Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (Full Version)

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kinkbound -> Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 6:42:52 PM)

The old rhetoric in a democracy, that the people ARE the government
and thus are ruling themselves, is as popularly accepted as it is
insane. It's quite delusional to think that when Congress bosses you
around, you really ARE in charge.

The power of the democracy myth comes from the illusion that somehow
the politicians "represent" us. Therefore, it's okay for them to do
what they do. There are many reasons why such a belief is naive, but
the one I want to mention today is the goofy idea that public opinion
dictates "government." 

The current political circus is a fine example. The establishment--
both of its faces (Republican and Democrat)--gives us ONE choice
with two names, and then pretends that this is what the people want.
The people are offered a choice between Deedledum and Deedledo, and
when they choose one, this is painted as the CONSENT of the
governed.

What is there about any of the Republican or Democratic candidates
that would make anyone actually want them to become President? The
primary reason we have heard so much about them is that the
powers-that-be have endeavored to advertise them to us.

But, there is a truly rare exception to the age-old rule of
bought-and-paid-for politics in America. His name is Ron Paul.
Lots of people really do want him to win, because they really
believe in what Dr. Paul believes in. He doesn't have to put on
a show, keep up an act, or talk out of both sides of his mouth
to cover both sides of the same issue, depending upon how the
question is asked or who's asking it.

Unlike every other candidate in either party, he really is what
his supporters want. He is who he SAYS he is, and believes what
he says he believes... and a lot of people like that. And that's
why the propaganda machine has been creating the illusion of
popular opinion for months now.

The Republican establishment and the statist media are doing
everything they can to give the impression that Ron Paul DOESN'T
MATTER because: he can't win, he's only supported by a bunch of
kooks on the internet, he's not worth talking about, etc. In short,
they are doing everything they can to convince the public that what
YOU want are the same status-quo operatives that THEY want you to
support.

The reason that BOTH faces of the authoritarian ruling class really
want to belittle and marginalize Ron Paul is that: 1) he actually
believes what he says; 2) he believes in a LOT more freedom than we
have now, and; 3) lots of people like that.

The powers-that-be must keep up the facade of public-supported tyranny
to keep their perceived legitimacy intact, and Ron Paul is the biggest
threat to that to come along in a very long time. While it is true
that constant collectivist propaganda from the media and "government"
have pushed a lot of people into believing that freedom is bad and
authoritarianism is good, far fewer people really believe this than
you might expect from watching the mainstream media. And the powers-that
-be are scared to death that the massive support Ron Paul is receiving
will mess up their well-crafted charade.

And it is for that reason I invite all of you to financially support
the campaign of Ron Paul. He probably won't win. And even if he does,
he probably won't be able to accomplish much (if anything) in the
way of "legal" reform. However, having the American people hear
from someone who actually BELIEVES in the Constitution, which
hasn't happened in a very long time, would be a very refreshing
change from the constant collectivist authoritarian tripe which
spews out of the radio and TV day in and day out. Who knows, maybe
more Americans might even start THINKING about such things.

In the daily statist propaganda (usually disguised as "reporting"),
you can just hear the underlying message dripping from the rhetoric
of both "wings" of the ruling class: "Oh no, no, NO... THIS is the
respectable spectrum of discussion! THESE are the beliefs and ideas
you're allowed to consider! THESE are the kings you're allowed to
choose from! THIS is what you're allowed to think!"

Ron Paul is way outside of the usual and accepted realm of
discussion. That's what I love about him, and why I want to see his
message rip through the bland, predictable totalitarian propaganda
of every other "candidate" currently being forced onto the American
public under the guise of "democracy."

In conclusion, today I gave my political contribution to Dr. Paul's
campaign. I didn't do this because I'm convinced he can win, but
primarily because I really want to watch the propaganda machine
choke on its own rhetoric, as a little bit of truth emerges to
pollute its persistent collectivist indoctrination message.

I encourage all of you to do the same, and to do it today:

http://www.ronpaul2008.com




Durus -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 7:48:46 PM)

       Ron Paul has long been a personal hero of mine for the good work he has done in congress. His is often the lone voice of the constitution among the demagogues. He isn't perfect in the practice of his ideology however and while I can ignore his imperfections as a Congressmen I can't as a candidate for president. I respect your decision to support him, as certainly there are multitudes of candidates that are far worse.

      There was a time when I would have supported him myself. Being a constitutionalist and an objectivist, with libertarian leanings, I respect the fundamental basis of his ideology but strongly disagree with his plan of implementation. As a nation we can not afford to have a libertarian President with little consideration for the chaos his policies would create. I do agree with the concept of “spontaneous order”, in that, order would emerge from the chaos without government intervention, but it would never get that far. Government would step in to take control with the pleading of the sheeple to egg them on. It would culminate in the greatest loss of freedom our nation has ever known and would take another civil war to get that freedom back. Our nation has been gradually indoctrinated to the belief that they can only survive if government takes care of them. They have to be slowly weaned away from the teat to being able to handle more solid food. You can’t pull a bottle away from a baby, point to a pasture full of cows, and expect him to be eating steak that night. Life just plain doesn’t work that way.

All of that is assuming he could win which he cannot.

You make many fine points in your post and I will not take pot shots at a candidate that I respect on a fundamental level. That being said I still cannot vote for the man and I hope that eventually he will do the right thing and support the Republican nominee. (Assuming it isn’t Giuliani or Huckabee…or Romney… in which case it really doesn’t matter as they truly are all democrats in all but name)

On a somewhat related note let me also say that President Bush has done more to hurt the cause of conservatism then any President in history, including Nixon, and I have no desire to see another so-called conservative of his stripe as President, even if it means saying Madame President for the next 4 years.





SugarMyChurro -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:00:25 PM)

Oh man, what a blow! There goes the Constitutionalist-Objectivist-libertarian-Leaning vote!!!

That's it, I am withdrawing my support also!

[;)]

No, actually I actively disagree with several of his policies. I have many other reasons to not support Ron Paul.

Ron Paul is to the presidency what the snowball is to hell.

Ain't gonna happen. Sorry.




Durus -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:13:25 PM)

It sure would suck to have a rational constitutionalist voting block with power. It would dash dreams of a socialist utopia anyway.




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:19:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Durus

It sure would suck to have a rational constitutionalist voting block with power. It would dash dreams of a socialist utopia anyway.


What surprises me is that people can find things more important than the constitution to vote for.






Durus -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:20:28 PM)

Like?




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:40:56 PM)



Like how it will upset things?







Durus -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 8:56:43 PM)

Should social security be stopped tomorrow? How about welfare? How about both of them while making drugs legal? Oh don’t forget to add that it would be legal to buy machine guns through the mail again. While that is going on let’s immediately remove all troops from Iraq, Korea, Germany, the Philippines, ect. Then let’s close down the FBI, the CIA, and the NIA. Don’t worry though government would step in quickly to pick up the pieces. (and every imaginable shred of power with it)

There are ways of fixing things that would allow us to survive the process. It has taken 200 years to twist the constitution into what it is today. I think it is reasonable to expect it to take more then the term of a President to fix it. That’s assuming that Ron Paul would side with the constitution instead of his libertarian ideology which he hasn’t yet done.




subfever -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 9:33:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Durus

Should social security be stopped tomorrow? How about welfare? How about both of them while making drugs legal? Oh don’t forget to add that it would be legal to buy machine guns through the mail again. While that is going on let’s immediately remove all troops from Iraq, Korea, Germany, the Philippines, ect. Then let’s close down the FBI, the CIA, and the NIA. Don’t worry though government would step in quickly to pick up the pieces. (and every imaginable shred of power with it)

There are ways of fixing things that would allow us to survive the process. It has taken 200 years to twist the constitution into what it is today. I think it is reasonable to expect it to take more then the term of a President to fix it. That’s assuming that Ron Paul would side with the constitution instead of his libertarian ideology which he hasn’t yet done.



Oh, I don't know. Aren't you being a bit of an alarmist?

Even if Paul managed to get himself elected, I have to agree with the OP that Paul wouldn't be able to get many things changed, if anything at all. However, he would get more people to think about the real issues and real change... which is the first step needed to pull the sheeple away from the teat of big government. 

How would you fix things, and which candidate do you think would be most able to implement these changes?  




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 9:37:41 PM)


You know I cant think of anything more important than protecting our constitution at any cost.

However:

The single most important thing that RP would do for this country is to expose how the people are getting screwed.

It does not matter what party is in they both sweep everything under the table.  I would lay odds that RP would make all of it headlines.

Once its headlines then the people will take over from there.  People dont fight what they dont know about.  (nau) for example.

People feel hopeless and removed from the political process in the system we have now because they are!  

There is nothing RP can do in one day and everything has to be phased in and out.

I would be surprised if he actually totally got rid the cia, nsa, fbi etc but redefine our security instead.  You want to ssee what these agencies do to us?

Take a look: 

COINTELPRO  is an acronym for a series of FBI counterintelligence programs designed to neutralize political dissidents. Although covert operations have been employed throughout FBI history

Someone had to know about this and file a freedom of information paperwork for us to even know!!!

That is good for america?   There is nothing RP can do that to make it worse than it already is.

I prefer vigilance to complacency and would rather see a machine gune slung across everyones shoulder than have our rights to bear infringed upon yes.

The framers knew what they were doing, people today just have not figured that out yet imo.

Complacency got us into the mess we are in today.

well i am assuming he will side with the constitution as well. but well worth just exposing all the fraud and anyone with guts enough to talk about the federal reserve imo has guts enough to expose the fraud.  That is worth my vote in itself.






cyberdude611 -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 9:38:28 PM)

This government needs more than policy changes, there needs to be a massive purge of politicians. There is a leadership deficit in Washington. There has been no leadership in that city since Reagan.




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 9:44:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

This government needs more than policy changes, there needs to be a massive purge of politicians. There is a leadership deficit in Washington. There has been no leadership in that city since Reagan.



I would disagree.   There is a "representative deficit" they are doing a fine job leading!  




awmslave -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 10:08:10 PM)

US needs somebody like Ron Paul for president. Regrettably most people do not understand the need for serious change in Washington.
Or if they do, they falsley belive that Ms. Clinton or Mr. Juliani would change things towards better.




Owner59 -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 10:11:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

US needs somebody like Ron Paul for president. Regrettably most people do not understand the need for serious change in Washington.
Or if they do, they falsley belive that Ms. Clinton or Mr. Juliani would change things towards better.



By all most all measures,Bill Clinton did pretty well,as did the US.Hillary could do just as well.And why not?




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 10:23:15 PM)



clinto did one thing that really stood out in his presidencey that i can appreciate and only one thing.

He released all those old secret documents that i keep scouring through that proves how naughty this country has been no one wants to see.

Hey but dont feel bad I dont have anything good to say for the ones before or after him either.




cyberdude611 -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 10:24:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

US needs somebody like Ron Paul for president. Regrettably most people do not understand the need for serious change in Washington.
Or if they do, they falsley belive that Ms. Clinton or Mr. Juliani would change things towards better.



By all most all measures,Bill Clinton did pretty well,as did the US.Hillary could do just as well.And why not?


Why not?

HillaryCare ver 2.0 is reason enough to vote against her. Our healthcare system will truely be in the crapper when she's through with it.

And what has Hillary done that qualifies her to be President? She's never ran a business. She's never done ANYTHING concerning foreign policy. She's a crooked lawyer.




SugarMyChurro -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 11:07:11 PM)

Good gravy, I hate all of the above. All lootocracy assholes, except maybe Paul. In his case, he's just too wacky to win though.




subfever -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 11:11:32 PM)




Straw Poll
Date
Rank
Votes


South Sound Ronald Reagan Republican Club, Tacoma, WA
11/01/2007
1
37.7%

Springfield Metropolitan Republican Club, Springfield, MO 
11/01/2007
1
77.3%

Laramie County GOP Straw Poll, Cheyenne, WY
10/28/2007
1
TBD

Values Voter Straw Poll, Washington, DC
10/20/2007
3
15.0%

Conservative Leadership Conference, Reno, Nevada
10/13/2007
1
33.0%

Jefferson County, Alabama Straw Poll
10/13/2007
1
57.8%

Washington State Republican Party Fall Dinner Straw Poll
10/11/2007
4
12.2%

Tulsa State Fair, Oklahoma
10/07/2007
1
41.5%

Oregon Straw Poll- Portland, Oregon
10/06/2007
1
67.0%

Gwinnett County GOP, Atlanta, Georgia
9/30/2007
1
36.2%

CWA New Jersey GOP Straw Poll
9/29/2007
1
77.0%

South Sound Ronald Reagan Republican Club, Tacoma, WA
9/26/2007
1




Real0ne -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 11:12:47 PM)


dunno man 4 mill is a lot of bones.


and there is nothing stopping people from writing him in on the ballot or not!!!







luckydog1 -> RE: Why I'm Supporting Ron Paul (11/6/2007 11:21:45 PM)

Its hard to grasp how a constitutionalist is injecting truth while rambling about our democracy.  If you read the document, you wil note that the constitution creates a republic, not a democracy....




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