Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria

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Level -> Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/3/2007 4:13:56 PM)
VIENNA, Austria - A right-wing Austrian writer who fled to Spain after being convicted of Holocaust denial charges 15 years ago must serve his 18-month sentence, Vienna's highest court said Monday. Gerd Honsik, 67, must serve out the sentence handed down in 1992, the court said, rejecting his plea for leniency because of his age and an unspecified illness. However, the court also turned down a prosecution request to make the former fugitive serve even more time. Honsik was captured in southern Spain in August and extradited in October. He fled after being convicted of denying the existence of the Holocaust and claiming the Nazis never used gas chambers — grounds for criminal prosecution in Austria. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22084028

Termyn8or -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 12:41:43 AM)
Guess where I'm not going. T

NeedToUseYou -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 12:56:19 AM)
So, the new Nazi's are locking up those that deny the old Nazi's crimes. Some people just will never learn. added so people don't assume my belief on the subject. (I'm sure the holocaust happened, I just don't care if others don't believe it, but it's a 100% in line with the nazi viewpoint to lock up those that think differently, especially when we aren't talking of a call to violence).

GoddessMine -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 1:24:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou So, the new Nazi's are locking up those that deny the old Nazi's crimes. Some people just will never learn. added so people don't assume my belief on the subject. (I'm sure the holocaust happened, I just don't care if others don't believe it, but it's a 100% in line with the nazi viewpoint to lock up those that think differently, especially when we aren't talking of a call to violence). Wait - you're sure the Holocaust happened? Love, GM

Termyn8or -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 1:27:23 AM)
Contradictory. BTW, ever hear of Ernst Zundel ? His name got used on a website so he was jailed. T I can't go farther than that right now, when the truth is enforced at the barrel of a gun, I back off a bit unless I KNOW people want to hear about it. Not going there yet. Ernst Zundel. Maybe zundelsite.com is till up, dunno. Doesn't matter really.

Real0ne -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 1:37:02 AM)
zactly and when they have to make LAWS to enforce a version of history you can pretty much bet whatever they are trying to stick up our asses is not true. Now if you combine census data which shows about 2 - 2.5 million, along with tests done, chemical analysis on the buildings, they have found no hydrogen cyanide except in the delousing bins. The biggest dispute is over the number of "jews" claimed to have been gassed. 6 million. Personally i have no problem believing the census data, of course that would mean that germany is paying reparation s to a few million to many. i look at it from the bright side, we are already up to a million in iraq, so we should catch up soon! when did they say pullout 2013? yeah we can go for 3 million by that time!!! oh wait we use lead.

CuriousLord -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 2:25:42 AM)
..wait, what? He's.. charged because he took place in the Holocaust and now he's denying being part of it.. or is he just some unrelated guy who doesn't believe it happened..? Edit: Nevermind, I read the article. Damn. I guess free speach really isn't very free in some places. Don't get me wrong- I don't approve of what Hilter did- but it's really freaking scary that no one's allowed to say something that might be not completely condemning over every single act he's ever done. I mean, from what I've studied, he did do some good things. It's as creepy as hell if they're forcing the history books to be written certain ways by law. We have plenty of writers these days, and, let's face it, tons of storage capacity. There really is the potential to record thousands, if not millions or billions, of stories and opinions of people every year about their prospective on history. Historians in a thousand years from now really would benefit from all the different prospectives, even if discreditted ones if for no other reason than to be able to study the psycological and social motivations of the past.

Real0ne -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 3:31:01 AM)
Maybe you remember some of my posts about "revisionist" history ever since the ole rocky fellers became involved in education in this country. There is a damn good reason that so many history books brush right on by tesla and glorify einstien.

Zensee -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 3:42:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or BTW, ever hear of Ernst Zundel ? His name got used on a website so he was jailed. I'll call bullshit on that. Z.

Petronius -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 4:39:46 AM)
Nothing "new Nazi" or anything else remotely similar about the European laws on group libel. Basic thinking is that libel damages the victims. If there's an individual victim he or she can sue in civil court for damages; if there's a group of victims they can't really sue because none can prove specific damages. That's why some political entities have created criminal, and not just civil, laws around group libel. It's real simple. If you don't want to give up your life savings don't libel the woman next door as a whore with AIDS. If you do and she cleans out your savings in court, don't moan and complain that your "free speech rights" were violated. If you don't want to go to jail in a lot of countries, don't libel Jews by claiming they fake the Holocaust or Gypsies by claiming they steal babies.

joanus -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 4:50:16 AM)
How the F can you deny some thing when there is video evidance?

Real0ne -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 6:19:21 AM)
ii suppose that works equally well for jews libeling the german government. good data is sorta hard to come by for either side so if you ask me they are both pissing in the wind.

Alumbrado -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/4/2007 7:00:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Petronius Nothing "new Nazi" or anything else remotely similar about the European laws on group libel. Basic thinking is that libel damages the victims. If there's an individual victim he or she can sue in civil court for damages; if there's a group of victims they can't really sue because none can prove specific damages. That's why some political entities have created criminal, and not just civil, laws around group libel. It's real simple. If you don't want to give up your life savings don't libel the woman next door as a whore with AIDS. If you do and she cleans out your savings in court, don't moan and complain that your "free speech rights" were violated. If you don't want to go to jail in a lot of countries, don't libel Jews by claiming they fake the Holocaust or Gypsies by claiming they steal babies. And yet that piece of common sense is so hard for some folks to grasp.

Real0ne -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 2:10:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alumbrado quote: ORIGINAL: Petronius Nothing "new Nazi" or anything else remotely similar about the European laws on group libel. Basic thinking is that libel damages the victims. If there's an individual victim he or she can sue in civil court for damages; if there's a group of victims they can't really sue because none can prove specific damages. That's why some political entities have created criminal, and not just civil, laws around group libel. It's real simple. If you don't want to give up your life savings don't libel the woman next door as a whore with AIDS. If you do and she cleans out your savings in court, don't moan and complain that your "free speech rights" were violated. If you don't want to go to jail in a lot of countries, don't libel Jews by claiming they fake the Holocaust or Gypsies by claiming they steal babies. And yet that piece of common sense is so hard for some folks to grasp. precisely why its so important to protect the republic

kittinSol -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 3:03:48 PM)
Well, since Austria gave us Hitler, I think it's only fair and just that they should come down like a ton of bricks on those who deny that the holocaust ever happened. I have to ask: why would anyone wish to deny the holocaust [8\|] ? Ah, yes... because it serves their political interests... Neo-nazis, anyone?

slaveboyforyou -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 3:21:34 PM)
quote: Well, since Austria gave us Hitler, I think it's only fair and just that they should come down like a ton of bricks on those who deny that the holocaust ever happened. I have to ask: why would anyone wish to deny the holocaust [8\|] ? Ah, yes... because it serves their political interests... Neo-nazis, anyone? I don't deny the Holocaust at all, and I think that those people are absolute loons. But I believe in free speech. No one is really, honestly being hurt by someone who disbelieves the Holocaust happens. There are a great deal of historical events and science that people deny and refuse to accept. The moon landing comes to mind. I don't see Neil Armstrong suing these lunatics for libel. There are people that still believe the earth is flat, but there is no law needed to make them change their ways. The court of public opinion takes care of all of these people. They are laughed at and shunned from any real discussions. Let them stand around waving their fists and shouting their drivel from every mountain top. They only become dangerous when you force them to discuss their views underground away from public scrutiny.

kittinSol -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 3:24:25 PM)
Free speech at the cost of everything is a very american concept, I believe... In Europe (a civilised continent, all in all), people choose to not tolerate intolerance. It's a different philosophy. Since you appreciate free speech so much, be thankful for the fact that your home is in the United States, where you can exercise it to your heart's content.

slaveboyforyou -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 3:37:48 PM)
quote: Free speech at the cost of everything is a very american concept, I believe... In Europe (a civilised continent, all in all), people choose to not tolerate intolerance. It's a different philosophy. Since you appreciate free speech so much, be thankful for the fact that your home is in the United States, where you can exercise it to your heart's content. I will enjoy it. It's lauguable that you call Europe a civilized continent. The Holocaust wasn't that long ago, nor were the Stalinistic purges, the Balkan conflicts, both world wars, European colonialism, etc, etc. So be glad you live in Europe, where all your poor little feelings are kept from being hurt and you're treated like children. Europe; the nursery continent.

kittinSol -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 3:44:54 PM)
Yes, Europe has had its fair share of atrocities. And it's for that very reason that most European governments have tough laws against holocaust denials and calls to racial hatred. And yes, it is civilised, in my book, to have such laws. Not sure why you chose to retort with an insult, though. But it's alright: I note that you're feeling... huh... enthusiastic about the subject? PS: most of my father's family perished in the Holocaust, so it's a matter that is rather close to the bone for me. Another point: I actually live in the United States [;)].

slaveboyforyou -> RE: Holocaust denier goes to prison in Austria (12/18/2007 4:16:16 PM)
I wasn't being insulting. I was being sarcastic, because you indirectly implied that America was uncivilized. I assumed you meant the U.S. instead of the whole of North America, because Canada actually has laws like that. I don't find anything civilized about governments instructing adults on what they are and are not allowed to discuss and believe in.

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