite a strange male home he may take it as an invitation that possibly there will be more physiciality.Do not forget, as one wise man told me..While we women may halt a physical action on a mans part..we may be saying simply ..slow down..but he is thinking...rejection...So even though you thought you communicated effectively/....to him, maybe your actions did not match up with your communicative efforts....Tempting

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Post #: 23

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 6:30:26 PM

TankII7871

Posts: 174
Joined: 4/22/2005
Status: offline

Check List for 2nd date

lipstick: Check
hair:       Check
Dress:    Check
Dinner:   Check
wine:      Check
357mag : CHECK!!!!!!!!!

Just my idea of what you should have on the 2nd date. Why yes both of my girls do have their own hand guns.

Eric (hiding since its that time of the month for both of them)

(in reply to TemptingNviceSub)

Post #: 24

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 6:32:07 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

So two questions ...
Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?

neither... It was a demonstration of his character.... a character you better off without.

quote:

Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

No....

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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 25

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 6:49:36 PM

DiurnalVampire

Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

So two questions ...
Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?
Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

I think I agree with everyone else. It is neither an insult nor a compliment. Its more a reflection of him as a man. A man with so little self-control as not to be able to behave as a gentleman. As has been said in may other places, if he canot even master his own urges, how can he expect to control someone else?
If you were looking for a relationship, D/s or otherwise, youd expect things to go slowly until you get a feel for someone. Theres no reason not to expect the same in a D/s relationship. Anyone who cant respect the desire to do so is just someone you dont need around. At least he saved you the trouble of wasting time and getting overly attached before you found out.

DV

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VampiresLair

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 26

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 7:13:32 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

So two questions ...
Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?
Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

Do you really think these are the only two options?

How about that he's a jerk who basically believes he should have the right to do whatever he wants whenever he wants?

Seems to me that the language you write that he uses was a good indication of that from the start.

Have all the fantasies you want in your head, feel free to share them, but until you are in a real relationship with someone, try treating them like the equal human being they are. A dominant who knows that difference is worth his or her weight in platinum in my strong opinion.

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(in reply to softness)

Post #: 27

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 7:26:09 PM

domiguy

Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

recently I have been chatting away to a Dom I found through CM, he contacted me several months ago while I was not available and I got back in touch when I decided to starting looking again.

We have chatted a lot about our like and dislikes, about our relationship history and our relationship expectations. I had noticed things, which though would make many girls very happy indeed in a Dominant, caused me some doubts but nothing that would stop me from meeting him. Things like the way he would refer to the female body as meat, that in some conversations I was only referred to in the third person, occassionally even as "it". Now these things have all been part of my service before, I do not shy from them, but there was a degree of uneasiness caused by them coming from someone I hardly knew.

When we brought up a meeting ... aside from all the usual safety measures .. I put forward that after the initial "coffee date" I would like to meet at my house, that I could cook dinner and we could spend the evening peacefully together. This is exactly what I would suggest for a second vanilla date - for one reason and another I feel much more comfortable on home ground. I also like to see how a potential partner is with me when play is out of the question - can we maintain an conversation, can we banter and chat and feel comfortable just being with eachother.

His reaction to this was that I was giving him an open invitation for sex and play. He began to lay out my rules for the evening, and my protocols, and exactly how and what he was going to expect of my body. I calmly, and in the lightest way possible, asserted that we would not be engaging in anything along those lines for quite some time. I was met with derision, he thought I was mocking him, that it ws a joke to expect him to come to my house but not "use the meat". That he would be unable to resist it.

My response was that if a man could not show the self restraint required to keep his pants on for a second date then how was i expected to trust him with the self restraint to play with me responsibly.

So two questions ...
Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?
Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

Since I chimed in on the other thread where the girl invited the guy over....I might as well chime in on this one.

Your test is stupid. Thank God you were speaking to a moron who was unable to pass the test.
One thing about the guy, at least he was consistent....He was an ass from start to finish.

What does it mean when a woman invites a guy over? Possibly nothing, possibly everything. I know back in my good ol' nilla days I can recall on more than several occasions being invited back to some woman's home to "only" order a pizza and watch a movie...Very harmless stuff, right?...However, on too many occasions the pizza guy was left standing on the doorstep step waiting while I implored my "new friend" to suck harder and faster or to help me find my pants because my wallet was in the back pocket.

Why even talk about a second date or let alone that it is going to take place at your home? Just to weed out the imbeciles who haven't figured out that the correct response is, "That is very kind of you...I bet you are a great cook and it would be wonderful to have a home cooked meal and to be able to have the chance to once again share your company."

Since you spoke to the man "a lot" didn't your spidey senses at any point prior to the test start to tingle? In the future forget the test. Just meet the dude at a coffee shop report back to me with a report on his mannerisms and a full transcript of the conversation and I will tell you how to proceed.

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< Message edited by domiguy -- 7/21/2007 7:56:54 PM >

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Post #: 28

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 7:51:16 PM

trustingsub

Posts: 36
Joined: 7/17/2007
From: VA
Status: offline

i think there are a lot of 'Doms' that feel a woman is nothing more than 'meat', but men who are sincerely Dom would not insult You in this way!

saying that he would not be able to resist using Your body is taken differently with different people... go with Your gut here. personally, i like for someone to spend time getting to know me as a person before having the option of calling me 'meat'.

if You feel the need to 'test' him, then i would have to say that there is not enough trust between the two of You to bring him to Your home... he seems to be a jerk!

< Message edited by trustingsub -- 7/21/2007 7:57:20 PM >

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Post #: 29

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 8:12:05 PM

nyrisa

Posts: 1830
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline

I agree with the majority; the guy showed his true colors, and you are lucky that he showed them so quickly.

As far as the home invite on a second date: I would be wary of that. Even if he behaves well on the second date, now he knows where you live, has seen the inside of your house, has had an opportunity to learn a whole lot about you and possibly those dear to you. You are now prime stalking prey, should he be that type.

I would not invite a man to my house until we'd had quite a few meetings; and probably not until I had already had a few intimate sessions with him. It is a lot easier to storm horrified from a hotel room and never see anyone again, than it is to try to eject him safely from your house. Anyone can hide crazy for a few meetings, but over the course of a slow courtship, there is a lot more chance for you to see the real person.

_____________________________

A true lady takes off her dignity with her clothes and does her whorish best. At other times you can be as modest and dignified as your persona requires. Robert Heinlein

The last thing I want to do is hurt you...but it is still on my list.

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 30

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/21/2007 8:30:07 PM

Saffron

Posts: 27
Joined: 2/25/2004
Status: offline

To me the question is - did you feel insulted or complimented? It really doesn't matter what anyone else thinks you should have felt. How did it feel?

Personally the man sounds like an ass. An honest ass, which is a good thing. Had he been a little more suave and charming, he might have made it to your house for that dinner before he decided to act that way. I'm glad you found out ahead of time.

~Saffron

(in reply to nyrisa)

Post #: 31

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 1:05:59 AM

DarkDreams123

Posts: 74
Joined: 1/25/2007
Status: offline

Greetings softness,

Well, I can see that my opinion is definitely going to be in the minority.

As I understand it you began a correspondence with someone online who began referring to you as "meat" and in the third person and you didn't object at all. Now, you haven't met this person in real life even once, but you begin talking to him about meeting for your second date at your house. He takes this to mean that you want to have sex.

Well, perhaps I am a male-chauvinist, but if a woman were to invite me to her house on our second date I would certainly take that as a sign that she wanted to be intimate. Call me crazy...

Second, from the very beginning he was talking to you in a certain way: objectifying you and you didn't say anything to him about it. However, later you start questioning his integrity because of the way that he reacted to your invitation. I'm not so sure that this says so much about his character as yours. He was being consistent. You were the one who was being inconsistent.

Why does his speech raise questions now? Why didn't you say something to him about the way he referred to you from the very beginning? I think if you had mentioned it to him from the start you probably would have found out you were not compatible much earlier.

For all of those here who enjoy "beating up" on this guy (who isn't even "here" to defend himself) let me just say that there are plenty of women who enjoy objectification and plenty of women who are ready to have sex on the second, or even the first date. I have read of several on these boards.

What ever happened to respecting other people's kink (or is that just some lame expression)?

-DarkDreams

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 32

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 2:02:42 AM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

Since I chimed in on the other thread where the girl invited the guy over....I might as well chime in on this one.

Your test is stupid. Thank God you were speaking to a moron who was unable to pass the test.
One thing about the guy, at least he was consistent....He was an ass from start to finish.

Why even talk about a second date or let alone that it is going to take place at your home? Just to weed out the imbeciles who haven't figured out that the correct response is, "That is very kind of you...I bet you are a great cook and it would be wonderful to have a home cooked meal and to be able to have the chance to once again share your company."

Since you spoke to the man "a lot" didn't your spidey senses at any point prior to the test start to tingle? In the future forget the test. Just meet the dude at a coffee shop report back to me with a report on his mannerisms and a full transcript of the conversation and I will tell you how to proceed.

For a limited time only...The Domiguy Collar of Protection can be yours for only 3 easy payments of $19.99...Act fast! Supplies are limited!!!

*Do not wear collar in direct sunlight, do not swallow while wearing collar, collar must be kept at 82 degrees Fahrenheit at all times, do not look directly at collar, Do not wear collar for more than five minutes, Never get collar wet, Do not wear collar if you have acne, never wear collar around children or expectant mothers, collar might inexplicably tighten causing death.

lol .. my spidey sense was tingling .. and i have an overdeveloped moron sense ... the inkling that he was purely after a flesh pay out was outweighed by the great manyother conversations we had where he was being a reasonable gentleman with excellent wit and banter.

Thankyou so much for the offer of protection ... cheque is in the post *s*

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veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to domiguy)

Post #: 33

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 2:21:11 AM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkDreams123

As I understand it you began a correspondence with someone online who began referring to you as "meat" and in the third person and you didn't object at all. Now, you haven't met this person in real life even once, but you begin talking to him about meeting for your second date at your house. He takes this to mean that you want to have sex.

from the very beginning he was talking to you in a certain way: objectifying you and you didn't say anything to him about it. However, later you start questioning his integrity because of the way that he reacted to your invitation. I'm not so sure that this says so much about his character as yours. He was being consistent. You were the one who was being inconsistent.

let me just say that there are plenty of women who enjoy objectification and plenty of women who are ready to have sex on the second, or even the first date. I have read of several on these boards.

-DarkDreams

Just to answer this one ...
He didn't constantly speak with me in those terms, they occassionally crept in, more strongly so when we discussed topics that could become a little heated (am not talking cyber sex here, but particular needs and wants we had) I did mention several times how i thought it wasn't appropriate and that it made me uncomfortable at the stage we were at. He agreed and back tracked. I didn't hold this against him initially but the alarm bells rang when it seemed to be his "default" way of refferring to his submissive sexual partner. Especially when that default setting seems to overide the information given him before and cause him to jump to a rather large assumption.

Now this man was party to information about me that would mean he understood clearly that whatever the location of the first, second, or fifth date, sex and play would not be an option. I like objectification and hot first time sex as much as the next girl but i dont like it as much as having had a reasonable courtship first. Call me old fashioned, but ... well .... I am old fashioned.

_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to DarkDreams123)

Post #: 34

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 9:51:11 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?

Neither. It just shows his character, or lack thereof. While I certainly don't mind sex in the early in the relationship (very early in the relationship), I'm still not interested in a man who simply can't keep it in his pants. Sounds like he wasn't interested in you at all but in getting laid.

quote:

Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

Absolutely not. Becoming part of a d/s relationship is a big deal and you want to find someone who treats you well and who you will work with. I would view this as less of test and more of a "let's see how we work together" thing.

Dit-to. Thanks Aquatic.

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Post #: 35

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 11:33:12 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

It doesn't matter if he meant it as a comment or not. What matters is how it made you feel. Go with your gut. If he won't respect that you need to take things slow and develop a meaningful relationship, how much do you trust him to repsect your limits and "the meat"?

Master Fire

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(in reply to softness)

Post #: 36

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 12:42:00 PM

littleone0472

Posts: 30
Joined: 7/11/2005
Status: offline

sometimes men/women dom or sub hear what they want to hear..

ex 1.

what owner says to dog: you are a good for nothing worthless dog

what dog hears: good dog
========
what you (may have) said: we can come to my place for dinner and conversation, relax and enjoy each others company with no sex or play involved at all

what He/She hears: come to my place for sex or play

it happens.. move on..

esmeralda

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 37

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 12:55:22 PM

MsOpal

Posts: 244
Joined: 8/31/2006
Status: offline

HI,

I just wanted to comment on having somene to your home for the 2nd date. Even vanilla I would not have done this. Too many wierdos and then he knows where you live. I so agree with whomever said - go to a museum, go to the zoo, go on a picnic. There are lots of ways/places to spend several hours engaged in conversations without opening your home to someone that fast. I hope "newer" ladies who might not have the same "moron-sense" that some do have won't read about inviting someone home that quick and think it should be done that way.
YMMV, just mho.
MsOpal

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and I did.

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Post #: 38

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 1:23:52 PM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

As we read again and again and again on these threads .. we each do things our own way and in our own comfort zones ... I know that, because of my particular domestic arrangements, I am just as safe in my own home as I would be in a mutually neutral location. With regard to the safety of letting someone know where I live, that is information I trade for kind - their address, verified by independent means, for my address verified by independent means.

I firmly believe that for every person not worthy of my trust and every person I am not safe with ... there are a 1000 that are worthy and that I am safe with. Essentially its how we look at the people we meet through life look for the best and look for the worst. Where I live .. I am much more likely to get attacked travelling home from a date in a neutral location .. than I am inviting a man to my house under conditions that I control.

_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to MsOpal)

Post #: 39

RE: insult ... or compliment - 7/22/2007 2:03:36 PM

blmtrsne

Posts: 201
Joined: 6/29/2004
Status: offline

I normally am prudent in what I say, but in this case I'll make an exception:

You were in great danger and did well to react like that. I knew a lot of guys hope to get in your pants if you invite them in on a first or second date, but if they insist when you tell them it's just a friendly invitation (which might be followed by other rendez-vous), it's a criminal offence and is called rape. This 'Master' had his foot between the door and was tearing your clothes of yelling he would rape you.

A true Master (or Mistress of course) takes responsability and wants to get your consent before making his move. Only when you accept to a relation and -normally- you get to know each others (that takes some time), he will know the two of you will work out. If you both like rough sex and you to be treated as meat, then you will be a good slave to that Master at that moment, because you found your soulmate.
After all, what good is a slave when you need to control him 24 hours a day? He should get into your personallity and lifestyle, feeling what you need before you think about it.
In this case there was no hope for a future relation, and there shurely was no respect.

blmtrsne

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

recently I have been chatting away to a Dom I found through CM, he contacted me several months ago while I was not available and I got back in touch when I decided to starting looking again.

We have chatted a lot about our like and dislikes, about our relationship history and our relationship expectations. I had noticed things, which though would make many girls very happy indeed in a Dominant, caused me some doubts but nothing that would stop me from meeting him. Things like the way he would refer to the female body as meat, that in some conversations I was only referred to in the third person, occassionally even as "it". Now these things have all been part of my service before, I do not shy from them, but there was a degree of uneasiness caused by them coming from someone I hardly knew.

When we brought up a meeting ... aside from all the usual safety measures .. I put forward that after the initial "coffee date" I would like to meet at my house, that I could cook dinner and we could spend the evening peacefully together. This is exactly what I would suggest for a second vanilla date - for one reason and another I feel much more comfortable on home ground. I also like to see how a potential partner is with me when play is out of the question - can we maintain an conversation, can we banter and chat and feel comfortable just being with eachother.

His reaction to this was that I was giving him an open invitation for sex and play. He began to lay out my rules for the evening, and my protocols, and exactly how and what he was going to expect of my body. I calmly, and in the lightest way possible, asserted that we would not be engaging in anything along those lines for quite some time. I was met with derision, he thought I was mocking him, that it ws a joke to expect him to come to my house but not "use the meat". That he would be unable to resist it.

My response was that if a man could not show the self restraint required to keep his pants on for a second date then how was i expected to trust him with the self restraint to play with me responsibly.

So two questions ...
Now was it a compliment to me that he wouldn't be able to resist me... or an insult to my intelligence?
Was I unfair to effectively "test" his treatment of me when he knew there would be no sex or service?

_____________________________

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(in reply to softness)

Post #: 40

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