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Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:14:36 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		       I'll just put this here and save the Mods a little time...

    So there are a couple threads going about a "tragic" experience, at the moment, full of expressions of sympathy and support.  You have to read the various accounts to get the whole picture, and quite honestly, I don't think I'm getting on board with it.

    I raised a couple of points and was promptly accused of "misrepresenting" and being mean.  I'd write it off, but some of those hopping on the bandwagon are smart people.

    Is it more important to be nice than to apply a bit of thought?

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:18:10 AM   
domahpet


Posts: 1505
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Santa Rosa
Status: offline 		i agree, and its turned into a train wreck

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:20:08 AM   
Lashra


Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline 		For me logic always comes before nice. If someone is asking for advice then I warn them I am BLUNT and may tell you things you do not want to hear, do you still want my opinion?  That is in real life whereas here I assume since they are placing a forum message that yes they do want my opinion and so I give it to them. Now whether they think it is "nice" or not is up to the reader. I give what I believe it good advice they can take it or leave it.

~Lashra


_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”






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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:23:50 AM   
sappatoti


Posts: 14844
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: the edge of darkness...
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

...
Is it more important to be nice than to apply a bit of thought?


The answer, I would think, depends upon who the people are and what kind of relationship they are to you.

Personally speaking, if people I barely know are asking me for assistance, or my thoughts, or whatever the case may be, I'm more inclined to take one or two steps back and logically think it through first. Now, if the people are close friends or family members, people that I've already invested a lot of emotions and friendship in, my first response might be to offer whatever support is needed (aka, being nice). Either way, if there's enough time to think the situation through, logic eventually takes over and I may adjust my initial response accordingly.

I don't think there is a solid answer to the question you pose. It's going to be different for anyone who attempts to answer.

_____________________________

Never mind the man on the edge of the darkness... he means no harm...

"Community, Identity, Stability." ~ A Brave New World, Aldous Huxley, 1932

If you don't like my attitude, QUIT TALKING TO ME!

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:30:33 AM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline 		I think that it is an effect of too much of that Lifetime TV.  Personal responsibility is not something that a lot of people take seriously.  It is far easier to blame society, government, or someother faceless organization.  TANSTAAFL.  Asking "What did YOU do to cause/excerbait this situation," is frowned upon.  This does not mean that is the specific question that you asked, but in general. 

We are told over and over that we are not supposed to "blame the victim," but what that really refers to is rape and domestic violence cases where the victim was essentially put on trial instead of the perpetrator.  However, the mentality that when ever anything goes wrong, we cannot hold the person accountable for their part in it, has engulfed society. 

To point out otherwise will get the Nazi card played on you.  Or if it is dealing with blacks, it will be pointed out that 150 years ago some of their ancestors were slaves.  And so on and so forth. 

Just my two cents.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:37:12 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

For me logic always comes before nice. If someone is asking for advice then I warn them I am BLUNT and may tell you things you do not want to hear, do you still want my opinion? 



I dont really give advice anymore.

If the person explains the problem to me, what I have found often happens in the past is that they leave out vital information.  This vital information often leads me to come to the same conclusion which they came to, which has
not worked out for the person so well, so now they blame their failure to accomplish things on my advice.

I like your points, Lashra, although I use the word "direct" instead of "blunt."  Too many people have the idea of "blunt" as being mean-spirited, nasty, cruel, etc., when I seldom am any of those things. 

A stop sign is direct.  It says "stop" without any sort of emotional content.  One can do what the stop sign suggests and accept the consequences, or one can ignore what the stop sign suggests and accept the consequences.  But in neither case can one accuse the stop sign of being nasty.

Hope that helps,

Stopergy


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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 10:45:55 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		      Good morning, Sinergy.  If you are looking for it, I think I saw your checkbook over by what is left of the caboose.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 3:52:02 PM   
windchymes


Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline 		I believe in tough love.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:00:42 PM   
lauren0221


Posts: 681
Joined: 8/29/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

    
  Is it more important to be nice than to apply a bit of thought?


The question hits close to home for me. Sympathy has its time and place, but blind sympathy that assumes the "victim" was helpless to avoid the situation, and now deserves only congratulations for surviving it, I think misses the mark.

I have made some really dumb mistakes in my life. No one held a gun to my head and made me make them. The point for me is why did I allow these situations to happen, and how do I now work on myself to prevent it from happening again?  Help with doing that is real help for me. Treating me like a helpless victim of life, not so much.

< Message edited by lauren0221 -- 12/16/2007 4:01:18 PM >

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:04:32 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		IF you disagree with the "popular" opinion on here you will be hear: that you don't know
what you are talking about, you are wrong {they are right}, you are offbase, crazy, clueless,
damn you for being alive!

That is why when people that are total strangers attempt to criticize and analyze me online,
I rarely read more than one line of the dribble they are writing.
Why should I?  I have a few that attacked me lately on block, so I can't read anything they
write and they don't exist in my world.

I don't post on a lot of threads for that exact reason.
Welcome to the jungle, Rich!
grrrrrrrrrrrrr


< Message edited by MzMia -- 12/16/2007 4:06:26 PM >

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:11:50 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

      I'll just put this here and save the Mods a little time...

   So there are a couple threads going about a "tragic" experience, at the moment, full of expressions of sympathy and support.  You have to read the various accounts to get the whole picture, and quite honestly, I don't think I'm getting on board with it.

   I raised a couple of points and was promptly accused of "misrepresenting" and being mean.  I'd write it off, but some of those hopping on the bandwagon are smart people.

   Is it more important to be nice than to apply a bit of thought?


There are quite a few do-gooders that believe everyone should be nice.  There are also some here that think everyone should be nice to them and not vice versa.  I think I know what post you are referring to and I think it's tugging at people's heart strings because it's someone they are familiar with from the boards.  I'm not commenting on your specific posts in it, I don't recall what they are, but it seems there are alot of people here that are going off on all kinds of tangents in that thread which makes it confusing.

Of course there's no requirement to be nice, domly, submissive or even intelligent on a message board and people that get offended by every other post are just not worth addressing in my opinion.



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I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:12:45 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		        I like the jungle, MzMia, whether I'm a bull ellephant smashing through it, or just one of the monkeys, up in a tree, throwing poo.

      What suprised me was the number of people expressing support, who would ordinarily display a bit more sense.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to MzMia)
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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:13:06 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		I thought you raised some great points on that train.

I also think a person can apply logic and be direct while still being nice.

I think people can have so much emotion and compassion that they overlook logic.  I think that can happen to the best of us.  It has happened to me.  I think a person describing a personal emotional experience will tend to see it only through his/her own eyes, without seeing the big picture, and when the situation has freshly occurred, the person is not always ready to see his/her own part in creating the chain of events that were experienced.

I wouldn't necessarily call people stupid over this.  Short sighted, maybe.  It happens to the best of us.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:26:37 PM   
Kalista07


Posts: 4240
Joined: 7/1/2007
Status: offline 		i, as usual, am completly freaking clueless as to what post You are referring to dang it...heh.....
 
Anyway, here's my personal preference, i prefer people to be striaght up honest with me....i think (for me anyway) too many times people's messages get lost in the context of trying to not hurt someone else's feelings, trying to be politically correct, or pussy footing around (no pun intended)........i guess to me if i'm going to communicate like that i may as well just talk to my damn self..... i prefer people to be rigorously honest with me, i don't care if we package it as blunt, direct, or tea in china.....
 
Of course, i am obviously pretty self centered as i'm struggling not to mail any of You and ask if You are referring to me... heeh
Having said that however, i don't think that i'm a person who likes to, desires to, or wants to evade personal responsibility...i think i thrive on accountability....Please feel free to point out examples if You believe i'm wrong...
Kali

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~~Sweedish Proverb


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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:28:35 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

     I'll just put this here and save the Mods a little time...

  So there are a couple threads going about a "tragic" experience, at the moment, full of expressions of sympathy and support.  You have to read the various accounts to get the whole picture, and quite honestly, I don't think I'm getting on board with it.

  I raised a couple of points and was promptly accused of "misrepresenting" and being mean.  I'd write it off, but some of those hopping on the bandwagon are smart people.

  Is it more important to be nice than to apply a bit of thought?


I also want to ask you to explain, why you can't go along with what every one else says?
How dare you speak your mind?
You are supposed to go along with popular group think and other people's ideas of how you should act, live and conduct yourself online!
How dare you be different!

< Message edited by MzMia -- 12/16/2007 4:30:20 PM >

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 4:39:17 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

i, as usual, am completly freaking clueless as to what post You are referring to dang it...heh.....
 



        Easy way to solve that occasional puzzle, Kalista.  Find a knowledgable poster on the subject in the "users viewing this topic" line at the top of the page.  Click on their name, and you'll get a list of their recent posts.  The subject thread will normally be on that list.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to Kalista07)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 5:12:04 PM   
Kalista07


Posts: 4240
Joined: 7/1/2007
Status: offline 		That was just mean Rich.....
 
Seriously, You knew i couldn't see what the thread was and not read it??? i'm sitting here shaking my head.....i don't get it...i don't want to get it.....i don't need to get it.....
 
Having said all of that, it's currently taking everything i have not to respond to the idiotic and ignorant things posted on there about drugs....Such as, "crack cocaine is not psyhcologically addictive"...hUH??? Since when?? WTF!!!!
 
Don't get me started about how i feel about people evading personal responsibility for their choices and blaming it all on their home environment....
 
AGGGHHH!!!!!
 
Kali

_____________________________

“Love me when I least deserve it, because that's when I really need it.”
~~Sweedish Proverb


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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 5:40:02 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

       I like the jungle, MzMia, whether I'm a bull ellephant smashing through it, or just one of the monkeys, up in a tree, throwing poo.

     What suprised me was the number of people expressing support, who would ordinarily display a bit more sense.


To be honest with you Rich, I don't really agree with you on that post.
But that does not matter, because you are allowed to state your opinion {within limits I guess}.
 
I like you, you have never been mean or disrespected me.
We have a right to agree to disagree.
What gets me is when someone disagrees, and starts attacking the person that disagrees with them.
That is when things get interesting.
 
Again, we always have a right to agree to disagree.
But, I prefer when we can do it without becomming emotional and attacking the people
we don't agree with.
I like many people here that I don't always agree with, but that is just me. 

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 6:34:48 PM   
MadameMarque


Posts: 1128
Joined: 3/19/2005
Status: offline 		The "logic" you applied that makes you propose that nice and smart are mutually exclusive, eludes me.

Sometimes, people like to take an opportunity to vent their anger and frustration, to punish another or make them feel bad, and then call it tough love or 'just being honest.'

You can be honest, smart and insightful, and still be kind and have some care for someone's feelings, and some sympathy.  Honesty is a kindness.  Sympathetic, kind, and loving do not equal dishonest, foolish, or enabling of unhappy behaviour.

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RE: Being nice = Being stupid??? - 12/16/2007 6:50:20 PM   
chellekitty


Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline 		"Without logic, reason is useless.  With logic you can win arguments and alienate multitudes."

that being said...i also apply...

"Rigorus honesty, not rediculous honesty."


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One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

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