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Aswad -> RE: Sex workers in the BDSM and D/s lifestyles (8/7/2007 11:40:35 AM)
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ChainsandFreedom,
You did not come across as callous, just a bit evasive and centered on your own opinions.
I get using forums as a diversion, and your frustration. There are times when I too would like to fully address something, but lack the time. More often than not, really. Instead, I keep a tabbed browser open in the background on periodic refresh, and when I find a moment to reply to something that catches my eye, I do so.
My use of the medium predates the invention of forums, however, so I'm used to a content-centric exchange. If I wanted to sway people's opinions to my side, I would blog instead. I know how to form concise rhetoric, and use it advantageously in cases where swaying opinions is important whereas content is not, such as in my professional life. I just prefer content. And I am aware that my verbose posting drives many to skip my posts, but these people are not my target audience.
By analogy, if I'm debating politics, I'm verbose. If I'm trying to sway someone to vote for my preferred party, or take up my position on an issue, I am concise, often terse. I full well understand that dealing with the full complexity of something will cause most to block it out. This is the shortcoming of my preferred political party, in fact: they choose to deal with reality, and fail to dumb it down when addressing the public.
I never take forums as a role model, and appreciate their casual nature most of the time. Spelling, however, is a different matter, as I am aware that the Internet is international, and that certain disorders impair spelling and/or grammar, without impairing the ability to think in an intelligent and coherent manner.
Spelling and grammar errors only annoy me when they are caused by intentional neglect.
For instance, in Norwegian, we compound by saying "compoundwords", rather than "compound words", and the former has a different meaning than the latter. Mostly due to MS Office's crappy spellchecking, it has become highly prevalent lately to split compounds, so that "heat pumps" (varmepumper) becomes "hot pumps" (varme pumper), to take one example.
The difference (to a native speaker of Norwegian) is obvious when a non-dyslexic person reads what they have written, and the near ubiquity of this error on signs and such is a testament to the problem being a lack of reading what one has written, rather than dyslexia, in most cases.
Quoting is mostly a way for me to avoid repeating, and possibly misstating, the assertions made by whoever I reply to. I can certainly paraphrase them, but in the end, the one I am replying to is the one most likely to care about the exact wording. But the quoting also serves to break up the data by context, partially obviating the need to use a formal format, at least in addressing someone else's point.
I do know it, and don't take it as patronizing. Writing papers, specifications, design documents, security protocols, and so forth, is among the stuff I do for a living. I just don't feel like it's an appropriate format for a reply to a forum post.
I know what a catch-22 is, which kind of goes to establish my being in one. My English language has certain flaws, but is generally fairly decent. But my knowledge of the associated culture is limited to what I hear from friends and acquaintances in these countries, exposure via TV (which I rarely watch anymore) and movies. Which means I sometimes miss important points. And, as you say, it can be a problem when people assume I'm from an English-speaking country, and thus familiar with the culture. I did not suggest that the assumption was unwarranted.
But I did state that I was speaking generally, about the nature of prostitution, divorced from its cultural context. And was arguing that it's not the prostitution itself that is the source of the problem, but the cultural context in which it occurs, and that its legality is a significant factor in this regard.
A few points about Norway, to correct some assumptions.
We do have racism, or I should perhaps say xenophobia. It is more on an individual level than a social level, compared to the US, but there was a repeat of the experiment of using makeup to switch two people of different skin color for a day, and the experiences were not so far from what one sees in the US. We can't carry blades over 2 inches in length. I carry ones that are larger at times, and otherwise carry one that is exactly 2 inches. As a friend of mine said, the reason this isn't a problem, even at the airport, is because I'm white.
Poverty exists, but is less rampant. The lower class is relatively larger, and the cost of living is high.
Crime exists, but is less extensive, as in all countries with a judicial branch that focuses on rehabilitation, and the idea that most criminals are just ordinary people in extraordinary circumstances, who will need to successfully return to society. Denmark does a better job of this than we do.
Drug addiction is addressed somewhat differently, but we still have the same silly war on drugs going.
In short, it's far from perfect, even if you like socialism (which I don't).
It does, however, provide a different view of prostitution. Which leads me back to the point that I hope we can agree on, namely that it is the cultural context (stigma etc.) and judicial handling that is the core problem of prostitution, not prostitution itself. We have streetwalkers who are absolute wrecks, too, like my aunt. I've seen her clean twice: in my childhood before she got addicted, and the last christmas before they took her child away. I just happen to see the desperation (in this case caused by addiction) as the root cause of the problem, because the people who do it without being desperate in the first place generally seem to be about as happy as other service professionals, e.g. bus drivers.
As to your papers, these are topics I study, as well, while waiting to see if I can get a permit for a fast-track psychiatry study, as I can do more good there than in IT, and already do occasional "work" in that field already on my spare time (long story). The fields of psychology and sociology don't always generalize, but one must bear in mind that we are little more than apes with a few extra coats of paint and better vocal chords. The differences are surface deep, most of the time. Analyzing attitudes to prostitution and sluts in this light gives interesting, non-PC conclusions that observations bear out. This is why I generally prefer cognitive and evolutionary psychology over other schools.
Anyway... I'm not suggesting legalization fixes everything.
I'm saying it will make some difference, and right away.
And is a necessary first step toward other solutions.
I get your point, and your clarification eliminates the need for an apology.
Have a nice day, in any case. [:D]
Regards,
al-Aswad.
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