RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (Full Version)

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MisPandora -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 8:26:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClandestinedOne

quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

Seriously, this topic is so tired and so old.  If it's not for you, politely say no thanks and get on with your life.  Have you all nothing to do but to bitch about what other people do????   Let it go already.

With all respect MisPandora She is also referring to the reputation of the site, and it does cause a big stain to Collarme's credibility in the online BDSM community.  Did you know this site is now called "the Jerry Springer Show" of BDSM?  It's not good for anyone, and i would also like to see something done about it, which She is asking.

With what respect was that posted?  And how is the OP posting about reputation when all she's saying is again, like the last time it was posted about, is that people on this site try to take money from others.

I had 15 scam emails in my AOL accounts tonight.  I had over 100 in my Yahoo mail.  ALL people trying to take money from others.  And that involved no kink.  (You really don't think the nigerian scammers on this site are all BDSMers do you? LOL)  What's the common thread -- THE INTERNET!  That's why the large amounts of scammers.  What did I do about it?  Delete the emails and went on with my day.

So what do you do about it?  Get out from behind the computer and get involved in the RT community.  People don't pull that shit offline when you're face to face.  People pull it online because somewhere in the world, there is a sucker born every minute and they're willing to put out the money to get their jollies.  If it didn't work once, they'd not come back to try again.

What don't you do about it?  Perpetuate foolish "rumors" or claims that this site has a seedy reputation.  I assure you, no one who has pure intentions on improving a place will make any such reference.  Your actions are suspect.  So at least have the cohones to refer to the superior website from which you abstracted your claim from.  No doubt we could all benefit from hanging out more with people who KNOW what Jerry Springer is to label it on someone else's hangout in such a malicious way.

To be brutally honest, most internet BDSM sites are somewhat of a joke when you look at it.  It's humans talking.  And people say silly shit (including referring to a site as a staged comedic circus on soap opera TV.)   You've never lived until you've had death threats on a board for disagreeing with someone, never shook your head in disgust as much as you would had you have been privy to watching 50 women fight with one another on an unnamed pro domina run board, or watch a meltdown of all things civil on the Max Fisch hang.

This place is tame and civilized in comparison.  And, it's frequented by a significant amount of people who actually DO BDSM, not just sit at home and wank about it.  I run into a large amount of folks when I'm on the road teaching or traveling for a leather title event.  There's national and international presenters who come to this site to participate -- just in a split second I identify Archer and his slave Elegant, and John Warren.

Step out from behind the computer and take a look.  I bet you'll all find that you don't see this scamming drama happening an n-th as much as it does on the internet.




MisPandora -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 8:31:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: moki1984

personally I see non financial Dommes do not like financial Dommes.
deal with it, people are different.
I see nothing wrong with either accord personally, and some do require a tribute for the pleasure of speaking to that individual. Many subs actually enjoy that, hanging over money or a gift feels like they are handing over some of their power right off the bat

THANK YOU!
It doesn't bother me one freaking way or other other.  FinDom guys don't affect me.  They won't seek me out since I don't solicit for money or set up an expectation that they must tithe.  They might annoy me like one did earlier this week where he emailed me 6 times asking me if I would accept him or else he'd take his 6 figure salary elsewhere.  This is a guy who solicited me out of the blue, at random, OFFERING to give me money to make his fantasies come true and I wouldn't accept it.  So it took me two more "No thanks, not interested" than I would have liked.  So what.  He's entitled to his kink just as I am mine. 




MisPandora -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 8:33:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: iammachine

Now, as for transactional exchange of any sort: What possesses someone to contact someone they know from the get go is not compatible?

PLEASE, I beg of you, start this as a separate thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




ClandestinedOne -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 8:34:50 PM)

i've said all i wanted to say, and i sincerely listened to what everyone else had to say, so i am only going to mention one thing, because if -insert beep here- pisses me off when Someone slips a personal insult into a debate where W/we are all "supposed" to be mature adults here.




MisPandora -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 8:46:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClandestinedOne

i've said all i wanted to say, and i sincerely listened to what everyone else had to say, so i am only going to mention one thing, because if -insert beep here- pisses me off when Someone slips a personal insult into a debate where W/we are all "supposed" to be mature adults here.

And therein lies the rub.  I didn't read what Sonnet had to say to you as a personal insult, merely a civil discussion of how people differ on a personals site.  We're all here for something different.  The challenge is finding someone whose puzzle pieces match the puzzle you're putting together!  Not everyone is going to have the same interests, needs and desires.  Married men don't suit me, nor do those who don't want a relationship incorporating the BDSM and the vanilla aspects of our lives.  That doesn't mean that the folks I say no thank you to are bad or wrong or that my kink is more superior -- it's just DIFFERENT.  People who want to pay to play (be it through the professional domina route or the financial dom/tithing route) are no less entitled to their personal kink than I am mine.  Mine isn't better, nor is yours.  Some folks need to dismount the high horse that "their kink is better than so-and-so's kink."  Like it or not, WE ARE ALL OF A DIFFERENT ILK THAN SOCIETY SHINES UPON!
 

First they came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Communist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Jew.

Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up,
because I was a Protestant.

Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left
to speak up for me.
This was published in Time magazine in 89 commemorating an anniversary of WW2.  This is a variant of the original poem written by Pastor Martin Niemöller.




MsSonnetMarwood -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/29/2007 9:38:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClandestinedOne

i've said all i wanted to say, and i sincerely listened to what everyone else had to say, so i am only going to mention one thing, because if -insert beep here- pisses me off when Someone slips a personal insult into a debate where W/we are all "supposed" to be mature adults here.


Again, it's all a matter of perception.  You perceived it as a personal insult when I used your profile as an example of something I don't care for, but you don't perceive it as an insult when you say that money dommes are a "big stain to Collarme's credibility" and that the site is called the "Jerry Spring Show of BDSM".

I happen to think that wanker males online are far more common than money dommes.   But realistically, I'm a big girl and I can handle using the delete key.  The biggest reaction they get from me these days is a laugh.   The reason I keep bringing up the male wanker factor is that no matter how many emails you boys get from someone who wants your money....we ladies get far FAR FAR (did I mention far?) more from men who want some sort of online masturbatory fantasy fulfillment - and we always will get more.  While I personally wouldn't, I can see why some enterprising folks might say hmmm...there may be some ducats to be made off the horny masses.  That's capitalism.

You (and others) are welcome to behave in the manner that you want and present yourself in the manner that you want.   I'm free to like or not like, laugh at it, ignore it, or not.  You can't control how other people act, but you CAN control how you react.

What you can't do is campaign on innuendo and half truths and rumors that you can't defend to eradicate those you don't like from a site that you don't own and don't even pay to use.




ClandestinedOne -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (8/30/2007 12:59:51 AM)

just... nevermind, lol.




BossyLadyPamela -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/1/2007 10:27:19 AM)

There is a place called 31 flavors...  wonder why???...

some days I like golden showers, some days I like to play dress up........somedays I love sensual...some more agressive..some days I love women, some days I love men... correction--usually I can always love women with no effort.........  this forum..this site..is  a place that we all visit as individuals and get what we seek from it....  different to each of us...   you that try and stuff us all in to this boring ..dommes do this..subs do this.. your missing so much and are not even on the correct page for the entry to this scene.. you may think you are, but this is so much about diversity and personal expression from all parts of the circle..

I visited a shop we have here once and there was a lavendar lace domme there..... she was into severe pain...  we talked for hours and I was facinated by her..I am still not in to pain..but her presentation of herself and desires was imprinted on me forever..I loved her that day... she loved women as a lesbian..and charged men for pain sessions...

Just recently,..  a topic that I was fully aware of did nothing for me for years..then all of a sudden with no real reason...  had me so dam aroused I was not planted on the ground firmly and could do nothing but get it out of my system....yes lucky sub player that was....  have not visited that particulair kink since.. not intentionaly, just not there for me currently...

I visit this site....  the Jerry Springer site as someone called it with the awareness that there are "people from many different thoughts out here"  dear god thanks for that......  I get all kinds of things that satisfy me from it....  many different people..somedays I just read the posts and profiles and laugh...  the few times I have browsed the just photos.... oh I do feel like I am at a Jerry Springer convention and I am frightened with a giggle... I would not even entertain being in the same building with some of the folks.........no matter how much they wanted to pay....

I connect with very few out here...  I have one woman who is my friend in a sense of real life....  we like to sip coffee and play footsie under a soft blanket with the thunderstorm all around us as we sit on the porch... as we dream about a special place in New Orleans...yep..corny...-- we intelligently mix in filth as we laugh and have a very womanly conversation about  life.... we charge each other nothing for this exchange...........  I was not planning on having this budding friendship from here.... but I will gladly continue to feel it... I bring this up as it was not my intention and what a wonderful surprise it has come to be...

There are a couple of domme women out here that I would like to see if I could connect with...they are sassy and fun.... I read their posts and want to say hello..never do..

Then my sweet subbie boys...............  pay to play.. some sneak thru and you know who you are..  it doesnt last long, but still I enjoy the sneak.....  I want to clarify to anyone reading this post who is submissive and curious about me.. ..go read my profile..  your choice..
 
such a tired subject..why do we all reply ...I duno.......... I still do though....   ooh I expect full payment of $25.00 for reading this post !!!!
 
and did I stick to the OP?... not sure..dont care..





undergroundsea -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 8:55:37 AM)

Like the OP, I see professional domination to be different from financial domination. I see professional domination as generally positive whereas I have mixed feelings about financial domination. By a professional domme whom I see positively I mean one who is serious about the business and whose practice is consistent with responsibility and ethics. By financial domination I mean interactions which are not presented as professional domination but a material exchange is compulsory for these interactions to occur.

There are some people who engage in financial domination as a mutual fetish, which is fair enough. I have a friend for whom I have tremendous regard who was a professional domme and now engages in financial domination. I am convinced her situation is one of mutual want and she holds fondness and compassion for the sub.

Still, I am cynical about how money affects people in general. My instincts and observations say that in most cases financial dommes have entered the practice not to do so with those who enjoy the kink but to make money where exists a high demand for dommes regardless of whether the sub enjoys it as a kink. In other words, I believe in many cases it is presented as a fetish but is done as a payment for attention in a high-demand situation, and the attempt to cover up the intention affects how I feel about it. I am more impressed when one is open about the intention when it is done as a transaction.

The want for financial domination can come from various motivations. To me, general compassion and kindness is a trait I appreciate in a partner and I feel exploitation is inconsistent with general compassion. By exploitation, I mean one who holds a disregard for the sub and is focused on getting the money. Indeed there are persons who are in financial domination to exploit. For example, I see some financial dommes who engage in forced intoxication or seek lonely or otherwise socially compromised persons, which I see to be towards exploitation. I cannot know for any given financial domme how much of her motivations have genuine roots and how much not, which leaves me cautious.

Perhaps one can exploit in this context and be genuine with those with whom they have relationships. And the exploitation may come because it is requested towards emotional SM. However, I cannot know how temporary or not the ability to exploit is and, all other things equal and not knowing more, I can more easily trust one who does not exploit even a stranger.

So one of my reservations about financial domination comes from questions of trust and compatibility of general social philosophies. This reservation has less to do with the practice and more with the uncertainty about motivations behind the practice. The other reservation comes from my sense of self. I approach D/s relationships and interactions much like I do general social relationships and interactions. I would feel about paying for attention much like I would if someone said I had to pay to socialize or be friends with that person. I find this idea a turn off for what it suggests about the value of my time and company.

My perspective is subjective, incomplete, and fluid. How I feel about financial domination has changed as I have come to know more about it and there are several matters I have not fully resolved.

I do not think there is a need to curb financial domination--I think it serves a purpose. Like professional domination, it enables some people to experience what they wish to experience while allowing a means for income for some. And I think it helps the ratio issues in femdom both in the short term and the long term.

Cheers,

Sea




undergroundsea -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 9:16:20 AM)

There are various rants on these boards. Some are against men and some are against women. They will continue to occur as new people continue to post, or the same people post again on the matter.

While I feel rants carry negativity and it becomes tiring to see the same complaint again and again, I think rants serve a purpose. They help see issues seen by others. And sometimes rants bring about constructive discussion. Some of the information I have learned that has helped me become more tolerant towards financial domination has come from these rants. And perspectives of subs on these threads might be relevant to a domme who is considering entering financial domination.

I seldom object against rants. When I object, I usually counter the perspective and offer mine, which can allow a debate or exchange of views. When a rant does not interest me, I move on to other threads.

That said, while I do not have an issue with the rant itself in the OP, I do not feel there is a need to control or disallow financial domination.

Cheers,

Sea




undergroundsea -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 9:46:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyLadyPamela
you that try and stuff us all in to this boring ..dommes do this..subs do this.. your missing so much and are not even on the correct page for the entry to this scene.. you may think you are, but this is so much about diversity and personal expression from all parts of the circle..


I think the same idea applies to subs. There exist subs who are willing and can give to a relationship whereas one justification for financial domination is that subs do not give to a relationship.

With respect to that reason, I think financial domination is not entered because subs leave no choice but by a choice to interact with and be compensated by subs who are otherwise incompatible. There is still the choice to pass on one who is incompatible.

Cheers,

Sea




kc692 -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 11:48:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClandestinedOne

quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

Seriously, this topic is so tired and so old.  If it's not for you, politely say no thanks and get on with your life.  Have you all nothing to do but to bitch about what other people do????   Let it go already.

With all respect MisPandora She is also referring to the reputation of the site, and it does cause a big stain to Collarme's credibility in the online BDSM community.  Did you know this site is now called "the Jerry Springer Show" of BDSM?  It's not good for anyone, and i would also like to see something done about it, which She is asking.


May I politely ask where the fuck it is called that?  IT is not called that in my real life community, of which there is one, and many are on the site from there.  It is not called that with any I correspond with, and trust me, I am in touch with many.  I do not see it called that on other sites I am on.....and since I don't waste my time on Jerry Springer in real life, would love to know who is calling the site that.

Since you would like to see something done about it, may I ask what it is you would do?  Would you start charging everyone to get rid of the fakes?  They abound on alt, bondage and numerous other sites also........what do you think the solution is?




MisPandora -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 11:51:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kc692

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClandestinedOne

quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

Seriously, this topic is so tired and so old.  If it's not for you, politely say no thanks and get on with your life.  Have you all nothing to do but to bitch about what other people do????   Let it go already.

With all respect MisPandora She is also referring to the reputation of the site, and it does cause a big stain to Collarme's credibility in the online BDSM community.  Did you know this site is now called "the Jerry Springer Show" of BDSM?  It's not good for anyone, and i would also like to see something done about it, which She is asking.


May I politely ask where the fuck it is called that?  IT is not called that in my real life community, of which there is one, and many are on the site from there.  It is not called that with any I correspond with, and trust me, I am in touch with many.  I do not see it called that on other sites I am on.....and since I don't waste my time on Jerry Springer in real life, would love to know who is calling the site that.

Since you would like to see something done about it, may I ask what it is you would do?  Would you start charging everyone to get rid of the fakes?  They abound on alt, bondage and numerous other sites also........what do you think the solution is?

He's refused challenges of three different people to come forward and disclose what place is so much better than here and he can't.  Telling, eh?




kc692 -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 11:55:55 AM)

That is what I get for not reading all the way through, smiles.  I was just going to acknowledge others had answered far better than I previously, but you are correct, I do not see the answers to the specific questions I asked, and I did not ask them in an ascerbic tone...........

edited to add:  I really would like to know what his solution is...it is too easy for anyone to say something should be fixed without them having an idea on how to fix it.  I also would like to know who the hell is calling this site Jerry Springerville too!!!! 




TexasMaam -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:07:03 PM)

IMHO, Anyone who spends much time here at CM who expects Dollar Dommes not to take advantage of the free site is just hopelessly naieve.

Get over it and move on.

TM




TheIronHorse -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:10:46 PM)

A small annual membership fee would rid CM of many of the scammers and idiots.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TexasMaam

IMHO, Anyone who spends much time here at CM who expects Dollar Dommes not to take advantage of the free site is just hopelessly naieve.

Get over it and move on.

TM




undergroundsea -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:23:15 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheIronHorse
A small annual membership fee would rid CM of many of the scammers and idiots.


And that brings us back to the question of abc's of bdsm sites (alt, bondage, collar) and which might be a Jerry Springer site. If any site is a Jerry Springer of such sites, I think it is alt. Alt charges a fee to do pretty much anything except sign in yet alt is full of bot profiles and scams. So I think the approach you suggest would not work and would have a greater impact on those who use this site for its intended reason.

While I frown upon scammers, not every financial domme is a scammer and I think in general the practice serves a purpose.

Cheers,

Sea




TexasMaam -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:29:12 PM)

It's been tried, and not so very long ago, just before they added the advertisements to try and generate SOMETHING to meet the costs of maintaining this site.

Since I don't pay for the privelege of posting here, and neither does anyone else, I simply expect the ads and the Dollar Dom/mmes to be a part of the CM experience. 

Kind of like all those viagra emails I have to put up with on my free Yahoo account. 

I beleive there is, in fact, another site that the 'in' crowd is invited to, although I've never been asked to join it and probably wouldn't pay for it if I were given the opportunity, anyway.

So, you get what you pay for.  Ignore the ads and the Dollar Dom/mmes and go on about your business and for pete's sake let's find something more fascinating to post/whine/biaattch about.

**Sea, that's a great post.  I once had a paid profile at Alt and got nothing but bots and silly hng's that weren't worth the time to send an email to. You're right on target.


TM

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheIronHorse

A small annual membership fee would rid CM of many of the scammers and idiots.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TexasMaam

IMHO, Anyone who spends much time here at CM who expects Dollar Dommes not to take advantage of the free site is just hopelessly naieve.

Get over it and move on.

TM





TheIronHorse -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:32:18 PM)

Yes, you are for the most part, correct. The problem with Alt however, is that the site operators dont give a damn who does what over there.   The CM site operators are more actively involved than some nameless corporation running a singles site.

A fee would get rid of the majority of the "Nigerians", as they are often called here.

For the record, I bear no ill ill towards professional dommes who hang their sign out on CM as long as their "professional" status is clearly defined.

I have a money fetish, I like keeping mine and spending on things truly worth while. A financial domme is NOT one of them.





quote:

ORIGINAL: undergroundsea

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheIronHorse
A small annual membership fee would rid CM of many of the scammers and idiots.


And that brings us back to the question of abc's of bdsm sites (alt, bondage, collar) and which might be a Jerry Springer site. If any site is a Jerry Springer of such sites, I think it is alt. Alt charges a fee to do pretty much anything except sign in yet alt is full of bot profiles and scams. So I think the approach you suggest would not work and would have a greater impact on those who use this site for its intended reason.

While I frown upon scammers, not every financial domme is a scammer and I think in general the practice serves a purpose.

Cheers,

Sea




kc692 -> RE: Money from the start? What are they thinking? (9/2/2007 12:41:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheIronHorse

A small annual membership fee would rid CM of many of the scammers and idiots.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TexasMaam

IMHO, Anyone who spends much time here at CM who expects Dollar Dommes not to take advantage of the free site is just hopelessly naieve.

Get over it and move on.

TM



Hello TM, long time no see...to IronHorse, there are idiots and scammers on alt, bondage and others, how would that help?




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