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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:30:53 AM   
missturbation


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Lmao you're funny

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:33:01 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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But not wrong.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:33:52 AM   
missturbation


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I suppose that would depend on who you talked to.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:35:06 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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touche

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:36:15 AM   
missturbation


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*takes a bow*

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:44:39 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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lol. I like fighting/diagreeing/debating with you.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:45:58 AM   
missturbation


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Maybe we should have a 'mass debate'   



< Message edited by missturbation -- 9/24/2007 7:46:39 AM >


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Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:55:23 AM   
cyberdude611


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I think it has to do more with advancement of society and civilization than actual ability. I mean in ancient times for example it was a very different situation all around. There were different problems, different issues, and different solutions. Men were off fighting wars and what not for many years at a time and women took the role of raising the children. You look at the literature through the ages and you see that kind of a trend consistantly among many different civilizations. Not only that but back then women didnt want to work. It just wasnt considered something that the typical woman would aspire to do. It was like during the American civil war, women began to run businesses and plantations. The only reason they did that was because the man wasn't home. He was off fighting the war. So someone needed to run the business, someone needed to run the farm, or else it would collapse. And this is actually one of the things that helped spawn the feminist movement in the first part of the 20th century.

I'd take another few generations though before women really started to make acievements. And that is where we are right now.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 7:58:22 AM   
samboct


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To the OP

I wonder if those polls are similar to the polls that suggested that Carter would be reelected- but then Reagan won.  There's a world of difference in between what people say to a poll taker, and what they actually do in real life.

As a guy who's worked for women (my thesis advisor was female) and having dated women who were wealthier, and less wealthy than me- my response is that women generally get what they want.  Where I suspect the issue causes trouble is when the women's desires an ambitious, supportive spouse who wants to help rear the children, cook, clean, and get ahead at the office, while helping her do the same.  In practical terms, highly paid executives are far more likely to have a supportive spouse because they cannot contribute to the household chores on top of the job.  This means that one persons ambition has to be secondary to the primary "breadwinner".  Two high powered executive or other professional households seem to be a rarity.  I've seen the desire for an ambitious supportive spouse first hand- it's an unreasonable set of wishes. 

The article touched on the issue of conflicted desires, but it does make the dating scene confusing.  In general, I've noticed that I'm expected to pick up the check on a date, even if the women I'm out with are more successful financially than me.  This isn't hard and fast, some of the women I've gone on dates with are clearly well heeled, and are happy picking up a check, but then I'm not dating them seriously, so maybe it is a problem, and I'm just glossing over it.  I'm not sweating it- the social mores around dating are taking longer to change than women's rates of climbing the corporate ladder.  From my perspective, I try to be honest with the person I'm out with, and consequently, I do expect similar honesty.  Women who are "dumbing down" their achievements are being dishonest with their dates, and I suspect it boomerangs sooner or later- hence the number of women that say that they can't find a guy.  They have unreasonable search criteria, but hey, that's the reason that most relationships founder anyway.

One suggestion I came up with when hanging out with a friend who was doing much better financially than me.  Call it a friendship with romantic overtones, a not uncommon state of affairs.  What we did was recognize that my friend liked snazzy restaurants that I couldn't afford, so we came up with a compromise.  We alternated who paid for dinner- basically I got the ones under $50 and she got the ones over $50.  While she contributed more $$ to our times together, the "feel" was one of a shared responsibility.  Or if somebody got dinner, I'd get the movie.  While this won't work for women who want to feel catered to, it will work for women who actually like equality.  It also works for friendships without romantic overtones such as between guys, but that's generally less problematic.


Sam

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:05:00 AM   
RRafe


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I know the feeling.

Let me put it this way-it's hard to feel respected by someone who thinks she has a financial edge on you. We all like to feel we have equal worth.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:10:36 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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I can only speak from my own experience. But I only know one couple where the woman makes more money than her man and they are happy. But they are both doctors. He makes a couple of hundred thousand a year where she makes almost a half million. With that much money who cares. But on numerous occasions I've seen women who, as their career advances past their mens, start to wonder if he is the right guy for her. Personally I wouldnt let a woman who makes more stop me from seeing her. But I can understand why some men would.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:13:41 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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Then again I know tons of couples whose incomes I know nothing about. It might apply where I don't it. Damn it. I hate it when I defeat my own logic.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:24:32 AM   
LaTigresse


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I have yet to meet a mature self confident man that felt threatened by a sucessful woman. Although I would also assume that the woman would be of equal maturity......which does not automatically come with sucess.

As far as women being educated and sucessful and somehow owing it to men. Being the history buff that I am.....There are many sucessful men that have said they would not be where they are if not for a woman, either their mother or wife. All too often it has been the, behind the scenes, advantages the man gained due to a woman that got him where he was. As far as the men being of assistance to the women. From what I have seen, the women have gotten where they were IN SPITE OF men.

Regarding physical labour.......who is smarter.......the guy hauling the bricks or the woman watching him haul them? Who has a longer earning potential? It won't be the labourer.

I remember helping my dad on the construction site as a kid. Watching the guys hauling shingles up a ladder, my dad bitching and moaning that they were too slow. I came up with the idea of using the scaffolding and a rope and pulley system from the hay barn to get the bundles of shingles up to the top. No big muscles required. Working smarter versus harder.........interesting concept and it doesn't take a male brain to do it.

Sure there are many things one gender may be designed to do better, as a general rule. However, when push comes to shove the non-typical gender choice can usually come up with a plan B to make it work as well, if not better. Necessity being the mother of invention and so forth.


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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:28:29 AM   
ChicagoSwitchMal


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have yet to meet a mature self confident man that felt threatened by a sucessful woman. Although I would also assume that the woman would be of equal maturity......which does not automatically come with sucess.



I read your whole post and won't disagree. The part I singled out struck a chord for me. I think you just nailed it.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:32:49 AM   
Wildfleurs


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

Although I know in a forum like this, this question/topic may not make much sense since power exchange is a "norm" to most here. But do you think men fear a woman who is successful? And to women here....whats your experience with this type of thing?

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/23/fashion/23whopays.html


Yes absolutely I find that men do fear that, and I think the best explanation I've heard for it is that men see a woman that is successful on her own right - and think to themselves, can I afford to keep her?

And I definitely found that male dominants were just as guilty as being intimidated by and fearful of female submissives who are successful.  One of the reasons I love my owner is because he is proud of my accomplishments and is very encouraging, but I don't think he is the norm.  Looking at the gorean forums is enough to show me how many male dominants like their women "small."

C~


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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:35:11 AM   
MissSCD


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Ahem.

I am dealing with this issue in a personal sence right now.  
I live in the south.  The south is primarily male dominated.   All my life, I have known that my life would be easier if I had been born a male.
Not that I wish to be born one.  It is just simple bubba.com ethnics in this region.
Yes, in the south men are very intimidated by successful women.  Yes, I feel like I cannot be a part of their groups because they run it even here.  So, there is the delimia. What to do now? I don't know.  But I tend to agree with the poll.  I don't hate men by any means, but now I enjoy flirting with them and seeing just how much I can embarrass the "hunks".  To me a "hunk" is one who dresses very nice and acts like a man and not a bubba.

Regards, MissSCD

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:37:06 AM   
RRafe


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If people want to feel insecure-they have that right.

If being with someone makes them feel even more so-why tolerate living that way?

Does it really matter if anyone else feels that's right?

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:46:30 AM   
AquaticSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ChicagoSwitchMal


Then you are the exception, not the rule. I'd still love to see you carry the same load as a man for the same duration and intensity. Frankly it's just impossible and suggesting so defies common sense. It's an unavoidable consequence of boilogy that men are physically stronger than women, Period.  


It may be less common but it's far from impossible. Perhaps you would like to tell Valyraen's mother how weak she is physically? I tell ya, so weak she still outwork her own son in the hot sun doing landscaping! Or one of my dear friends who really can carry more than most the men we know.

Men's bodies are more inclined to be stronger, I will definately give you that. But strong women are common enough that the term "impossible" simply does not apply.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 9/24/2007 8:49:32 AM >


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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:48:22 AM   
Aneirin


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I am not afraid of successful women,I do admire their success.I do not see it as a threat to me,I do my thing and I can accept they do their thing.If it is that they are successful in business,then that is fine,I am successful in other areas which I am comfortable with.

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RE: Men afraid of successful women? - 9/24/2007 8:55:34 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

I am not afraid of successful women,I do admire their success.I do not see it as a threat to me,I do my thing and I can accept they do their thing.If it is that they are successful in business,then that is fine,I am successful in other areas which I am comfortable with.


I know what you mean. When they are giving you a BJ, it matters little how much they earn, you just don't judge them on that criteria.

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