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am I wot? - 12/8/2007 10:45:09 PM

kirby104

Posts: 94
Joined: 6/6/2005
Status: offline

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

< Message edited by kirby104 -- 12/8/2007 10:46:05 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: am I wot? - 12/8/2007 10:50:38 PM

MissMagnolia

Posts: 3636
Status: offline

I have no idea who told you this drivel, but I would look inside your own heart for your answers, not the mouth of someone who isnt YOU.

Think of what you need, want and and have to offer to someone else, before you start to put labels on yourself.

No one else can tell you what you are. Only you know that.

_____________________________

if at first you dont succeed..then skydiving isnt for you

Resident Whip Cracker AND Resident Orbs Of Joy.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 2

RE: am I wot? - 12/8/2007 10:53:23 PM

CalifChick

Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment.

And did this person get their psych license out of a crackerjack box? Do you know more than, oh, say TWO people who did NOT grow up in a dysfunctional environment???

quote:

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent.

Your statement makes no sense... A does not equal B. It is not better nor worse to be a slave, and to be a slave does not mean you must remain silent.

quote:

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

Maybe you need to spend some time exploring why being a sub upsets you.

quote:

Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Then keep looking, YOU are wasting YOUR time on people who do not respect that you have medical issues.

quote:

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

Of course you can fight to find your way. Join the club, the secret handshake is easy to remember.

Cali

_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 3

RE: am I wot? - 12/8/2007 11:03:22 PM

decstorm37

Posts: 95
Joined: 11/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

I have to ask why do you think to be a slave you must remain silent? Any Dom worth you would want input from you. Most Dom's i have talked to don't want a doormat so to speak. For me and i can only speak for me. Is this even though i'm a slave my Master likes that we can talk about everything.

Don't let anyone tell you what you are or are not. Only you can make that decision for your self. Good luck take your time. As for the medical reasons any good Dom will work around those.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 4

RE: am I wot? - 12/8/2007 11:10:18 PM

Elorin

Posts: 970
Joined: 8/22/2004
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline

You can absolutely fight for a place in the lifestyle. Work yourself out first, figure out what you want and enjoy. We'll wait, I promise.

_____________________________

'cause when i look down /i just miss all the good stuff / when i look up / i just trip over things

(in reply to decstorm37)

Post #: 5

RE: am I wot? - 12/8/2007 11:18:42 PM

marsneedswomen

Posts: 98
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline

First, if a Dominant wants unconditional use of you they aren't much of a Dominant. Your limits are YOUR limits and if they can't accept them then they are not the Dominant for you or ever will be.

(in reply to decstorm37)

Post #: 6

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 12:24:06 AM

TemptingNviceSub

Posts: 3054
Joined: 10/1/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

For every hand there is a glove....Tempting

_____________________________

I have greatly enjoyed the second blooming...suddenly you find at the age of 50, that a whole new life has opened before you.........Agatha Christie.

You must make tracks into the unknown~~Thoreau

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 7

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 1:50:40 AM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

The only person that knows what your role is, if any, is you. Arm chair psychology that is deprecating is merely self-important behavior and has nothing to do with you but the insecurities of the person giving that advice. It would seem you need to look at why you are in the lifestyle, what role you seek to have in the lifestyle and what type of relationship you need/desire. If you decide that you have a role here and desire to fulfill that role be true to what you want and need and patient in your search to find it.

good luck,
l

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 8

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 3:27:09 AM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

I agree with whoever called this "drivel".

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

So, you're a switch?

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

Why?

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

As the lovely tempting said, for every hand......... Forget the labels, find out who and what you are, then find someone/s that fits.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

Only you can answer that one.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 9

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 5:24:10 AM

Owner4SexSlave

Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

Dearest Kirby,

I have seen a number of your posts to the message board, and my heart goes out to you each and every time I read them.

Don't think for a moment you have to fight for a place in the lifestyle, you are not wasting your time or others.

Any open minded experienced BDSMer in this lifestyle, knows damn well that Labels are just a general guideline. That is if they are Socially experienced in interacting with other people in this lifestyle.   Some people live as islands unto themselves for years, so they remain ignorant of the world.

Some people think in terms of top/bottom/switch, others in terms of Dom/sub/slave/switch.

I notice you use the words "top" and "bottom" in your posts. However, these labels do not define a persons personality.

I know two staight female submissives that are into topping other submissive females. Basically S&M and play without the sexual aspects coming into play. Still both these girls are submissive in terms of Real Time long term relationships. This is the core of what they are all about.

Now, I've encountered a number of masochistic sub/slave girls that also have a sadistic streak in them.   However, they don't want to control anybody. They don't want to be the one in charge of a relationship.   They want to fully submit to another human being.

I do not use "top" or "bottom" as a label to hang on myself.   Personally, these labels could not fucking define my role in BDSM land very well.    However, the DOM label best defines me.

I have my own maso streak! Basically, I will allow somebody to top me in play, within reason and limits. I also, will top from the bottom most of the time as well. Meaning, I will be on the recieving end of some painful S&M play, however this does not change the relationship power dynamics one damn bit.   Plus, I don't allow anybody to do whatever they so damn well please with me.   There is no way, I humanly could be a slave to any Domme.

Now, I might let a Domme take a flogger and beat the fuck out of my back. Hell, I'd let her take her nails rack my skin really hard, to the point I bleed.   Yes, Dare I even admit it, If I'm in an extreme Maso Mood and I might even let her burn me with a cigerettee too.   When I'm in a Maso mode, I love pain.   However, spanking my ass, that's a limit. Somebody wanting to collar me and walk me around on a leash, fuck all, that's not happening either.   Actually, I hate any activitity that places me mentally/physically into a submissive role.

With that said, I too enjoy top and bottom roles. Hell, I love recieving massages too (that's very bottom thing).

I wish I knew more about what being a TOP or BOTTOM actually means to your Kirby.   I wish I knew how you relate to what a sub, slave, switch, Domme, Dom, Master, Mistress and all these labels mean to you.

I get the impression that you are a D/s relationship submissive, and a bedroom kink switch.   I don't know what to actually think of you, because you keep talking in terms of "top" and "bottom".

Ok, you could label yourself as the one of the following...

Submissive
With sadistic and Masochistic streaks for Switch S&M topping and bottom play. Seeking a Dom for a D/s relationship. Not a slave. Not seeking TPE.
Switch
With sadistic and Masochistic streaks for Switch S&M topping and bottom play. Seeking a Dom for a D/s relationship. Not a slave. Not Seeking TPE.

You don't have to be a treated like slave to be submissive. Basically sounds like you have encountered those who want to own a slave. I can tell already you are not into the TPE (total power exchange) game.

By the way, there are plenty of ego-centric submissives running around, so don't worry about that either. The issue you are having is not if you are submissive or not. It's the level of power exchange. TPE, not for you.

Don't worry about it too much, because there are other submissves/slaves that have wicked sadistic streaks like you do.

Most of all, don't let the assholes telling you that you don't belong because you are not being a TRUE TPE Slave girl.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 10

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 5:36:55 AM

TysGalilah

Posts: 589
Joined: 11/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

Kirby
I often times don't feel like I "fit" into any of the relationship categories that are being talked about on the mssg board or by others. Doesn't mean I don't belong here. I have several people I talk with that remind me to stop trying to "fit" into other peoples criteria for themselves, and make my own path if I need to.

Find what answers are your own, live fully and be genuine and true to yourself : ) whatever that may be.

_____________________________

galilah

.."There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. " Edith Wharton

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 11

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 5:48:12 AM

Dari

Posts: 192
Joined: 10/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

You can be a sadistic bottom, or a masochistic top. You can be both sadist and masochist without regard to whether you are top or bottom. Don't let labels and what is "common" or at least more common to find on these boards define you in your BDSM, any more than you would allow it in your vanilla life.

Whether you're too selfish to be in a relationship or not, that doesn't have anything to do with whether you are D or sub. It's a personal issue, and coupled with your dysfunctional upbringing, should be worked through with a competent therapist (for example, someone who isn't the person that gave you this ridiculous advice, unless there's more that was said or meant that you're not stating here).

Being a slave doesn't mean you have to be silent - though I question your desire to be silent at all. It sounds more like you're afraid of really telling someone what's going on in your head, or that you don't know what's actually going on beyond knowing that you're full of mental and emotional turmoil. If that's the case, you're not going to be happy long-term with silence, because you'll just be ignoring the things that will eventually start to bother you.

Slaves without limits is a difficult thing to find, no matter how many people say they want it. Ignore those who bullshit about how "real slaves" don't have limits - that's such a line.

Sounds from your post like you need to figure out some issues that aren't related to BDSM, really. Figuring those out will help you be who you want to be - whether that's Dom(me) or sub. And not just figure out who you want to be, but allow you to be happy with your choice (since if thinking of being submissive upsets you, that's a whole different issue there).

Spend some time getting to know yourself. Find a competent therapist. Work through your issues, and figure out who you are. When you do all this, find your place in the lifestyle - if it's what you want, which it sounds like it is, then it's worth fulfilling that part of you, absolutely.

(in reply to TysGalilah)

Post #: 12

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 5:52:45 AM

sambamanslilgirl

Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

after being told all that, what do you have to say about yourself?

stop listening to what others have to say about you instead listen to you have to say about yourself. you're the only one walking in your shoes ...not them.

_____________________________

...2011 - year of the fabulous rock star life ...and i do it so well...

...announcing Mr. & Mrs. British Petrol ...yeah, marrying into oil is slick business...

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 13

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 7:10:51 AM

Slavetrainer2007

Posts: 231
Joined: 12/2/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kirby104

I had identified as a submissive for around ten years. Now I have been told I am not a submissive because I grew up in a dysfunctional enviroment. All I knew since pre-school was that I wanted to be pleasing. I was told that the desire to be pleasing stemmed from the wrong motives.

Presently, I don't bottom nor do I top. I think of being sadistic as while as being masochistic.

I seem to be too selfish and ego-centric to be in a relationship. I still have dreams of being submissive even though it upsets me.

It seems better to be a slave, for then I must remain silent. But I am unable to do that either because Dom/mes want their way without any limits or they state don't waste their time. I have limits due to medical issues.

Can I fight for a place in the lifestyle or am I just wasting my time and others.

Perhaps you are looking at this the wrong way. You are trying to fit in to what others you have talked too tell you. But that is their version, that is how they live, that is their beliefs. The amazing thing about the BDSM lifestyle is its openess. Thier are no rules and labels that define who we are or, who we should be, or how we act here.

We label ourselves. Its human nature to do so. When others label you they label you to identify you according to their definations. If you label yourself as a slave, they will naturally use their defination of a slave. They will use the defination of what a slave is to them. And to many that is no limits( or very few) , no control even over the littlest things.

Alot of people are submissive and dominant for different reasons. Most are naturally that way. Hardwired to be that way. Some have to be dom at work all the time and dont want be leader at home. Some are Dom because they have had to be in a leadership role and now it just fits here. the same goes with submission.

Using the same logic someone used on you. I could say unmentionable A watched their dad beat their mom in a drunken rage . When they got older, they learned in college that they like to be spanked and whipped and the reason they like it is because of that experience when they was younger. Which could be completely wrong. They may like the sensation. the light pain may be a turn on , they might think of it as being naughty again a turn on. The list goes on and on. I can think of 100 reasons why they might like it even though i know what they experienced when younger.

You could of been in a "Leave it to Beaver" household and still turned out to like all of what you do now. at the same time, growing up can have an effect on you. For example, i will use a personal experience. My father loved sports. In fact to much. if the game ( any game not just the big ones)was on no one was allowed to make noise or talk to him till the commericals. One day my dad was suppose to take me fishing ( i was about 10) but the game came on and he told me no he was watching the game. He had promised me a week earlier he would take me and i was looking forward to it all week. because of how he was about his sports, I hate sports. I am one of the few guys that hates all sports. And i honestly believe it is for that reason.

So while your past may help define how you are now, it isnt necessarily the reason you are that way.

In my opinion, here is what you should do:
you should define your interest, what you are looking for in a relationship, what is negotiable, and what is definately not( limits) and then find someone that meets that. Dont worry about if your sub switch or slave. In the grand scheme of things the label doesnt matter. Personally, if you have to label yourself i would label myself as a submissive. As a slave is a submissive too but a submissive is not necessarily a slave, according to most peoples definations. if you feel like a switch sometimes , i would still go with submissive. I would only go with switch if you feel you must switch with a dom you are subbing too and topping is something you want or need to do often.

And the seraching is no different than in a nilla relationship and since you are adding the complexity of BDSM and all the kinks and interest in it, it may even take longer and you may go through more people. But you will eventually find what you are looking for.

_____________________________

Life is given, Everything else is earned.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 14

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 7:16:11 AM

MissSCD

Posts: 1185
Joined: 3/10/2007
Status: offline

You sure won't find the answer on a message board. As a matter of fact, you will be more confused.
Until, you get out there and see for sure, you will never know.
We all have Dom and sub traits. It is just a matter of finding the right relationship for you to be in. We put too much on labels and not relationships sometimes.
Best of luck.

Regards, MissSCD

(in reply to Slavetrainer2007)

Post #: 15

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 7:57:05 AM

Owner4SexSlave

Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

OH hell, just pack up your toys, I'll pack up mine... let's meet at some Hotel half way from one another. Figure out what works and does not. If you don't like what's going on tell me, I'll do the same.

We could also use soft limits about like trading cards, I'll let you X to me, if you let me do Y to you.

LOL... I'm being a bit of a smart ass. But this is actually how simple you can keep it.

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 16

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 8:07:21 AM

ghitaPVH

Posts: 1363
Joined: 11/14/2007
Status: offline

Kirby, Im confuzed, and a bit concerned I might add....

As far as I know, Im think only one answering so far on this thread that knows you personally, although I have to admit that most of what I know or your personality has come second hand....you never have been one for saying much...grins...

~~compleatly just had to edit my post as I just noticed a MASSIVE profile change~~~~

uhm...all I can say Kirby, is I have no idea whats going on...but screw whoever tried to fit you into their labels...Ive met you, Ive chatted with you, and honestly the only label Id ever give you would be that your a really great person. Send me an email at the other side if youd like to chat more...

ghita

PS: Will we be seeing you at the New Years party?

< Message edited by ghitaPVH -- 12/9/2007 8:12:43 AM >

_____________________________

Don't expect anything of me and I promise I'll never disappoint you.

"The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything. --Nietzsche"

(in reply to MissSCD)

Post #: 17

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 8:31:53 AM

stella41b

Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline

You know I just think it's a sad reflection on the community as a whole that all what many can do for others is just judge them on the basis of their own self-interests or just pass comments and just keep walking on, and there are very few nowadays who are prepared to go out of their way to help anyone.

I'm not talking about everyone here.. it's just a passing observation on my part, and I do know and am aware that there are many good people among us here on the boards.. I'm just expressing an opinion not maied at anyone in particular..

We read OP's like this all the time. The OP is telling is that there's a problem which they need help with. So what do we do? Some of us respond and tell the OP that they've got a problem. Wow! How observant. Okay, maybe it's not the thing to be done online, and maybe it is a deep and complicated issue. But why is it always that so few stop to think that maybe, unlike them, the poster might not have anyone close to them in their lives who can help them and maybe that is why they are coming here and looking for help?

Not all of us are photoimage perfect or come from happy families or backgrounds.. some of our backgrounds didn't look quite so much as The Waltons or Little House On The Prairie but rather more The Addams Family or much worse.

It's very clear to me from the OP that all this poster needs is someone to take a little time and maybe offer a little validation or give their opinion in the right context, if only to offer a little reassurance and help someone find their self-confidence and adjust their self-esteem. We're hardly talking professional clinical psychology or psychotherapy here, or are we?

Therefore I'll do the same as ghitaPVH and make myself available and if the OP wishes she's very welcome to PM me on the other side and without making any promises I'll see what I can do to help.

< Message edited by stella41b -- 12/9/2007 8:38:14 AM >

_____________________________

CM's Resident Lyricist
also Facebook
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(in reply to ghitaPVH)

Post #: 18

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 8:33:51 AM

TMaster2

Posts: 194
Joined: 2/25/2006
Status: offline

Know-it-alls are a dime a dozen, both here on CM and in RL, so the only time you're wasting is yours when you listen to them. As many here have already said, feel yourself, your needs, you limitations, and go with them. These can all be moved as you work your way through any real relationship, so if someone says you can't, get out of that one and find one wherein you can. Growth is important, change is important, limits are real (albeit sometimes moving targets.) Find what is you and don't pay any attention to those who feel they are in charge of your thoughts -- their's need some looking after, IMO.

< Message edited by TMaster2 -- 12/9/2007 8:35:15 AM >

(in reply to ghitaPVH)

Post #: 19

RE: am I wot? - 12/9/2007 8:51:22 AM

arayofsunshine55

Posts: 545
Joined: 8/1/2004
From: San Francisco, CA
Status: offline

You can find someone compatible if you can use your mind and are willing to sift through the many with a differing and incompatible point of view. Expect that and you might have a less difficult time of it. If you don't know your own head, and can be swayed by any drivel someone spouts at you, you will have a by far more difficult time, or worse, find yourself with someone incompatible.

_____________________________

Sunshine

Is it not most transformative, most earthshaking, to pierce the veils of self-deception and illusion, and crack the eggshell of ignorance, to most intimately encounter oneself? Lama Surya Das

(in reply to kirby104)

Post #: 20

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