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Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 7:32:37 PM   
Mandalin


Posts: 103
Joined: 2/7/2005
Status: offline 		Well, since I've been looking for more information on Amish animal milling, I've found quite a bit of other things as well. This is one of them, and if you have a pet and feed it Iams, you need to know this and watch the video. The site is:

www.Iamscruelty.com

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 7:58:01 PM   
DesertRat


Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline 		Shit...I mean SHIT!!! Now I have to find something else to feed Otis and Daisy. I'll be returning my unopened bag of Iam's to WalMart tomorrow. My vet sells their premium Eukanuba brand, so I'll be talking to those folks tomorrow.

Thank you, Mandalin. I was so happy and proud of myself for giving my buddies the "good stuff". Now I am less happy than I was 30 minutes ago, but glad to know about this. Kinda pissed.

Bob

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 8:06:25 PM   
perverseangelic


Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline 		I don't like that site because it's run by PETA, and they have some serious problems.

That said, the information, as far as I've researched, is accurate. Which sucks. I'm sad because Eukanuba didn't -used- to be part of Iams. :(

I feed Science Diet, which isn't -amazing- but has no biproducts or feet or beaks and is primarially meat and largely human grade materials. Ideally, I'd feed my kitties raw, but that's more money than I can afford right now

Incedentally: Inova, Chicken Soup, Royal Canaan and Wellness are all REALLY good brands to feed. Human grade, not animal tested (in the bad way. They do in-home test) Also quite pricey. I can't personaly afford them. But good alternatives.

< Message edited by perverseangelic -- 8/15/2005 8:08:14 PM >

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 8:41:54 PM   
Mandalin


Posts: 103
Joined: 2/7/2005
Status: offline 		Well if you think that was bad, after further digging around, I found this....

www.peta.org/feat/military/

Animal testing in the military

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 8:52:48 PM   
perverseangelic


Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mandalin

Well if you think that was bad, after further digging around, I found this....

www.peta.org/feat/military/

Animal testing in the military


PETA still ain't my friend. IMHO, they are, in their own way, doing as much damage to animals and animal life as are those who test on animals.

THe founder of PETA believes that all pit breeds should be killed out of hand. ~sigh~

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 9:06:19 PM   
FelinePersuasion


Posts: 4792
Joined: 11/20/2004
Status: offline 		you know half the major ingrediants in Science diet is fillers and junk. Dogs are not ment to be able to digest wh*ole grains and stuff, and the very first ingrediant in science diet is whole grains and fillers

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 9:52:59 PM   
subversiveone


Posts: 332
Joined: 4/20/2005
From: Daddy's Lap
Status: offline 		Natural Life Pet Products is a great place Bob or Wysong, Innova and California Natural. I've researched all of these in past and found them to be very healthy. The information on http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d=comp-wiz is very interesting!

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/15/2005 10:06:55 PM   
perverseangelic


Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline 		I miss spoke before. I always mix the two up, because for some reason Nutro Natural Balance and Science diet sound alike. Don't ask me. Every time I say what I feed my cats I have to go check the back.

And you're right, there -are- a lot of things in Natural Choice that aren't great. However, the first (and most prevelant) ingrediant is meat, and the grain fillers that are put in are largely rice, which is by far the most digestable and best nutrionally for cats.

Also, as far as I've been able to find out, the quality of meat and vegetables put into Natural Choice is either human grade, or one step below (Which is, I think, feed grade, which means bruised or banged up but not rotten or spoiled in any way. I could be wrong about the name though.)

With my cats I did my research. I foudn the best food that I could afford and still give them regualar vet care and make sure they have a house. Basically, my cats eat the same quality of food I do--day old, discounted stuff, but stuff that won't hurt them and seems to taste pretty good.

I figure when I make more I can feed us all better.

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 5:23:34 AM   
DesertRat


Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: perverseangelic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mandalin

Well if you think that was bad, after further digging around, I found this....

www.peta.org/feat/military/

Animal testing in the military


PETA still ain't my friend. IMHO, they are, in their own way, doing as much damage to animals and animal life as are those who test on animals.

THe founder of PETA believes that all pit breeds should be killed out of hand. ~sigh~


Wow...sometimes I think that too. Probably because I live in a supermacho state where pit bulls and rots are more likely to be raised to be aggressive. Dogfighting is pretty popular here in Bumfuck, NM. Also might be because my ex-wife was attacked by a pit bull. As long as they were treated humanely prior to and during the euthanization, I am not sure I would object to eliminating those breeds.

Bob

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 5:28:31 AM   
ModeratorOne


Posts: 935
Status: offline 		If you are into cooking, home cooked diets for pets are great and you know exactly what's in them. If you don't have the time, energy, lack of cooking skills or whatever reason, Wellness and Merrick are great options with excellent high quality ingredients.

I will also point out that if you do decide to go with a home cooked diet, please research it very carefully as many of the recipes floating around on the internet are not always ideal. It also is a good idea to work with a veterinary nutritionist to formulate a custom diet for your pet, especially if they have any other medical conditions.

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 5:50:53 AM   
DesertRat


Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline 		I will be doing some research to determine if there are any widely available (e.g., sold at WalMart) brands that are both healthy and not supportive of cruel testing methods.

Anybody know of any?

Bob

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 6:58:40 AM   
ChereeAmoor


Posts: 185
Joined: 8/1/2005
Status: offline 		I feed my dogs rice and meat and whatever is left over from our own supper. So far, they haven't complained! *smile* Why get hung up over dog foods? They didn't even exist 50 years ago! Go with the common sense diet and see how that works.

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 7:09:00 AM   
happypervert


Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline 		The folks at PETA are crackpots. Can you believe they even take credit for this letter to Arafat complaining about using a donkey in a bombing; I hope they're happier with human suicide bombers.

Perhaps they'll put me on their website because I torture my cats every day by feeding them IAMS cat food. The one cat is a gross experiment of what stuffing his face will do as he is a bloated orange blob waddling around! And the other suffers gastric distress as shown by when she barfs up hairballs all over my house. The HORRORS!!!!!

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 8:25:18 AM   
DesertRat


Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline 		I've heard people call PETA a crackpot organization, but I have also heard people say that about the ACLU and the Sierra Club. They seem okay to me. I think you misunderstood the original posting. It's not saying the food is bad; just that the animals subject to testing in contractor's labs are mistreated.

Bob

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 9:06:15 AM   
perverseangelic


Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertRat

quote:

ORIGINAL: perverseangelic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mandalin

Well if you think that was bad, after further digging around, I found this....

www.peta.org/feat/military/

Animal testing in the military


PETA still ain't my friend. IMHO, they are, in their own way, doing as much damage to animals and animal life as are those who test on animals.

THe founder of PETA believes that all pit breeds should be killed out of hand. ~sigh~


Wow...sometimes I think that too. Probably because I live in a supermacho state where pit bulls and rots are more likely to be raised to be aggressive. Dogfighting is pretty popular here in Bumfuck, NM. Also might be because my ex-wife was attacked by a pit bull. As long as they were treated humanely prior to and during the euthanization, I am not sure I would object to eliminating those breeds.

Bob



Objecting to individual dogs, though, shouldn't mean objecting to the entire breed. I object to the way peopple raise many dogs, and wish there were a liscencing process for pet owners. I have been bit, repeadtly by chihuahuas and franky dislike the little buggers. However, I try to remember that it's the -dog- and the way the dog was raised.

Plus "pit breed" isn't a defined category. Under law in california it means "Any dog who looks like what the arresting officer things a pit looks like. or has a mother that looks like what the officer thinks a pit should look like or has pit ANYWHERE in its lineage." I've known of largely lab mixes being put down as "pits' in Ontario (home of one of the worst breed bans ever)

I can understand your anger about the dogs being raised to be mean, but that's just it. They were -raised- to be mean. They aren't innately mean. To euthanize the whole mess o' breeds means getting rid of the wonderufl family pets that have lived for years and wouldn't hurt anything or anyone as well as the poor critters taught to fight.


This isn't actually what lost PETA my respect though. Their flyer "Your Mommy Kills Animals" and the fact that they handed it out at both "disney on ice" and "a christman carol" to -kids- killed it for me.

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 9:19:34 AM   
cellogrrlMK


Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertRat

I've heard people call PETA a crackpot organization, but I have also heard people say that about the ACLU and the Sierra Club. They seem okay to me. I think you misunderstood the original posting. It's not saying the food is bad; just that the animals subject to testing in contractor's labs are mistreated.

Bob


PETA IS a bunch of crackpots... besides the pit bull killing thing, they feel that we are all keeping our animals "in bondage" (pardon the term) by imprisoning them in our homes as pets. As someone who was heavily involved in the cat fancy for 14 years I've seen what PETA is capable of, and they do more harm than good.

That being said, I just wrote to the Iams Company. I don't know if their facility is in Dayton, OH or if that is just the corporate address, but I am waiting the hear what they have to say, as well as their response to my inquiry about a tour of their facilities.

My cats have thrived on Iams products since 1986. Science Diet gives them the runs, they hate Nutro, Pro-Plan makes them barf. Dammit...

One little suggestion to everyone who plans on changing their pets' diets.... DO NOT just change their food! As much as you don't want to, the best way to change the diet is over time, mixing the new food with the Iams and gradually changing the ratio until there is no more Iams. It is easier on their digestive systems and saves you from cleaning up all the diarrhea and barf that will ensue from a radical diet change.

cello

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 9:35:37 AM   
kyakitten


Posts: 145
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cellogrrlMK

PETA IS a bunch of crackpots...


Cello - this isn't meant personally - but in terms of PETA, I've seen a lot of animal lovers dismiss them summarily like this. It just contributes to a general culture of disrespect for different thinking (which includes animal welfare as well as WIITWD).

There's a convincing argument to be made that animal rights extremists are what make the animal welfare movement's demands look "reasonable" and middle-ground. I for one am grateful PETA exists even though I often disagree with their tactics or views.


< Message edited by kyakitten -- 10/5/2005 9:26:18 PM >

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 9:40:58 AM   
cellogrrlMK


Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline 		Liana, you are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. I have seen kittens die as a result of PETA members' rabid incompetence and narrow-mindedness. Nothing anyone can say about PETA will change my mind.

There is a big difference between animal-welfare groups and animal-rights activists.

cello

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 9:52:53 AM   
kyakitten


Posts: 145
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline 		PETA is not the problem, just a convenient lightning rod.


< Message edited by kyakitten -- 10/5/2005 9:25:08 PM >

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RE: Iams animal testing - 8/16/2005 10:28:24 AM   
quietkitten


Posts: 1082
Joined: 2/5/2005
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline 		I make my own food for both my cats and my dog.
It started when my puppy was poisoned and now has a serious liver disorder. She needs very specific foods and it is easier cheaper and safer to just make my own for her.

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