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RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 6:21:18 PM   
Maya2001


Posts: 1656
Joined: 8/22/2007
From: Woodstock ONT,CANADA
Status: offline 		Yes !!!  I spent 2 years in a relationship like this which included physical and mental abuse before spousal rape was a law,  in this type of relationship there is daily fear, no trust, no saneness, no consent unless coerced, no pleasure and no respect and submission is about staying alive another day  it is nothing like consenual BDSM play.      From my POV a long sentence is definitely called for inorder to prevent him from subjecting someone else to the same or worse, with my ex-husband he went on to stab another wife several times in the chest(she survived) all because she refused to turn over her paycheck because their kids needed food on table to eat.  But the sentencing here for crimes of the same are a mockery, a couple months and did nothing to prevent him from continuing on and  damaging other. These men are not cured by jail time, they are simply put out of circulation and the longer they are put away the better.   Thankfully laws are changing  and are not defining woman as mans property allowing him the right to so whatever he wants to her aside from murder without consequence

A bit of a thread jack now.......

I am sure some of these same abusve people find their way into the BDSM community and use it as a mask and are the ones that turn up in the news  not because they are participating in BDSM but because of non censual abuse they have inflicted and in that case they need to be brought to justice as well to protect other members of the community, unfortunately when they hide here lurking for victims  in the BDSM community,  they are more likely going to get away with it because most of the victims are not going to want to go public about the BDSM lifestyles, so these guys will find newbies as excellent prey.  because many  often are so naive and in a rush to embrace the lifestyle so become willing unintentional victims who then find that their first experience is a nightmare never to return again, so all the SSC Doms out there pay the price as well because of lost subs or the reputation they end up earning because of some abusive @ss.   It is very important that we educate newbies subs/slaves (m/f)  so they understand what  they should be aware of  and can avoid getting themselves in trouble with insane non consensual abusive men who are hiding and trolling for their next victim in the guise of being a BDSM Dom/Master.because it is much easier for them to do here than in the vanilla world

    

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RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 7:50:16 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		{{{{{Lashra}}}}, thank you for sharing.
I am so sorry your family was exposed to this.
It sounds like this is more widespread than many of us realize.


_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to Lashra)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 7:55:15 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Of course men rape their wives. Probably more often than anyone imagines. Unfortunately, most of the time, it remains unreported, no one knows. It is a dirty little secret. "What will it do to the kids if I try to do anything about it?" "What will my family think?" "It's not like he hit me, he just made me have sex with him. He is my husband, I am supposed to do that, right?" Not many women will want to admit it, even to themselves. Least of all to an officer of the law, probably male.  It is easier for them to suffer in silence. After all, they married the guy right........



Wonderful post LaT.
Thank you all for sharing.
I can honestly say, I had no real idea how common this seems to be.
I am glad these topics are talked about these days, it is much harder for
evil to exist when the light is shown on it.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 7:58:35 PM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Yes, of course spousal rape happens along with other forms of abuse.
The survivors need support and have the right to take their attackers
to court.

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So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
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(in reply to MzMia)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 9:59:43 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Zensee

That's a big assertion, Aswad. Care to share a hypothetical instance when rape would be necessary?


It'd be a judgment call. Since you're asking for hypotheticals, I'd mention the usual "do or die" cases, e.g. gun to your head, or where it may save lives in some other way. Very few instances, and few people encounter them. There are others, but my point was pretty much that "never" is too absolute, even here. Not a very big assertion in my view.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 11:17:53 PM   
slavegirljoy


Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
Status: offline 		Actually, i never said that "sexual assault" can occur even when consent is given.  The comment i made, with regard to "consent", had to do with physical assault and was in response to the post by MzMia:

[quote]ORIGINAL: MzMia

The funny thing is, when I listen to the acts I was thinking many women here
would enjoy a lot of this.
 
It appears MOST of these men were attempting to get their wives to "perform" acts they
were not comfortable with, this is really fascinating.

The key word is:  CONSENTUAL

The fact is that the law considers it to be a sexual assault when no consent given or, sometimes, when the consent given and then withdrawn.  But, the whole issue of 'consent' is a slippery slope and can be a very tricky issue on both sides, especially in a marriage, where many men consider the "I do" to be, at the very least, 'implied' consent, to them having an 'all access pass' to sex with their spouse any time they want and that the right to refuse sex was withdrawn at the altar. 
 
With regards to consenting to BDSM activities, as was referenced in MzMia's post, that is a whole other can of worms that deserves it's own thread in the General Discussion forum.
 
slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavegirljoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia
The key word is:  CONSENTUAL

That would be the word, except that the law doesn't recognize a person's right to consent to being assaulted.  So, as with many of the activities that we engage in, within a consensual BDSM relationship, it is really a matter of being honest about what you really want and making sure (as sure as you can be, any way) that the person you are with is someone of character, who will honor what it is you want. 
 
slave joy
Owned property of Master David


You are saying that it is sexual assault even when consent is given?  Sorry, but that is completely wrong.  The law very specifically addresses consent or lack of it as one of the elements of the crime.

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/8/2007 11:25:05 PM   
susie


Posts: 1699
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zensee

That's a big assertion, Aswad. Care to share a hypothetical instance when rape would be necessary?


It'd be a judgment call. Since you're asking for hypotheticals, I'd mention the usual "do or die" cases, e.g. gun to your head, or where it may save lives in some other way. Very few instances, and few people encounter them. There are others, but my point was pretty much that "never" is too absolute, even here. Not a very big assertion in my view.

Health,
al-Aswad.



These are examples of why it may be necessary for someone to submit to rape. I would agree that rape is never necessary. There is no circumstance where it would be.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 12:15:12 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

These are examples of why it may be necessary for someone to submit to rape. I would agree that rape is never necessary. There is no circumstance where it would be.


I disagree, for some definition of "necessary."

And, in the example, the gun was not to the head of the victim, but the person committing it.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 12:19:10 AM   
HizBabyGirl


Posts: 97
Joined: 8/28/2007
Status: offline 		In cases where this happens then the sex is not about sex, its about control and fear and yes it can happen.

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 12:38:45 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HizBabyGirl

In cases where this happens then the sex is not about sex, its about control and fear and yes it can happen.


It can happen, it has happened and it still happens occasionally.
And on that note I, posit that compliance is no less valid as self-defense than violence.
Which concludes the point I was making; any other thoughts I might have on the topic have no bearing here.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to HizBabyGirl)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:23:57 AM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

With regards to consenting to BDSM activities, as was referenced in MzMia's post, that is a whole other can of worms that deserves it's own thread in the General Discussion forum.


Its been opened and closed several times. 
The law recognizes consent as a defense to assault (and to rape), and then creates definitions for, and exceptions to consent. 
In some cases, BDSM activities have been ramrodded into one of those excpetions whereas rugby or stickfighting  have not been.

My quibble is with blanket assertions that 'consent is never a defense to assault', or 'on cannot consent to being assaulted'. People do consent to being hit all the time, and we should be able to play by the same rules as anyone else.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 11:03:20 AM   
RealityLicks


Posts: 1615
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline 		http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4296433.stm

In the UK, only about 5-6% of accusations of rape lead to a conviction. Only 14% lead to a trial. Our country is experiencing a record low in these terms. I'm guessing that figures for spousal rape are even lower.

I know there will always be some malicious accusations but I can't really accept that 95 times in 100 there is an innocent man involved.

If you don't know the difference between Domming someone and raping them, you are a) fucked up and b) dragging all of us down with you.

(in reply to Lashra)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:13:11 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

These are examples of why it may be necessary for someone to submit to rape. I would agree that rape is never necessary. There is no circumstance where it would be.


I disagree, for some definition of "necessary."

And, in the example, the gun was not to the head of the victim, but the person committing it.

Health,
al-Aswad.



Legally, I can't imagine anyone allowing a defense of justification for a harmful violent crime.  Justification is primarily defense of self or others, harming another doesn't work.  Personally and morally, if the gun were to my head, I would die without thinking twice about it before I would cause that type of trauma and pain to another human being. 

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:39:52 PM   
brightspot


Posts: 3052
Status: offline 		Yes, and guess what???
Lesbians can rape lesbians and believe it
or not men can rape men too.
Sometimes people get raped pyschologically
too, it's not only a physical thing.
Rape is rape>>>>Period.
Missy.

< Message edited by brightspot -- 11/9/2007 10:43:58 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:43:44 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		puke. vomit. this whole thread.

Ron


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RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:45:30 PM   
brightspot


Posts: 3052
Status: offline 		Yep, puke and vomit a lot of times
follows rape.
 
Missy.

_____________________________

"Comedy is NOT Pretty!" ~Peter Nelson

But..."May at Least One person have a sense of Humor!" ~KML.

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/9/2007 10:46:40 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		I totally agree brightspot---the key word is always...NO!
If it is NOT consentual it is rape....
 
You are not entitled to sex, just because you go on a date or get married to a person.
 
I think some of these men really did not "get" that married did not mean the person was
his property, or that his wife HAD had the right to say no.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to brightspot)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? - 11/10/2007 12:05:59 AM   
JackM1


Posts: 137
Joined: 2/3/2007
Status: offline 		no is no; it doesnt matter if youve had consentsual sex in the past, or are married, if a man forces his wife(or anyone) to have sex with him and she says no or lets him know she doesnt want it and he still forces it upon her, then its RAPE. also, therse a big difference between lying there and indulging your horny spouse even though youre not really in the mood, and not wanting it at all but being forced into doing it. 

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Profile   Post #: 58
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