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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 2:16:03 PM

KaramelGoddess

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quote:

ORIGINAL: azropedntied

I know they like fish and chips ,football,tea , and very diverse in cultures . Great music , and shopping too !

*sighs*
Do us all a favour, get an Atlas or a globe and FIND Europe. Then come back and try that again.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 2:47:39 PM

MystressDream

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dusty15

My thing is that I meet a Mistress that likes this style of BDSM and for me I need to know about this so if She decides to have me as her slave I will have some knowledge of this.

You won't learn about what she wants or expects by studying anywhere. Ask her. Let her train you to do things the way she wants them done. Even in Europe it is different for everyone.

I admire you for trying to educate yourself to meet her needs and desires. However, when it comes to protocol, she is the one you need to listen to and learn from.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 2:56:04 PM

Dusty15

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Thank You Ma'am and I am going to do that but still I would like to add to what I know about the lifestyle so when someone talk about different styles and ask me what I have learn I can add my thoughts.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 2:59:19 PM

LadyLynx

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lol I can understand where he is coming from. and actually it has gotten me curious about different styles. Good Luck and I hope you keep us posted!

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 3:09:07 PM

GentleLee

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I am from "Europe", and have actually moved around a bit to see the different countries as well. Maybe there are "styles", but I think it is more the mantallity that makes the difference. But that is everywhere, not just "Europe vs. the States".

In Sweden for example it's all a show. Show of your clothes, show of your slave, show yourself of, preferably while drinking so it will be more impressionable. Not to mention that hopefully in the morning no one will notice the obvious cracks.

Holland was very organized, very open. Still an element of show off, but less friendly. A bigger difference in "station" between Master and slave.

So far Belgium seems very hushed. I haven't been to any play-parties here yet, but from my friends here it appears to be very private. What happens behind closed doors stays there.

Anyway, thats just my impressions.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 3:34:44 PM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dusty15

First I am sorry for the miss spelling.
We all know about the leather style and the Gorean Lifestyle.
I meet a Mistress that was taught and knows the leather lifestyle and she told me that she enjoys the Europen style and maybe is is about being more formal but I was looking for more about it so that I know what she is talking about. I need to ask Her more about it

"European" style is just a catch phrase from folks who think they sound all important when they claim it.

More realistic might be a question about the scene in France or Germany or England.

Even more realistic would be to limit the area even further -- the scene in London, the scene in Prague, etc.

The most realistic level though is really on the individual level.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 3:39:57 PM

Dusty15

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See when I got into the lifestyle I was very lucky to be with someone for a short time that taught me how everything came about and I learned a lot and now that I have meet someone who is very bright and knowledgeable her self it has given me that desire. See as Slaves/subs we should have a working knowledege of what a Miatress is looking for and if we as subs are listening to them they will tell us what they are looking for and if we show them that we are truely wanting to serve them we as slaves/subs will seek out that information

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 5:21:15 PM

azropedntied

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dusty drop the words ''the lifestyle " very vague , as more to the point terms like i wish to know more about the art of rope bondage for example .Mistress,FemDommes , Maitress's , Tops are not all the same and this tastes and pleasure they seek can and do run the gambit .All are not looking for the same thing .You can as suggested take protocal education and learning in service is a great start .To say i wanna know everything about D/s and bdsm in one lesson , well it can not be done as there are so many sub-parts to it all .take smaller bites from the kinky table and digest your learning retaining your new found knowlage .

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Post #: 28

RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 5:28:14 PM

azropedntied

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KaramelGoddess

quote:

ORIGINAL: azropedntied

I know they like fish and chips ,football,tea , and very diverse in cultures . Great music , and shopping too !

*sighs*
Do us all a favour, get an Atlas or a globe and FIND Europe. Then come back and try that again.

I see so they do not play or watch "football" ,cricket,have no shopping ?Europe does not have great music ?no divercity ? wow the place sure has changed .I checked the atlas and a globe and yet its in the same location its always been .

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 9:02:05 PM

spinntja

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Dusty:

I'm going to chime in with MystressDream. Things *are* different in Europe, but, as in the U.S., each different place is different in its own way. Some people in the U.S. say "European Lifestyle" to mean "British Style." Again, that means different things to different people, but in my experience it's usually some kind of recreation of Edwardian or Victorian culture. If the lady in whom you are interested has any foreign background, she might mean the style predominant in her region. Try searching for the equivalents of "dominance" and "submission" in her language and see what you find.

But in the end the only "European Style" you need to worry about is the one your Lady practices, and only she can tell you what that entails. She's going to have to train you anyway, so you might as well admit your ignorance, express a desire to learn, and enjoy yourself. (Also, don’t sign on the dotted line until you’ve had a chance to try it out first.)

MD: Please let me know what you learn. I have some (limited) experience in Central and Eastern Europe and would be happy to reciprocate.

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/12/2007 11:29:01 PM

Dusty15

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What I found out from her in a long phone call is that she is saying Victorian and some Old Guard

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 12:24:50 AM

MisPandora

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DivaDante

lol there is no such thing as "european lifestyle domination" if thats what I am reading,its another online fantasy just like some of those who state they follow "old world" domination,lol

Well, he was referencing GOR......LOL

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 12:42:33 AM

MisPandora

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MystressDream
The main differences have been the level of formality. The European lifestyle is generally much more formal than what we see in the US. Protocols are followed by everyone, and anyone stepping out of line at a public gathering is escorted to the door.

Having traveled extensively for my leather title and after, I spent time in 5 different european nations AT leather/BDSM events. *NEVER* ever was there any of this pretentiousness that you reference. The SM cafes (akin to our private dungeon spaces like the Crucible) were relaxed, to the point that there was a beer/wine bar and drinking present in aftercare areas and soft drugs in two of the five countries playspaces. Formerly holding the position of dungeonmaster for one of the Black Rose conventions, I'm acutely familiar with the American way of "posting the rules" prominently on big posters throughout the playspaces. You see none of this in Europe -- and that's across a variety of cultures (pro dom parties, het spaces, lesbian only spaces and men's blackrooms.) Interestingly, I found that the folks in all 5 countries (one event being attended by women from 15 different countries) were far more responsible personally, they showed restraint (they didn't play drunk or high and didn't need someone there to police them not to drink themselves into oblivion) and most importantly, they looked out for one another.

By far, I find that *we* are more uptight and nazi in our ways in playspaces than anything I observed in my european travels. That being said, there may be another subculture of the victorian european BDSMers that I missed and that they're the protocol snobs.....anything is possible, I suppose.

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RE: European Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 12:43:57 AM

MisPandora

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dusty15

My thing is that I meet a Mistress that likes this style of BDSM and for me I need to know about this so if She decides to have me as her slave I will have some knowledge of this.

What I fail to understand is WHY you wouldn't just ask "your mistress" rather than ask a bunch of strangers!

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 1:06:47 AM

MisPandora

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dusty15

What I found out from her in a long phone call is that she is saying Victorian and some Old Guard

Victorian, ok, I understand that.

I struggle with believing that european style domination, especially involving a femdom is "old guard". OG is a term coined here in the states referencing gay men who returned in the post WW2 era seeking out cameraderie, finding it in clubhouse bars and the biker culture. For the few men who survived the AIDS epidemic that pillaged the community, they were more apt to keep quiet the traditions and mores of their culture -- it was underground and NOT accepted. Being gay wasn't even accepted, let alone the things you did in a blackroom. You just didn't talk about it. (Secret like the missions of a Navy SEAL secret.) And women doing it? There's a handful of women I can think of who had the priviledge of breaking that male-male barrier and being mentored by actual legitimate OG practitioners (and those lesbians personally validate that they were allowed through that door back in the 70s.) Hets? No freakin way!

I'm sure if you do a search of the forums, you'll find more posts than you can shake a stick at concerning the validity of OG and folks in modern times claiming to be OG. Today, people might be doing "in a style resembling OG", but seriously, there aren't many folks left standing that can say they were part of the Wild One era, let alone folks who'd have been involved in what we do today.

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 3:15:14 AM

MsCfromMelbourne

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Dusty

When I was living in the States, I met at least one Grande Domme who claimed to "have been trained in Europe, darling".

She had a toffy New England accent and waved her hands around in what she no doubt assumed was very "European" manner

It doesn't surprise me that this lady thinks describing her style as "European" sounds somehow more glamorous than "American", "Australian" or "English"

It is the lady in question's BDSM fantasy. Please don't deflate her by saying "I asked on the net and there's no such thing as your so-called European Lifestyle!! You are deluded!!"

She is far from the only person on the net with a delightful imagination and a loose grip on reality

Instead, let her keeping making it up as she goes and pretend to be impressed. At least her imaginary "lifestyle" isn't from another planet! Count yourself lucky, dusty

< Message edited by MsCfromMelbourne -- 11/13/2007 3:16:46 AM >

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 4:54:28 AM

Oumae

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I am from Europe and I don't do European lifestyle domination I do my style Domination.....

but then I don't like tea, don't watch football ( soccer here) or cricket so maybe I'm not a "Twue" European!

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 6:24:12 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dusty15

What I found out from her in a long phone call is that she is saying Victorian and some Old Guard

Hi Dusty, if your Mistress is talking "Victorian" Then i suspect She means more of a Mistress/servant type of relationship. Victorian lifestyle was pretty much a UK affair, it was very formal with everyone knowing there place and role. Tea and meals are served in a set routine. Servants are seen and not heard, normally doing things without needing to be told. Maybe the closest role to explain it in todays terms would be that of a butler.

Looking at films about Victorian times, will give you some idea of how household staff were expected to behave.

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 9:10:10 AM

MystressDream

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

Dusty

When I was living in the States, I met at least one Grande Domme who claimed to "have been trained in Europe, darling".

She had a toffy New England accent and waved her hands around in what she no doubt assumed was very "European" manner

It doesn't surprise me that this lady thinks describing her style as "European" sounds somehow more glamorous than "American", "Australian" or "English"

It is the lady in question's BDSM fantasy. Please don't deflate her by saying "I asked on the net and there's no such thing as your so-called European Lifestyle!! You are deluded!!"

She is far from the only person on the net with a delightful imagination and a loose grip on reality

Instead, let her keeping making it up as she goes and pretend to be impressed. At least her imaginary "lifestyle" isn't from another planet! Count yourself lucky, dusty

Wow.... from these last few posts, you would think anyone who loves and ascribes to protocol is a "snob" and "living in a fantasy world". (Rather amusing when you think about how much fantasy plays into what we do)

I will NOT get into a posting war over this, however, I will take the word of the Doms we have in this area about what their M/s, D/s or BDSM lives were like as they spent a good portion of their lives in their respective areas of Europe. The high protocol events in Vienna, for example, are not the casual play parties in the dungeons. They are very formal and very beautiful.

I am not impressed with people who have just visited a few dungeons or parties in different countries, spouting off that what these people who grew up there are teaching is all fake.

I don't see a damn thing wrong with using protocol. It is beautiful to watch a slave serve a Master/Mistress using medium to high protocol. I have had the pleasure of attending a couple of high protocol dinners and throroughly enjoyed that level of service.

Contrary to what has been said here, there ARE different styles of protocol.... and there are some that are used in the higher levels of the communities in different parts of the world. Instead of being so judgemental of those who use it.... and making fun of them for it... just say it's not your "thing" and leave others to do what they enjoy. Isn't that what this is all about? Diversity, Ladies.... Don't tell a sub that his prospective Mistress is a fake and living in a fantasy world just because she enjoys and requires protocols that you think are stupid.

While most of the original Old Guard are long gone, those men trained others in their form of the lifestyle... and those trained younger men they brought in... and on, and on, and on... and the Old Guard traditions and formalities have been passed down through time. Are they the "original" Old Guard? Of course not. But, to say "nobody can be Old Guard because all of those gay men are dead" is really not true.

If "delightful imaginations" indicate we have a "loose grip on reality", then we are all a bunch of nuts. I would rather believe we are enlightened about the lifestyle we choose to lead and have the imagination to adapt it to whatever it is that we truely enjoy.

I know the Doms who are teaching the classes here and have known them for years. They are not fake. They have just grown in this lifestyle in different parts of the world, and have taken it to a level that most are not interested in. Does that make them better? No. But, does it make them fake? Again, no.

We don't know.... It is possible this woman used the terms Victorian and Old Guard because they have some similarities and she thought he could relate to them? I won't judge her based on that. I won't judge her at all, without the opportunity to sit down and talk to her about it.

I love protocol. If that makes me fake and living in a fantasy world in your eyes, so be it. Frankly, it won't slow me down, or dampen my interest in it for one minute.

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RE: Eroupen Lifestyle - 11/13/2007 9:38:02 AM

Dusty15

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Ma'am I like what you said and I can tell that you know what you are talking about. I am looking forward to what my Mistress teaches me and what she likes.

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