Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (Full Version)

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subfever -> Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 2:41:08 PM)

"We look upon authority too often and focus over and over again,
for 30 or 40 or 50 years, as if there is something wrong with
authority. We see only the oppressive side of authority. Maybe it
comes out of our history and our background. What we don't see is
that freedom is not a concept in which people can do anything they
want, be anything they can be. Freedom is about authority. Freedom
is about the willingness of every single human being to cede to
lawful authority a great deal of discretion about what you do.
"

...Rudy Giulliani


So... freedom is about authority??? ... [sm=hewah.gif]






popeye1250 -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 3:19:10 PM)

And Rudy says he's for the Second Amendment but you still can't carry a gun (legally) in NYC.
Rudy will get a lot of the far Left's votes with that kind of thinking.




charmdpetKeira -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 3:27:34 PM)

Don't let um fool ya, freedom is death; nothing left to lose.

k




bipolarber -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 3:52:36 PM)

Yeah... it's the same old crap... Use a crisis to throw fear into the public, create a scapegoat, stir up crazed nationalisim, and then slip your puppet-dictator into office. While you are preparing for this, make sure to ignore the rule of law, and establish an "enforcer" agency to "protect the fatherland...er homeland."

Beats me why so many people still stick with the GOP... they have to be the closest thing to brownshirted jackboots America has seen since '38.




RazorJAK -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 4:17:43 PM)

Noun Verb 9/11




charmdpetKeira -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 4:28:16 PM)

Let’s be grateful to the man, for showing us his cards, and thankful we have the capability to see what he is saying for what it really is; I now have one less person to worry about considering, in deciding who I will vote for.

k.




Sanity -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 4:51:52 PM)

Do you have any proof that Rudy Giulliani actually said that, or are you just having some fun and being creative.




Sinergy -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 4:55:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Do you have any proof that Rudy Giulliani actually said that, or are you just having some fun and being creative.


From the archives of the New York Times.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A01E2D9173CF933A15750C0A962958260

Enjoy!

Sinergy




Sanity -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 5:04:02 PM)

Thank you, Sinergy. Cool... it's funny how it takes on a whole other meaning when it's put back in its original context, like a lot of things.




Termyn8or -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 5:14:01 PM)

I actually saw him make that statement on TV.

T




charmdpetKeira -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 5:52:59 PM)

The implication of “The good ole days” is just as dangerous as the message in the segmented part offered in the OP.
I'sn't the basis of a good foundation, a common goal; not common values.
k




farglebargle -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 6:23:19 PM)

Sanity,

It took about 15 seconds of googleing turned up the NYT Times link.

It would have taken LESS TIME than your rebuttal, you would have LEARNED SOMETHING, and not wasted all of our valuable time with your pointless commenting.

You COULD HAVE done that, rather than implying the original poster was dishonest in attributing the quotation.

But we already are well aware with your issues of properly attributing quotations, aren't we?

From the NYT ( should anyone still consider them a reputable source... )

quote:


We constantly present the false impression that government can solve problems that government in America was designed not to solve. Families are significantly less important in the development of children today than they were 30 or 40 years ago. Religion has less influence than it did 30 or 40 years ago. Communities don't mean what they meant 30 or 40 years ago.


Yeah, remember the "Good Old Days", when you killed an Irishman or Italian or Nigger for going into the wrong neighborhood. Thinks are really different!

quote:


As Americans, we're not sure we share values. We're sometimes even afraid to use the word values. We talk about teaching ethics in schools -- people say, "What ethics? Whose ethics? Maybe we can't." And they confuse that with teaching of religion. And we are afraid to reaffirm the basics upon which a lawful and a decent society are based. We're almost embarrassed by it.


Given that Ethics is a major branch of philosophy, encompasses right conduct and good living. I'm not sure he understands what "Teaching Ethics", is. Apparently, he understands that "Ethics" is like facility in algebra -- a learned skill, when it isn't, and not a PROCESS, which it is. You *can* teach the process, but it's pretty clear that he's not on that page.

This is the kind of poor thinking which pervades speeches Rudy reads ( because, as we know, he isn't actually writing any of this... ) but it's shameful that HE is so fucking dumb that HE doesn't catch it in rehearsal and fire the retard responsible.

I suspect he SAW Mario Cuomo actually think on his feet and represent his positions in a cogent manner, but all Rudy is able to DO is pretend he's got the same chops. Which he don't. It's sad to watch, really.

It's like Keef clicking in the Fuzztone on Satisfaction vs some kid playing Guitar Hero...

From South Park
quote:


Randy: [walks up to Stan] So you boys like this music, huh?
Kyle: Yeah, dude. It's Guitar Hero.
Butters: Stan and Kyle are really good at it.
Randy: Well you kids wanna see something really cool? [the boys pay attention] Check this out. [walks away and picks up an electric guitar, and plugs in the amplifier. He puts his right foot on top of the amplifier and begins to play "Wayward Son" a half-step up]

Once, I rose above the noise and confusion
Just to get a glimpse beyond this illusion.
I was soaring ever higher
But I flew too high.
Though my eyes could see I-

Stan: [irritated, interrupting] Dad? Dad! What are you doing?!
Randy: [brightly] I can actually play a lot of these songs on a real guitar. You want me to teach you boys how?
Cartman: Uhh, that's gay, Mr. Marsh.
Stan: Yeah, that's stupid, Dad.
Randy: But... But this is real.
Cartman: Real guitars are for old people.
Craig: Do you mind, sir? We wanna watch Stan and Kyle play. [Randy stands there a few seconds, disappointed that the boys aren't interested. He takes off the guitar, leans it against the amplifier, and walks away.]




Sanity -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 6:38:11 PM)

It's courteous to provide a credible link when posting a quote or a news story that you attributing to someone, farglebargle. Especially if you're taking what someone said out of context.




Sinergy -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 6:42:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

It's courteous to provide a credible link when posting a quote or a news story that you attributing to someone, farglebargle. Especially if you're taking what someone said out of context.


I certainly look forward to the day when you begin to provide accurate attributions and links to your statements.

Sinergy




farglebargle -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 6:45:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

It's courteous to provide a credible link when posting a quote or a news story that you attributing to someone, farglebargle. Especially if you're taking what someone said out of context.


LOL




Sanity -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 6:59:17 PM)

When I post quotes or news articles I habitually post credible links to go with them, Sinergy.



quote:



I certainly look forward to the day when you begin to provide accurate attributions and links to your statements.

Sinergy





TheHeretic -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 7:07:05 PM)

       Thanks for the link, Sinergy.  March 20th, 1994.  Right after Rudy had assumed the helm of an "ungovernable" city.  Asses needed to be kicked.  Rudy kicked them.  The house needed a serious cleaning.  Rudy made it happen (I hear he even bought some of those shovels that stand up by themselves for the pothole crews).


       The "30-40-50" in the OP snip puzzled me.  Here is the opening line of the speech as transcribed by the Times...
      We constantly present the false impression that government can solve problems that government in America was designed not to solve. Families are significantly less important in the development of children today than they were 30 or 40 years ago. Religion has less influence than it did 30 or 40 years ago. Communities don't mean what they meant 30 or 40 years ago.  

       When you have chaos, I damn well want to hear someone talking about order.  And the job got done.

        For those who wish to continue shrieking about fascism, let me offer you this simple truth of the Giuliani administration in NYC.  The squegeemen and muggers didn't survive, but Farglebargle did.  I can vote for that.
    




Sanity -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 7:17:39 PM)

I didn't notice that difference...

What do you know.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
      The "30-40-50" in the OP snip puzzled me.  Here is the opening line of the speech as transcribed by the Times...




luckydog1 -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 7:33:28 PM)

So do any of you actually think there is freedom in Anarchy?  Anarchy is what you have if there is no authority.  I realise that several of the anti Rudy posters want to see the USA destroyed for various reasons.  I see absolutly nothing wrong with saying people must obey the laws created through our democratic process.  Other than wanting to see the elimination of the USA, what reasons do you anti Rudy folks have for wanting the elimination of autority?




Stephann -> RE: Fascists Unite! Here's Your Man... (12/5/2007 7:37:28 PM)

So, I thought I'd share part of the speech that follows the OP

"At the core the struggle is philosophical. There are many, many things that can be done in law enforcement to protect us better. There are many things that can done to create a government that is more responsive and more helpful. The fact is that we're fooling people if we suggest to them the solutions to these very, very deep-seated problems are going to be found in government....

... That in fact the criminal act is about individual responsibility and the building of the respect for the law and ethics is also a matter of individual responsibility."

- R.Giulliani

From this bit, sounds like someone I could stand behind.  I don't see him passing out armbands anywhere.

Here's some other sage advice, though:

"Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose,
Nothing don't mean nothing honey if it ain't free, now now.
And feeling good was easy, Lord, when he sang the blues,
You know feeling good was good enough for me,
Good enough for me and my Bobby McGee."

Stephan Joplin




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