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RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 6:19:31 PM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: takenbyjohnr07

about a sub/slave who acts bratty on purpose or who tries to get in trouble on purpose? Do You ever feel that they are in more control than You are when they do this?

I think if that's the dynamic the two enjoy, by all means. But the dominant isn't going to get any sympthy from me if the submissive does her usual behavior and for some reason it upsets him.

Some dominants like having a "reason" to spank or otherwise punish. In those cases, the sub/slave is serving by providing the reason. It's not a dynamic I'm comfortable with so it isn't the one I'm in.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 21

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 7:28:23 PM

Elorin

Posts: 970
Joined: 8/22/2004
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: takenbyjohnr07
about a sub/slave who acts bratty on purpose or who tries to get in trouble on purpose? Do You ever feel that they are in more control than You are when they do this?

I think that it is something I need to negotiate at the beginning of the relationship.
I LOVE subs with spunk, attitude, and sauciness. I have no problem with someone who occasionally talks back. And with a sub like that who understands that PUNISHMENT is bad (and I will attempt to make it something you will not EVER want to have me do to you again), I've no problem with giving a swat on the ass or twist of a nipple in return for a saucy comment.

However, if you want to play, then say so. Do NOT start sassing me back to get me to scene with you - it will NOT work. If I start suspecting that a desire to scene or be punished is the motivation behind such behavior, then the sub and I will sit down and talk.

I don't feel like they are in control. I sometimes feel like they are trying to take control, but since I don't tolerate the behavior, I don't feel like they are in control.

_____________________________

'cause when i look down /i just miss all the good stuff / when i look up / i just trip over things

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 22

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 7:34:50 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

One persons bratty is another persons playful. Haveing said that, I think most would agree that bratty, on a regular basis is unaccteptable. Whatever you think it is you know it when you see it, and so should the sub

Jeff

< Message edited by Jeffff -- 12/10/2007 7:39:28 PM >

(in reply to AquaticSub)

Post #: 23

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 7:50:56 PM

addisonclarkgirl

Posts: 346
Joined: 7/16/2006
Status: offline

i'm a bratty little girl sometimes on purpose. It's not to be mean or disrespectful, but as a way to be playful. my Daddy likes it when i stick my tongue out at him or when i'm a bit sassy. There's nothing wrong with it, if you and the person you're with accept it as part of the relationship and enjoy it. Besides, i do like the reaction i get when being a brat. If that's topping from the bottom, then i'm guilty.

_____________________________

I saw the angel in the marble and carved until I set her free...Michelangelo

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Princess_of_Naughty_Pics

(in reply to Jeffff)

Post #: 24

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 7:56:01 PM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

No, they're not, because manipulation doesn't work on me. I'll either ignore them, tell them to be an adult, stop being passive aggressive and simply ASK for what they want or tell them to leave (or leave myself). The quickest way to end a scene with me is it say something along the lines of, "Is that all you've got?" I don't go for that.

That all being said, there's a difference between a serious communication problem that leads to passive aggressive manipulation and teasing among two people who know each other well. One is tolerated because it's not how they are when it comes to serious matters, the other is not.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
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BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 25

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 8:17:26 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: takenbyjohnr07

about a sub/slave who acts bratty on purpose or who tries to get in trouble on purpose? Do You ever feel that they are in more control than You are when they do this?

There are dominants that love sams (smart assed masochists), although many don't too. The head of the local group here has a sam sub, and they have been together a long time... it is a compatibility isssue.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 26

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 9:44:31 PM

lovesthekink

Posts: 16
Joined: 12/6/2007
Status: offline

I don't feel any loss but it is a bid for control. I can see how that might be upsetting.

If this is new behavior in a long running relationship it may be symptomatic of the sub not getting something they need/want. Maybe as a switch this behavior doesn't bother me as my lines are blury anyway but you are still in control of how you react to it. If you don't handle it appropriately for the both of you then it will cause problems.

What is appropriate for you is entirely up to you.

Personally, I rather like bratty in character (as in when called for) but I would have to end a relationship with someone who was consistently and severely bratty.

~LTK

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 27

RE: what do You think - 12/10/2007 10:59:26 PM

daddysliloneds

Posts: 1351
Joined: 6/28/2006
Status: offline

i feel that they do what they do because others let them, and that it's a good possibility that something 'more' is making them act that way, not necessarily because they're trying to get punished or want to control the relationship.

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 28

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 4:21:24 AM

takenbyjohnr07

Posts: 787
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline

Everyone had such great answers. It's been a pleasure reading them. Thanks!

_____________________________

i am the sole property of Johnr. He is the love of my life and the greatest Owner and i will live to serve and, please him only every day of my life.

(in reply to daddysliloneds)

Post #: 29

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 5:44:55 AM

PlayfulGoddess

Posts: 66
Joined: 11/9/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

Some of us aren't bratty, we're playful, and we're not looking to cause trouble,
we just like to keep things interesting.

We also know when to cut the shit and assume the position.

chia* (the pet)

<adopts the chia pets of the world (cuz I like a challange?) LOL

(in reply to chiaThePet)

Post #: 30

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 5:57:08 AM

Owner4SexSlave

Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: takenbyjohnr07

about a sub/slave who acts bratty on purpose or who tries to get in trouble on purpose? Do You ever feel that they are in more control than You are when they do this?

No, because I see it for what it is! Actually, I enjoy this for the most part. However, if it's a seriously offense or she gets too carried away, time to pull out real punishment such a time-out, corner time and what not. I seperate play punishment from real punishment. If she is acting out and being bratty for play and attention, no big deal. Hope this makes sense. I even go so far to let them know, I'm onto them as well.

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 31

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 6:13:56 AM

SlavesSoul

Posts: 22
Joined: 8/20/2006
Status: offline

I have a friend who is a brat...maybe even the Queen of brats, she will tell you so with a huge grin on her face! However, she is also a slave.

    She enjoys bratting within scenes or situations where it is accepted and encouraged by her Mistress, or the Dominant /s present. Usually it's a role play...School girl, ect.

   But, it's only for that period of time and within certain guidelines for the scene. It does not carry over into her service or relationship. Her Mistress would not tolerate it at all, and she would never intentionally do, or not do, something to get noticed in a negative way. That would bring punishment...and not the play "you've been a bad girl kind".

    Being a brat, for her, is about knowing when it's the right time and space to do that, IF thats something your other is also into. It is never used (by her) to get attention, play or punishment. She is expected to communicate like an adult for any true need to play, that includes asking for brat time, when she needs to let that energy out.

For her it's just another type of play / scene....not a part of her D/s relationship style

K

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)

Post #: 32

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 6:25:50 AM

Owner4SexSlave

Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SlavesSoul

I have a friend who is a brat...maybe even the Queen of brats, she will tell you so with a huge grin on her face! However, she is also a slave.

She enjoys bratting within scenes or situations where it is accepted and encouraged by her Mistress, or the Dominant /s present. Usually it's a role play...School girl, ect.

But, it's only for that period of time and within certain guidelines for the scene. It does not carry over into her service or relationship. Her Mistress would not tolerate it at all, and she would never intentionally do, or not do, something to get noticed in a negative way. That would bring punishment...and not the play "you've been a bad girl kind".

Being a brat, for her, is about knowing when it's the right time and space to do that, IF thats something your other is also into. It is never used (by her) to get attention, play or punishment. She is expected to communicate like an adult for any true need to play, that includes asking for brat time, when she needs to let that energy out.

For her it's just another type of play / scene....not a part of her D/s relationship style

K

Thank you for posting this... I was about ready to go off on Masters wanting to own limp motionless mice or something...

(in reply to SlavesSoul)

Post #: 33

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 12:23:47 PM

NorthernGent

Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: takenbyjohnr07

Do You ever feel that they are in more control than You are when they do this?

'Absolutely not: whether conscious or not, it remains completely childish.

I'll tolerate it when first getting to know a woman, with the aim being to modify that behaviour; in fact, I find it mildly entertaining when a 30-40 years old woman is acting like a 6 years old: for the first few weeks, that is. If she's still acting the goat after a few weeks, I'll put her in the washing machine for a quick spin dry and hang her on the washing line to dry for a couple of hours: it should instill at least a modicum of adulthood.

When I decide I want a child in my life, I'll adopt one, or share one with an adult.

Edited to add: this is topical for me because I'm dating a woman who is a complete brat with all sorts of expectations, demands and manipulation tricks of the trade up her sleeve. As I say, 'quite entertaining for the time being, but she's yet to grasp that when she came 'round my home a couple of nights ago, the washing machine door was open for a very good reason. Time's a great healer, I suppose.

< Message edited by NorthernGent -- 12/11/2007 12:29:34 PM >

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 34

RE: what do You think - 12/11/2007 2:36:36 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

Some of us aren't bratty, we're playful, and we're not looking to cause trouble,
we just like to keep things interesting.

We also know when to cut the shit and assume the position.

chia* (the pet)

My dear chia, this is one of the reasons why I enjoy you so much.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to chiaThePet)

Post #: 35

RE: what do You think - 12/12/2007 3:33:48 AM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

That kind of behavior detracts from the honesty of BDSM. I like to whip, she likes to be whipped. We can do that without any bad girl role playing. She can be a sincere, respectful adult and still find herself being whipped in a careful way by me and taken to dinner later where we both exhibit adult polite manners....and laugh like hell together...heh.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 36

RE: what do You think - 12/12/2007 4:50:54 AM

adoracat

Posts: 1779
Joined: 2/16/2007
Status: offline

i dont like being a brat, it gets me negative attention....or worse yet NO attention.

now i DO on occasion do some very silly over-the-top things that could be interpreted as being bratty... announcing that i'm sneaking up on Daddy because i'm going to tickle him, then tiptoing over saying aloud "sneak, sneak, sneak!" cracks Daddy up every single time. sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do to get that out of your system and yet not really have bad behavior over it.

hmm...bad or unwanted? aye, there's the question....

kitten

(in reply to szobras)

Post #: 37

RE: what do You think - 12/12/2007 5:50:26 AM

Heartisan

Posts: 21
Joined: 10/21/2007
From: Denver, CO
Status: offline

quote:

I think that it is something I need to negotiate at the beginning of the relationship.
I LOVE subs with spunk, attitude, and sauciness. I have no problem with someone who occasionally talks back. And with a sub like that who understands that PUNISHMENT is bad (and I will attempt to make it something you will not EVER want to have me do to you again), I've no problem with giving a swat on the ass or twist of a nipple in return for a saucy comment.

Master and I both agree on this issue.. me as both sub and Dom. To me, brattyness is disrespectful. In the bdsm group I used to be in there was a group of girls that actually called themselves the brat pack even had shirts made. They were completely out of control and annoying and disrespectful. One had a Dom who I thought should have controlled her better, the rest thought they would impress a Dom by their behavior, last I knew they didn't. In any case, to me brat=bad. Sassy or Saucy is good as long as the sub knows the right place and time to do it where it doesn't make the Dom look bad.

As for punishment.. to me it should be a negative thing. Role playing in a scene is one thing, but if a sub really acts up to get attention, I choose a punishment to fit the crime and one that the sub will not like. Usually it entails being ignored, not being allowed to speak to me or touch me, etc. Personally though, if my disappointment in them isn't punishment enough, we need to rethink things.

_____________________________

Jewel
Bi, Poly, and Switch... I don't believe in limiting my options
"I'm a bitch, I'm a tease, I'm a goddess on my knees"... Meredith Brooks "The Bitch"

(in reply to Elorin)

Post #: 38

RE: what do You think - 12/12/2007 8:08:48 AM

szobras

Posts: 435
Joined: 9/18/2006
Status: offline

Hi Adoracat,
I simply adore some playfullness, though not intentional attempts to manipulate my actions on a serious note.
To me, there is a difference.

_____________________________

"Wisdom is what's left after we've run out of personal opinions."
~Cullen Hightower~

(in reply to adoracat)

Post #: 39

RE: what do You think - 12/12/2007 8:22:53 AM

chellekitty

Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

To me, brattyness is disrespectful. In the bdsm group I used to be in there was a group of girls that actually called themselves the brat pack even had shirts made. They were completely out of control and annoying and disrespectful. One had a Dom who I thought should have controlled her better, the rest thought they would impress a Dom by their behavior, last I knew they didn't. In any case, to me brat=bad

this is why i stopped calling myself a brat years ago...to me being a brat is what chia and adoracat were talking about...being playful and child-like...but the word brat has been taken to excuse annoying, disrespectful and completely out of control behavior...it is not about being childish, selfish, manipulative or any of those things that make me want to kick those people in the teeth and send them packing (and i don't even have to deal with them on a regular basis)...

for me bratting is about shooting my Dom with a water pistol when it is 95 degrees and we are outside doing yard work and he's overheated and for health reasons needs to cool down...it is doing whatever it takes to make him laugh when he is to serious and it is time to relax even if it makes me look rediculous and would be completely innapropriate in another setting....it's not about getting punished or even getting play punished...personally, i would freak out if i were play punished for bratting....i get pain for being a good girl, not being a bad girl...pain is good for me....

there is a time and a place for everything...knowing when and where to do it is the key, if that is what how your relationship works....if you're playful and child-like and your Dom doesn't like it under any circumstances, there might be a compatibility issue...

chelle

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to Heartisan)

Post #: 40

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