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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 11:50:43 AM

Dominatist

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< Message edited by Dominatist -- 9/11/2007 11:54:30 AM >

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 11:53:21 AM

philosophy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

He just said they won't let go and left it that. But he didn't feel the need to walk up to these guys and say that. As I said, it is not up to anyone to tell people to get over it. When you take it upon yourself to tell someone that is upset how they should feel, than that shows a lack of class and manners in my opinion.

Agreed....this thread is meant to be the equivilant of a coffee bar round the corner and up a block from the memorial....so that those who may be tempted to go up and abuse the veterans have somewhere else to go.........

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 12:00:16 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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But what's the difference between remembering and honoring and "not letting go of grief"? I myself am uncomfortable with publicly sharing my thoughts of September 11 because I've done it in the past and do not feel it will add more to do it again, but I understand others find it helpful and useful and certainly nothing wrong with it.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 12:09:43 PM

all4yourplsr

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SmokingGun,

Thank You for mentioning 1/28/86.

ed

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 12:21:41 PM

SugarMyChurro

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I think part of the problem is that public displays of grief do ACTUALLY serve a political agenda - intended or not. That display of grief has notoriously been used - co-opted - to justify all kinds of nonsense.

Some of us are just standing back and saying, "Yeah, what terrible losses we have suffered..." and then there's a whole other set that is like Rudy Guilliani who can't seem to go one sentence without exploiting 9/11 to their political purposes.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 12:27:07 PM

LivingInSin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ChicagoSwitchMal

My thing is that unless you lost someone on 9/11 after six years it's time to move on. Not forget - just move on. As corny as it sounds thats what the terrorists want. They want us to remember this over and over... they want us to dwell on it... they want us to fear that it will happen to us. I won't give them the satisfaction.

.

I could not have put it better myself.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 12:38:09 PM

RCdc

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I just dont get the point of this thread philosophy.
There are at least three other 9-11 threads going that have good positive vibes and were posted with and by well intentioned individuals. Just because a fourth is challenged, this is now seen as being anti american or unpatriotic or unthoughtful.
I dont get it.
We are supposed to walk on eggshells? If some people question a persons motivation on a post that isn't my responsibility how they take it... just as it isn't there responsibility on how I perceive it. Really, this is a free and open forum, as far as I remember - and as long as the TOS are adheared to, I don't see the point of starting another 9-11 thread as a bash thread. If people don't like what may be posted, then don't post. You let your words out and they fly, you can't attempt to control everyone into neat little boxes just because some people may be offended by what is said.
It starts like this, then moves onto other threads - soon we wont be able to respond to threads on christianity, or conservative views, or the death of a princess, without 'worrying' that we may offend someone or disrespect some unknown entity.

Threads dont offend me, but I don't understand why people feel the need to try and seperate opinions into a them and us instead of just having a discussion. It may seem a person is being an asshole for posting their own opinion, but I am damned if I will be silent just out of some false respect because it's the subjective 'right and polite thing to do'.

Peace
the.dark.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:01:38 PM

CuriousLord

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I've seen a lot of pity seekers, demanding utter sympathy on this day since they've had a friend, extended relative, friend of a friend, estranged relation, etc., killed in 9/11. I often feel that they neglect just how many of us have seen loved ones die.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:04:43 PM

defiantbadgirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

BTW, if we know when a Bin Laden tape is coming out, just about down to the minute, why isn't anyone sitting at the door of Aljazeera waiting for the currier to find out where HE came from and follow the trail back to the source?

Exactly. Alot of people don't like Keary, but he brought up an excellent point when debating with Bush before the last presidential election. Why, when troops were so close to capturing the one responsible for the terrorist attack, did Bush suddenly decide to go after Iraq? I understand that the Middle East is a hotbed for terrorists, but that has been the case for many years. Why let the one behind the attacks go free? I think it would help alot of people in their grief if the one responsible was caught and dealt with.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:06:39 PM

ChicagoSwitchMal

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So many people have turned 9/11 into being about themselve with some pretty loose associations. I knew a guy - a volunteer fireman for a microscopic town who never saw anything bigger than a garage fire suddenly embrace the rescuers of 9/11 as his "brothers". The dude filled his house up with every tacky ground zero picture he could find. His house was ablaze with "Gone but not forgotten" and "We will never forget". it made me sick. Clearly it was an attempt to hijack the dignity of the true hero's and make it his own.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:08:52 PM

Rule

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Quite. The dark makes eminent sense. This thread is an abomination.

I abhor false sentimentalities. I consider them evil and selfish.

There are also misguided sentimentalities. Those I do not consider evil, but deceived.

Then there are honest sentimentalities, like those of SusanofO. Those are the real thing.

This evening I met a New Yorker here in The Netherlands. The daughter of an acquitance of his saw from her place of work both planes fly into both towers - with her very own eyes. Of course I asked for names and I got two. Now I will google those and see what turns up...

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:09:04 PM

SeeksOnlyOne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LivingInSin

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChicagoSwitchMal

My thing is that unless you lost someone on 9/11 after six years it's time to move on. Not forget - just move on. As corny as it sounds thats what the terrorists want. They want us to remember this over and over... they want us to dwell on it... they want us to fear that it will happen to us. I won't give them the satisfaction.

.

I could not have put it better myself.

i refuse to feel bad for remembering this day.......i dont lie around and wail all day, but to me, 9-11 was an awakening.....a loss of innocence in many ways.....it was a significant event, and a day i can reflect on before and after......but then some folks say im nuts.......

but i dont blame anyone who doesnt want to do the same.....

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:13:27 PM

ChicagoSwitchMal

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and I wouldnt ask anyone to feel bad for remembering. Just saying how I feel. :)

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:27:17 PM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

...the idea behind this thread is to create a space where people who feel uncomfortable with the current zeitgeist surrounding 9/11 can post without offending those who are genuinely upset. Leave those other threads alone if you disagree with the OP, just for once. Post here if you must.

Personally i think that hanging on to the grief isn't healthy, i read a post where someone said something along the lines that not remembering so vividly disrespected the dead. So, if that's true ought we not also remember the innocent dead that have been killed in the various aftermaths? Shock and Awe come to mind.

Oh, and if this thread offends you, please feel free to follow the same advice i gave to those whose disagree with your stance.

Philosophy, I agree.
I don't want greif I want *REVENGE* Bigtime!
Bush is a cunt!
Six years now and that Mexican border is still wide open!
Pakistan should be a sheet of melted glass by now for harboring bin laden and al qeada!
If there was *ever* a time to use nuclear weapons this is it!
I'm tired of people "pointing fingers", use those fingers to *push buttons!*
I'm waaaay beyond "greif."
There is no reason that al qeada and bin laden should still be alive!
All those bible people think that we're going to have "armegedan" anyway so let's do it and see who's still standing afterwards.
What are we supposed to do let them attack us again with nuclear weapons this time?
Strike First!

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:29:32 PM

SmokingGun82

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On the subject of people who try to make grief about them... such as ChicagoSwitchMal's firefighter friend... it happens all the time.

I've noticed that whenever someone dies, everyone was their "best friend." The miserable son of a bitch no one wanted to hang out with is suddenly the nicest, sweetest guy ever. It's annoying, and it's frustrating. Real grief is nothing to be ashamed of... false grief, or exagerrated grief, is.

N.B- I'm not accusing anyone on this forum of doing this. It's an in general statement.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:39:06 PM

philosophy

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......i've never started an abomination before. Do i get a certificate?

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:43:12 PM

Alumbrado

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Naaaah... you're trying too hard.

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 1:55:06 PM

NeedToUseYou

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I wouldn't say I'm a non-sympathizer. I feel for the people that died in the towers. That 's about it. Everything else related to 9/11 feels me with disgust. From the incompetence of our government, to the war, to unwillingness to examine the causes, to not locking down the borders, at the same time pulling the boogey man/men(Osama, hand full of terrorists) out when convenient.

He's after you, but we're not going to lock the door!! But we're here to protect you, just trust us. You don't want another 9/11 do you?

I hate the use of 9.11 as a club and emotional catalyst that is all it is used for now, in the media, and in politics anyway.

Individuals can speak of it and it doesn't bother me, and I can identify. However, Media and politicians have so fouled 9/11 by invoking it to do mischief or simply to get elected. It makes me want to gag at the mention of it.

This is the central reason I won't vote for certain candidates, they are using it, instead of respecting what occured. They use it to scare, and manipulate feelings in order to gain support for ideas, or acts that have nothing at all to do with 9/11 all the while not addressing the problems they profess to exist.

Yeah, I'm tired of 9/11, in general. I feel for the people that lost their lives, and those close to them, but it has been turned into nothing more than a boogeyman by the media and politicians, and a destructive force not a uniting one, as it was the day it occured.(By this I mean in the context of citizens feeling a sense of togetherness, and now it simply is a division, I'm not using it in a literal physical sense).

< Message edited by NeedToUseYou -- 9/11/2007 2:00:47 PM >

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 2:29:38 PM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
The daughter of an acquitance of his saw from her place of work both planes fly into both towers - with her very own eyes. Of course I asked for names and I got two. Now I will google those and see what turns up...

Nope. I think that I found the mother (her maiden name is interesting, but unfortunately prevalent) and her two daughters, but as of yet I have not found any evidence on the internet that corroborates that one of the daughters witnessed with her very own eyes that two planes flew into the two WTC towers. There appear to be no credible eye-witnesses of the events at all - at least any that I am aware off.

< Message edited by Rule -- 9/11/2007 2:31:22 PM >

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RE: 9/11 non-sympathisers - 9/11/2007 2:33:28 PM

RRafe

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I want to forget-and quit feeding al quida.

The bastards want to change our lives-I don't want them to have the ability.

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