RE: How to keep casual, casual?

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/29/2007 7:14:52 PM

Machts

Posts: 96
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dari

quote:

I have had this happen in the past. So I am familiar with the drama of this scenario. The emotional blackmail, the tears. And later, the anger. Which is why I have so little sympathy for women who behave so here.

Ah, but do you have sympathy for the men who behave so?

It's not limited to females or males, Tops or bottoms, or signs of the zodiac. It has directly to do with the maturity (or lack of same) of the people involved.

I think it's important to know your partner, even casually. If you're involved in a casual relationship, that still doesn't absolve you of the need to get to know what your partner likes and dislikes - and what they're feeling is part of that. I guess I'm just big on communication, and if something that breaks a rule happens, then the relationship should be re-evaluated, but it doesn't necessarily spell the end of things, so long as the people involved are mature, reasonable adults.

Doms who use power as an excuse to behave this way are just as bad. But say a bottom felt that he wasn"t right to be collared by him, and he was infatuated-and would not stop pressing? Would it not be wise of her after telling him so repeatedly....To just quit playing with him?

Seriously-I did casual for a reason. Friends with benefits. I knew what they wanted,or we would not have started, I am very big on informed consent. I'm also very big on not having my chain yanked. And I've always been VERY upfront about the consequences of doing so.

When the pleasure stopped, so did the play.

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/29/2007 8:37:00 PM

brienne30

Posts: 6
Joined: 11/16/2007
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Ok, I'm new here and this is my first post, but the general theme is hitting kind of close to home for me right now (so excuse me if I'm a bit raw about it). I think the responses from everyone about being upfront and honest from the go are great. I think that if it does happen discussing it when it happens, is also wonderful advice. I agree with the double standard someone mentioned and also that subs do fall, its hard to disassociate the level of trust you need to put in someone to let them beat you to the brink and not have feelings start to grow. All of that, and humans being human, probably accounts for 80% of these types of disasters.

The other 20% I call the Mixed signal Dom Syndrome
(Disclaimer: I am not accusing you or anyone else here of doing this, don't think you did, I'm just pointing out that it does happen and does lead to these types of situations). . . .

I've witnessed many a "casual sub" get blindsided when the Toppy person starts wanting all the benefits/support of a partner, but uses the 'casual' as an excuse to not have to deal with the responsibility of having partner. It goes kind of like this:
For weeks there are bdsm sessions arranged for the pure joy of flogging and being flogged. Maybe sex, maybe not, but either way, after the planned activity ends, they go home. . . . then Toppy person starts to want to start doing more than casual play. Starts inviting bottomy one to go out to dinner, asks for advice about dealing with their boss, complains about his sister's husband's nagging habits, invites the bottom over to hang out and watch football, discusses their past girlfriends, fills them in on the highlights of theTop's11th grade class show extravaganza, takes them to this 'quaint place down by the river where we can just talk'. Whatever, but they start to throw signs of "more than casual".

The sub is either excited because they already have feelings and sees things progressing toward "relationship land" or goes along for the ride thinking nothing will come of it but then with all the talking and history being shared starts to have feelings. For a few weeks or months, the toppy one calls all the time/takes up all the social time of the sub, leans on the sub for emotional support, etc. Even if the Top repeats daily that this is casual, well the Tops actions are speaking louder than the words at this point.

So after a month or more of being 'wooed' the sub calls up and says "hey what you doing 2 Fridays from now, I got tickets for us to the big game" there is an awkward silence as the Top is in shock. Then BLAM sub is hit with "this was just supposed to be casual and I have a date tonight, so lets talk tomorrow about how we shouldn't be trying to plan for two weeks from now to do something that isn't even bdsm related"
In a nut shell, the top treats the bottom like more than casual, asks for and accepts more from the bottom than casual, but when the bottom responds with requests for the same back from the top, its "nope, this is just casual, how dare you go there"

So, again, I'm not saying you've done this at all, just that this is another scenario I've seen that leads to these situations in both bdsm and nilla worlds.

Ok, well hell, my first post got much longer than I anticipated.

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/30/2007 3:36:53 AM

Dari

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/8/2007
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quote:

say a bottom felt that he wasn"t right to be collared by him, and he was infatuated-and would not stop pressing? Would it not be wise of her after telling him so repeatedly....To just quit playing with him?

Absolutely! Maturity again. I'll point out that I don't do casual relationships. If I'm involved in playing with someone, I know them as a person before we play, and like them outside of BDSM before I ever pick up a flogger. However, as far as any relationship goes:

You set the rules and agree to them mutually when you start. Be it casual, or more serious. If one person goes beyond the boundaries of those rules, particularly by exploring emotions that were not really part of what the relationship would be, then it's time to re-examine. If you are a sub of mine, and you fall in love with me, even though I'm not in love with you, and have no intention of pursing a live in, full-time 24/7 relationship - if you can keep your emotions from causing you to act negatively and outside of the boundaries of our original agreement, I wouldn't break off the relationship. If you can't though - you're gone.

But since I do tend to care deeply about those with whom I play, I'll likely give them some time and some leeway to deal with those emotions, before throwing out an ultimatum.

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/30/2007 6:01:29 AM

batshalom

Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: brienne30

I agree with the double standard someone mentioned and also that subs do fall, its hard to disassociate the level of trust you need to put in someone to let them beat you to the brink and not have feelings start to grow. All of that, and humans being human, probably accounts for 80% of these types of disasters.

The other 20% I call the Mixed signal Dom Syndrome

<terrific illustration snipped for brevity, not for content>

Yeesh. For a first post, you did very well for yourself. I've seen this happen and experienced it a couple of time (which is why I refuse to do casual now) and you hit it dead-on. Good aim.

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/30/2007 7:48:59 AM

LivingInSin

Posts: 326
Joined: 6/12/2007
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I agree with liking and knowing the person before play. I've seen references for different options that alot I agree with. Like someone mentioned.....Just becuase you have the feeling doesn't mean you need to act on them.
I agree with being honest with whoever your with, but if being that honest can/would destroy the friendship or what not that you have-why risk it?
The other person knowing doesn't fix anything, and in many cases can cause hurt feelings. *shrugs* Don't fix something that isn't broke.

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RE: How to keep casual, casual? - 11/30/2007 8:12:19 AM

Machts

Posts: 96
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LivingInSin

I agree with liking and knowing the person before play. I've seen references for different options that alot I agree with. Like someone mentioned.....Just becuase you have the feeling doesn't mean you need to act on them.
I agree with being honest with whoever your with, but if being that honest can/would destroy the friendship or what not that you have-why risk it?
The other person knowing doesn't fix anything, and in many cases can cause hurt feelings. *shrugs* Don't fix something that isn't broke.

Trnasparency is great in an intimate and comitted relationship. In a casual one-yes......it' sometimes best to keep your feelings to yourself.

Unless it involves the play aspect. Outside of that-I think you actually need to excercise a bit more self control.

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Post #: 66