Padriag
Posts: 2633
Joined: 3/30/2005
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Interesting list with some useful ideas and some that are not. Here's my point by point commentary.
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ORIGINAL: PryderiLoup
1) Tries to separate you from your friends, family or BDSM community.
I can't entirely agree with this. Suppose those friends are encouraging self destructive behavior? Suppose a family member is abusive? Suppose that "BDSM community" isn't healthy? There are simply too many possible exceptions for this. While I agree that someone who tries to isolate a submissive from all social contact is probably a bad idea... trying to seperate them from unhealthy influences can be a good thing. Which is which is something the submissive is going to have to use their own judgement about.
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2) Avoids talking about personal details. Gets mad when you ask or quickly ends the conversation or answers questions with questions.
If its personal details in general, I can agree. If its avoiding traumatic personal details, I don't agree. Some people have things in their past very difficult to talk about and that should be respected.
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3) Has no BDSM references or friends you can talk to.
This one is simply bogus. Not everyone is a member of the "community" and not belonging to the "club" is not a red flag. There are many people in this lifestyle who do not attend events, munches, or belong to clubs or groups; there is nothing wrong with that.
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4) Gets angry when you ask for references or ask around about them.
This one is iffy. I can see someone getting mad about another person "asking around about them." Its a clear indication that you don't trust them. Not everyone has references either. Consider this, this list is directed at qualifying dominants... but suppose we flip it around, how many submissives come with references? How many submissives would be comfortable with a dominant asking around about them?
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5) Is inconsistent with details about themselves.
I would simply add the word "frequently" to this. Anyone can misremember a detail here or there, we all do it. Its the ones who can't get their own birthday right three times in a row you have to wonder about.
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6) Does not give you their home and work phone number at the appropriate time.
And who defines this "appropriate" time? Frankly, unless I'm VERY comfortable with a submissive, they aren't getting my work number. Home is fine, but business is business and I keep my personal life out of that. Also, though not stated here I've seen it said before that if they don't have a land line home phone, that's a red flag. The problem with that is that we live in the age of cell phones, not everyone has a land line anymore. BTW, this is another one that applies just as much to submissives as to dominants. Don't expect a dominant to cough up a lot of information if the submissive isn't willing to do the same.
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7) Only communicates with you at strange hours and gets mad if you try to contact them at other times.
To which I would add "without reason." Someone who works night shifts might be understandably upset if you call while they are trying to sleep during the day. A soldier might not be able to take that call while on deployment ("not now honey, I've got some people shooting at me!"). You get the idea. Again, use some common sense judgement people.
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8) Criticizes the BDSM community and refuses to participate, especially if they never were part of it.
Disagree... there is no rule that says to be a good dominant one must be a member of any BDSM community. Choosing not to be part of it is just as valid as choosing to be a very active part of it. There are those who are part of the community who are dangerous cretins and those who are not who are terrific people... and again that applies to both submissives as well as dominants.
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9) Consistently breaks promises.
10) Always finds excuses for not meeting.
11) Always puts blame on others for things going wrong.
12) Does not take personal responsibility.
I can agree with these.
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13) Has bad relationships with most or all of their family members.
Not always valid as a red flag. It might be, but a person has to also ask why they have such poor relationships with their family... there are sometimes valid reasons. You wouldn't blame a person who was a victim of child abuse for not getting along with their family would you?
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14) Pressures you into doing things you do not want to do.
Disagree... this one again doesn't address the details. For example, what about someone who pressures someone to take positive action in their life, even though they don't want to? There are also some submissives who very much want to be pushed or "forced" to do kinky things they don't want or enjoy doing, its a fetish.
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15) Does not respect your limits, negotiations or contracts.
Fair enough for those using such things. Not everyone uses contracts for example, not everything is negotiated first, and some submissives want to have their limits pushed.
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16) Pushes you into a D/s relationship too fast.
I agree with this, despite disagreeing with the wording. Who defines what is too fast? But suppose someone after, say 2 years (supposing they can find a saint/fool who will wait that long) still won't commit... my advice is they should both just walk away. My point being, I disagree with the premise of this red flag. However, if two people aren't able to move at a similar pace, it probably isn't going to work.
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17) Falls in love with you way too fast and swears undying love before even meeting you.
Can't agree with this. I've known too many people who fell in love quickly and went on to have happy relationships. However, I would caution against anyone who seems to need to fall in love very quickly and/or needs a commitment very quickly.
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18) Hides behind their D/s authority and says that their authority should not be questioned.
Any dominant who makes a habit of hiding behind anything I would have questions about. However, any submissive who made a habit of questioning a dominant's authority is going to get annoying. Like so many things, ya gotta use a little common sense here.
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19) Tries to make you feel guilty for not being good enough. Says that you are not a "True" sub.
Probably could have been worded better, but basically I agree.
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20) Loses control of their emotions in arguments and regresses to yelling, name-calling and blame.
Fair enough... same applies to submissives btw.
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21) Puts you down in front of other people.
Disagree. For some this is part of humilation play. For others its just being playful. Again, this varies by a matter of degrees and depends on the individuals, so use your own judgment. If its outside your comfort zone, you can certainly say it isn't for you. However, that doesn't make it universally wrong either.
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22) Turns instantly on their friends, going from best friend to arch enemy at the drop of a hat.
23) Treats you lovingly and respectfully one day and then harshly and
accusingly the next.
Fair enough, or more simply, someone who is unstable and inconsistent in their behavior. Again, this applies as much to submissives as dominants.
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24) Goes to great lengths to get revenge on people.
Can't agree with this one, what's their motive, is their justification, etc.
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25) Lies or withholds information. Cheats on you or is overly jealous.
Two different points here. Everyone has a right to withhold personal information they are uncomfortable revealing (and in some cases they may even be required to, various legal agreements my create such a situation and they are becoming more and more common). All you can do is decide whether you are comfortable with their nondisclosure or not. Even lying isn't always a universal red flag... while I don't encourage it, there are times when a person "did the wrong thing for the right reasons." Again, use some common sense. Cheating and being overly jealous I agree are problems. Of course then we have to define what being "overly jealous" is and again are in subjective territory. Is a dominant who wants to own a slave being "overly jealous" if they are possessive (after all, they did say they wanted to own the slave)?
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26) Will not discuss what your possible future relationship could be like.
Fair enough.
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27) Tries to keep you in the dark about what might happen next in the
relationship.
Well I really have no idea what your NEXT relationship will be like, only thing I can discuss is the current one with me. LOL
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28) Does not respect your feelings, rights, or opinions.
Fine, provided you agree on these boundaries.
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29) Belittles your ideas.
Fine, unless this is your kink and you want them too....
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30) Blames you for your hurt feelings.
I'm starting to think whoever wrote this had some issues of their own.
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31) Abuses alcohol or other drugs.
Personally I agree, however, some feel that use of some or any drugs is fine. Its a personal choice, use your own judgement.
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32) Is constantly asking for large amounts of money from you or others.
I'd say this is true of anyone... but then I'd immediately get objections from domme's who demand tribute, and a debate about why male doms generally can't get tribute and are criticized if their slave(s) support them financially, etc. So really, just use your own judgement here... if you aren't comfortable supporting someone else... don't. Otherwise do what you want.
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33) Threatens suicide or other forms of self-harm.
34) Deliberately saying or doing things that result in getting themselves seriously hurt.
And recommend them for counseling.
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35) Monitors your communications (emails, phone calls, chats) with others.
Some dominants do this, some do not. By itself its not a red flag.
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36) Only interacts with you in a kinky or sexual manner as if role- playing.
Only a problem if you want more than this... for some folks, its all they want.
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37) Will not have normal everyday vanilla conversations.
Fair enough, now define "normal."
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38) Never shows you their human side. Is emotionless. Hides their vulnerability behind their D/s role.
Partly agree, partly disagree. Keep in mind many men have trouble showing emotions. Doesn't mean they are bad people, its just part of who they are. As with so many things, the real question a submissive should ask themselves is whether they are comfortable with this person... if not, maybe you should walk away.
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39) Has multiple online identities for interacting with the same communities.
While I personally dislike the practice, its not enough to condemn a person by itself. There are many people who do this, submissive as much as dominants.
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40) Disappears from communication for days or weeks at a time without explanation.
More a yellow flag than a red flag in my book. Some people may have reasons they can't discuss, although its probably going to be a rare case. So take it with other considerations before jumping to any conclusions. Again, what is the submissive (or dominant) comfortable dealing with... if it really bugs you, walk away.
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41) Is rude to public servants such as waitresses, cashiers and janitors.
To which I would add... "for no reason". There are cases where its perfectly justifiable to be harsh with a waiter or steward, etc. who is doing their job very poorly.
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42) Never says thank you, excuse me or I am sorry to anyone.
43) Harms children, the elderly or animals
Fair enough. And of course someone who harms kids or the elderly probably ought to be reported to the authorities too.
_____________________________
Padriag
A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer
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RE: Red Flags list. - 
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