RE: Jena 6 Day (Full Version)

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deadbluebird -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 9:16:01 PM)

i dont see how 6 boys kicking one boy in the HEAD isnt attempted murder. the head is a rather fragel thing. they didnt kick him in his legs, or his arms, or even his side, they chose to kick him in his Head. I understand there was much done, and many actions that didnt face proper consequences however "two wrongs don't make a right". also people keep saying " it was jsut a high school fight, these things happen all the time" well they shouldnt. its a shame that it had to be a black boys that were the first charged with such extreme charges, (although maybe white people have faced similar charges before that just were not as publicized) however an example needs to be set. kids cant go around kicking each other in the head. the violence in our society needs to stop. people do not fear anymore, they dont fear the law, they dont fear consequences and that needs to change.




cyberdude611 -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 9:21:00 PM)

I also want to make sure everyone knows that this kid the 6 guys beat up was NOT the one that hung the nooses....




Owner59 -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 9:24:17 PM)

You've got to be taught
To hate and fear,
You've got to be taught
From year to year,
It's got to be drummed
In your dear little ear
You've got to be carefully taught.

You've got to be taught to be afraid
Of people whose eyes are oddly made,
And people whose skin is a diff'rent shade,
You've got to be carefully taught.

You've got to be taught before it's too late,
Before you are six or seven or eight,
To hate all the people your relatives hate,
You've got to be carefully taught!




Owner59 -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 9:29:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

I also want to make sure everyone knows that this kid the 6 guys beat up was NOT the one that hung the nooses....


nah,he just called them n#*ers.Just so everybody knows.




UtopianRanger -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 10:10:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pulpsmack

So, six people who are gravely offended by the a horribly offensive act react by a 6-on-1 dogpile beatdown that potentially could have killed the kid, and you actually champion that cause?



Since when did kicking someone 'round the head deserve 20-25 years in jail? 'Hardly a punishment fitting the crime.



Gent....

Our nation, our schools and our children have all been ''pussified'' by bow tie, google-eyed, coke-bottle-glassed-wearing attorneys and politicians via fake moral outrage. Fist fights of all variations were both a mainstay and tradition at the high school I went to - Both after school and during lunch.

Minor violence of this sort is an American tradition as far as I'm concerned.

The six should be made to pick up candy wrappers in the parking lot for eight hours a day for a whole week, and possibly be suspended for a while. A jail sentence is plain ludicrous.





- R







FullfigRIMaam -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 10:14:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
A 6/1 stomping needs some serious penalties.  That the recipient wasn't a lot worse for wear just says the 6 were incompetent about it.

      That said, (and realizing I'm siding-up with Al Sharpton <shudder>) the charges are outrageous under the circumstances.  A NOOSE!?!?  I'm a west coast white boy, but I know what that one means.  Those responsible should have been expelled, and tried for making terrorist threats or on federal civil rights charges (not too late either).

   The unequal justice is disgusting.  Charge the initiators, or FREE THE JENA 6!!!
I'm going to fall off my chair, I agree with TheHeretic.
I think that if some folks would get real and treat the JENA 6 kids as they'd want their own school uhms treated, this discussion wouldn't even be happening over a high school brawl.    What the white kids did was indeed a much worse crime than what the black boys did.   I seriously doubt 6 boys couldn't have taken that boys life if they really wanted to, so I wish people would stop the BSing for once, and think of doing onto others...

And yes my siblings have put a beat down in the past for being called n****r.   I'm all for being big and walking away, but once in a while, a good phucking up works just as well (as long as one has witnesses one was hit first). 
Ah fuck it all!    M




NorthernGent -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 11:21:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pulpsmack

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pulpsmack

So, six people who are gravely offended by the a horribly offensive act react by a 6-on-1 dogpile beatdown that potentially could have killed the kid, and you actually champion that cause?



Since when did kicking someone 'round the head deserve 20-25 years in jail? 'Hardly a punishment fitting the crime.


Kicking someone in the head after he was beat down (not to mention 6 people doing it) is considered "grievous bodily injury". That alone is enough for me to use deadly force against those kids in the defense of the victim in the state of Louisiana, and many others. Based off the information I received (that the kid was not tied to the act and was drawn at random) this could be prosecuted under that bullshit hate crime statute (and certainly would if the races were reversed under the same facts). That alone carries some serious jail time.

You can try to minimize this as a kick to the head, but the fact is this wasn't the case at all. The kid was jumped and severely beaten. The prosecutor has the right to charge them under that statute AND THEN SOME according to the law. Apparently he elected a course of action to send a message to Louisianans that a gang-style beat down on somebody over your hurt feelings won't be tolerated, and he was well within his rights to do so.


So, some white lads evoke memories of lynchings and hangings; inevitably, this causes tension and quite probably insults are threats hurled from all angles, and the result is that the black lads are the first to take the law into their own hands by assaulting a white lad, and it is assumed they were trying to kill him in order to lock them up for 20-25 years.

This looks very much like a case of making sure the black lads in your area know their station.




Pulpsmack -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 11:27:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

So, some white lads evoke memories of lynchings and hangings; inevitably, this causes tension and quite probably insults are threats hurled from all angles, and the result is that the black lads are the first to take the law into their own hands by assaulting a white lad, and it is assumed they were trying to kill him in order to lock them up for 20-25 years.

This looks very much like a case of making sure the black lads in your area know their station.



Working under your operative facts I would agree... the black lads are to know their station: no matter how outrageous the offensive behavior, they are not to take the law into their own hands by responding with violence.




hisannabelle -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 11:34:39 PM)

fast reply.

greetings,

i think a lot of people (who claim that 6 on 1 isn't fair) are ignoring the fact that the day before the beating the black kids were charged with, a black student attempted to go to a "white party," and was badly beaten by a group of white kids for doing so. those white kids were not tried and convicted for attempted murder, much less by an all-black jury. the black kids ARE being tried for attempted murder, by an all-white jury.

last i checked, hanging nooses was a hate crime. if someone came up and burned a cross or hung a noose on my lawn because most of the women in my family are in interracial relationships and most of my extended family is black, i would feel physically threatened. all the black kids in that school were trying to do was desegregate their school...and hate speech in the form of lynching threats were perpetrated on them. for wanting to desegregate their school. what year is this? 1950?

i am not saying that the black kids should not be punished, but their punishment should be equal to that of the white kids involved who beat their friend as well, and the white kids should also be punished for threatening to commit a hate crime. and then the judicial system should be reprimanded for trying six black kids with an all-white jury in a very obviously racist area.

respectfully,
annabelle.

edited to add:

quote:

So, some white lads evoke memories of lynchings and hangings; inevitably, this causes tension and quite probably insults are threats hurled from all angles, and the result is that the black lads are the first to take the law into their own hands by assaulting a white lad, and it is assumed they were trying to kill him in order to lock them up for 20-25 years.


greetings northerngent (and others who have ignored this),

no, they were not the first to take the law in their own hands. their own friend was brutally attacked by a group of white students before they ever attacked the white student for whom they are being charged with attempted murder.

respectfully,
annabelle.

quote:

As at hundreds of other high schools across America, black and white students at Jena High School in Jena, La., rarely sit together. The white students gather under a big shade tree in the courtyard, while black students congregate near the auditorium.

But last year, a few days into the first semester, a new student, a freshman African American, asked the principal at an assembly, if he, too, could sit under the tree. He was told he could sit anywhere he liked.

Three white boys on the rodeo team apparently disagreed. The next morning, there were three nooses hanging from the shade tree in the courtyard.

Many in Jena's black community wanted the three white students expelled. But when the white superintendent and other school administrators investigated, they decided the nooses were a prank. Instead of expulsion or arrest, the three received in-school suspension.

A few of the black athletes, the stars of the football team, took the lead in resisting. The day after the nooses were hung, they reportedly organized a silent protest under the tree.

The school called an assembly and summoned the police and the district attorney. Black students sat on one side, whites on the other. District Attorney Reed Walters warned the students he could be their friend or their worst enemy. He lifted his fountain pen and said, "With one stroke of my pen, I can make your life disappear."

That evening, black students told their parents that the DA was looking right at them. Walters denies that. Billy Fowler, a member of the school board, doesn't believe it, either.

"He said some pretty strong things," says Fowler, "but I don't think he was directing it to anyone in particular. I think he just wanted people to calm it down."

But things didn't calm down. Some whites felt triumphant; some blacks were resentful. Fights began to break out at the high school. But that year, the football team was having an unusually good season and the black athletes were a major reason why. So while there were fights throughout the fall, nobody wanted to take any action that would hurt the team.

When the season was over, so was the truce. On Nov. 30, somebody burned down Jena High. Whites thought blacks were responsible, blacks thought the opposite.

Charges and Public Outrage

The next night, 16-year-old Robert Bailey and a few black friends tried to enter a party attended mostly by whites. When Bailey got inside, he was attacked and beaten. The next day, tensions escalated at a local convenience store. Bailey exchanged words with a white student who had been at the party. The white boy ran back to his truck and pulled out a pistol grip shotgun. Bailey ran after him and wrestled him for the gun.

After some scuffling, Bailey and his friends took the gun away and brought it home. Bailey was eventually charged with theft of a firearm, second-degree robbery and disturbing the peace. The white student who pulled the weapon was not charged at all.

The following Monday, Dec.4, a white student named Justin Barker was loudly bragging to friends in the school hallway that Robert Bailey had been whipped by a white man on Friday night. When Barker walked into the courtyard, he was attacked by a group of black students. The first punch knocked Barker out and he was kicked several times in the head. But the injuries turned out to be superficial. Barker was examined by doctors and released; he went out to a social function later that evening.

Six black students were arrested and charged with aggravated assault. But District Attorney Reed Walters increased the charges to attempted second-degree murder. That provoked a storm of black outrage.


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=12353776




NorthernGent -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 11:44:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pulpsmack

So, six people who are gravely offended by the a horribly offensive act react by a 6-on-1 dogpile beatdown that potentially could have killed the kid, and you actually champion that cause?



Since when did kicking someone 'round the head deserve 20-25 years in jail? 'Hardly a punishment fitting the crime.



Gent....

Our nation, our schools and our children have all been ''pussified'' by bow tie, google-eyed, coke-bottle-glassed-wearing attorneys and politicians via fake moral outrage. Fist fights of all variations were both a mainstay and tradition at the high school I went to - Both after school and during lunch.

Minor violence of this sort is an American tradition as far as I'm concerned.

The six should be made to pick up candy wrappers in the parking lot for eight hours a day for a whole week, and possibly be suspended for a while. A jail sentence is plain ludicrous.


- R



Couldn't agree more with the lads fighting point, UR, 'part of growing up as far as I'm concerned......and it doesn't hurt to get your comeupannce once in a while, 'sounds like this lad was at a party on the same night, if so, it's hardly beating him to within an inch of his life.

A related point: start throwing punches in an English town or city on a Friday and Saturday night, and you'll probably get done for GBH (if the other lad bothers to report it), but it won't carry a jail sentence. You start throwing punches at a football match and you will receive a jail sentence within days, anywhere between 9 months and 5 years depending on previous. The crime is the same in both cases, the differences are a) the public's perception of what is acceptable and b) where law enforcement agencies can score easy points. Maybe there's something in this that explains why an assault is being trumped up to an attempted murder charge, maybe black kids assaulting white kids will simply not be tolerated by those running the show, and they're just going to have to live with the threats of hanging.




NorthernGent -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/20/2007 11:53:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pulpsmack

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

So, some white lads evoke memories of lynchings and hangings; inevitably, this causes tension and quite probably insults are threats hurled from all angles, and the result is that the black lads are the first to take the law into their own hands by assaulting a white lad, and it is assumed they were trying to kill him in order to lock them up for 20-25 years.

This looks very much like a case of making sure the black lads in your area know their station.



Working under your operative facts I would agree... the black lads are to know their station: no matter how outrageous the offensive behavior, they are not to take the law into their own hands by responding with violence.


As far as I can tell, no one has an issue with these lads being charged......for assault. The main point is that this punishment doesn't fit the crime.




ChicagoSwitchMal -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 3:46:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

General response.
 
How did some people here take the original post as a call for these people to get away with what they did? That just isn't what this thread was about, and certainly isn't what she said.
 
Come on now people ... forget the accused are black. Just put that aside. They wanted to charge people with murder, when nobody died ... which does tend to be a requirement for murder, right? Now, they want to burn them with up to twenty-five years, for a fight. I've seen fights at my old High School, where nobody was arrested, where people looked as bad as that guy.
 
Maybe this was worth a night in the can, and made a civil matter at that point.

Edited to add for Popeye: Gurelli's are designer jeans. Probably a bad joke.


No one is accused of murder. Attempted murder WAS a charge. I'm not sure Mychal Bell is even charged with it anymore (please correct me if I a wrong). I thought everything was brought down agrivated 2 nd degree assault.




ChicagoSwitchMal -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 3:56:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChicagoSwitchMal

What an interesting four word statement

'Product of the situation'... what an easy way out. Not deliberate choices. Not intent... Not free will...they were the 'product of the situation'. They were helpless in making their decisions. 6 people kicked 1 persons body much like frost forms patterns on windows or clouds look like snowmen. It was inevitable and they are not responsible. When a man murders his wife because she is cheating his actions are the 'product of the situation', right? There comes a point when despite how you were wrong'd it is also wrong to take it to the next level.


Well,is a sense,yes.

If I called you a fagot,in front of your kids and your wife/girl,call your SO a puss filled whore,in front of you and your kids,and/or called your kids bastards,in front of you,I`d expect a beating.Or at least I`d expect you to try,just as naturally as frost forming on my window.

Understand?

note:this is not meant for anyone in particular.


Doesn't make it legal. Doesn't make it okay. Doesnt make it justified. But if you got a problem with my puss filled whore I challenge you to a duel! [8D]




NeedToUseYou -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 4:42:22 AM)

As far as the OP goes, I can't say I support the "Jena 6", I'll say that they shouldn't get an attempted murder sentence. And as far as the nooses go, I'd say they should have been expelled for the year.

From the little I read of the story it sounds like the worst of both races are coming out in forces. The noose hangers on the white side, and repeat offenders on the black side, it said that most of the black kids involved had previous charges already on the books for assault,  so we aren't talking abotu "nice boys" here.


Anyway, I think all involved (white and black)are most likely pieces of crap, from what I've read anyway.

The only part of the story I'm unsure of (in the who is a piece of crap department) is the kid that got beat, I read about three articles so far and none stated he hung the noose or was spewing racial slurs, so he may be an innocent, I just don't know on that account, but I do know hanging nooses is not cool, and I do know 6 on 1 assualts are unacceptable, and quite frankly are an honorless actions. When I was in high school, that was pretty much unacceptable, and viewed as the act of cowards.

So, they are cowards and the noose hangers are cowards. Still it doesn't deserve years in jail, I'd give 6 months though, and that is because it was 6 on 1. That just isn't acceptable to me and like I said the noose hangers should be expelled for a year.

Of coruse all of this is IMO, but the world would be a better place if it followed my sage wisdom. LOL.








favesclava -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 5:46:36 AM)

where was mr sharpton when the nooses were hung?
and oldie but goodie "Dont do the crime if you cant do the time"
my kids are taught there are consequences for every action, and they must be prepared to live with the results. everyone knows violence is not allowed in schools. most have zero tolerance. my kid's school has both of us sign a paper the first day of school that states the terms and consequences.
four years ago my daughter was expecting twins.  a few days before christmas three people jumped her in a store parking lot. they threw her tot he ground and kicked and hit her. blows landing to her pregnant belly. my grandchildren died. at five months they were a good weight and would have been healthy. i never got to hold my babies. i never got to finish the baby clothes i was knitting. those teenagers put my grandkids in a jar on their mothers bedroom. my daughter will never be the same.
25 years? their lives wouldnt be enough .
two white girls and a black guy. somebody's children did this. they were never caught.




Owner59 -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 6:34:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: favesclava

where was mr sharpton when the nooses were hung?
and oldie but goodie "Dont do the crime if you cant do the time"
my kids are taught there are consequences for every action, and they must be prepared to live with the results. everyone knows violence is not allowed in schools. most have zero tolerance. my kid's school has both of us sign a paper the first day of school that states the terms and consequences.
four years ago my daughter was expecting twins.  a few days before christmas three people jumped her in a store parking lot. they threw her tot he ground and kicked and hit her. blows landing to her pregnant belly. my grandchildren died. at five months they were a good weight and would have been healthy. i never got to hold my babies. i never got to finish the baby clothes i was knitting. those teenagers put my grandkids in a jar on their mothers bedroom. my daughter will never be the same.
25 years? their lives wouldnt be enough .
two white girls and a black guy. somebody's children did this. they were never caught.



The 1st part of your comment implies that there won`t any consequences,for the "yoots".Clearly,there has been and will be.

I`m so sorry to hear about your daughter.No one should have to bear that.Again,sorry for your loss.




EPGAH -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 6:41:51 AM)

Let's see...6 vs. 1...
Wasn't there a huge flap a couple years ago, when 4 WHITES "jumped" one black--a KNOWN CRIMINAL--rather than an innocent, and simply beat a more submissive attitude into him, as evidenced by his world-famous words, "Can't we all just get along?"
The whites were hauled up on charges--And these were POLICE--The enforcers of the law!
Are whites to be held to higher standards than the rest of us? Are prior criminals innocent because they're black?
And why is it that it took 6, rather than 4, to beat this white kid down?




meatcleaver -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 6:49:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: EPGAH

The whites were hauled up on charges--And these were POLICE--The enforcers of the law!
Are whites to be held to higher standards than the rest of us? Are prior criminals innocent because they're black?
And why is it that it took 6, rather than 4, to beat this white kid down?


If you are talking about the King case, the police were just thugs, pure and simple and weren't they cleared despite the video evidence that showed they were just that, thugs?

You just have to look at the statistics, whites aren't held to a higher standard than blacks, whites escape the so called justice dished out to blacks, particularly if they come from a 'good' background.

Take your head out of the sand.




TahoeSadist -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 7:28:20 AM)

Let me see if I have this straight:

I am supposed to support, and feel sorry for, 6 young men who made the decision to assault 1 young man, inflicting injuries that put him in the hospital and could quite easily have been much worse.

6 young men who decided to show no restraint when the single victim was down and take that opportunity to kick him in the head (I guess showing how brave they were)

I haven't heard it said that the 1 young man attacked the 6 young men, or that the 6 were in fear of an imminent attack from the 1. Nor that raining kicks on a helpless person (out cold) somehow was necessary for the safety of the 6 young men.

I'm supposed to support criminal actions like this?????

No damnit I will not. As to the charge of attempted murder, well, when you have a group of 6 young men, kicking a single unconscious young man in the head, it pretty much sounds like a fair assesment. There is nothing I can find to justify such outrageous behavior, and as a black man I am embarrassed by anyone who says that thesse 6 young men are not to be held accountable for THEIR actions.

Eric




meatcleaver -> RE: Jena 6 Day (9/21/2007 7:44:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TahoeSadist

No damnit I will not. As to the charge of attempted murder, well, when you have a group of 6 young men, kicking a single unconscious young man in the head, it pretty much sounds like a fair assesment. There is nothing I can find to justify such outrageous behavior, and as a black man I am embarrassed by anyone who says that thesse 6 young men are not to be held accountable for THEIR actions.

Eric



Either we are reading different threads or we are resident in different worlds. No one is saying that the black men involved shouldn't be punished but a charge of attempted murder seems a little extreme when the white guy in question was apparently healthy enough to go to a party the same evening. Of course the black guys should be charged with assault and appropriately punished. However 20-25 years is a little extreme, especially when you wouldn't get white men serving that time for doing the same to a black person.




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