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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/23/2007 5:48:21 PM   
NotNutsReally


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quote:

I believe that many of us that go for advanced degrees do so to contribute to the larger knowledge base. Part of attaining any advanced degree requires a knowledge of the literature in your chosen field. Who has contributed what and how was this accomplished? Paradigm shifts take years to evolve and are necessarily fueled by the accumulated contributions of many. For example, many advances in medicine throughout history have been rooted in the work of scientists doing basic research, not the clinicians that administer them. Not only the social sciences, but msot research endeavors are funded by government or state agencies. Also, the results from experiments in the natural sciences also have implications for social policy. For example, for the last 7 years I have studied how drugs of abuse (morphine) effect the progression of AIDS in the brain. There are many things to be learned from this line of inquiry....long-term effects of morphine on a body that is altered by a disease state, how the brain deals with viral invasion, etc. The social policy imlications are "should we as a society provide AIDS treatment drugs, which cost many thousands of dollars per person annually, to addicts that do not receive treatment if we find that continued use of such drugs exascerbates the course of the disease, and increses the costs of treatment of these patients?" Of course that is a generalization, I just used it to put forth a point. Politics exists in the academic power structure, in the decisions made regarding grant funding, etc. They're unavoidable.



I think you are mistaken here. Firstly the paradigm shift material is rooted largely in Kuhn's Structure of Scientific Revolution. In that book he is dealing with the natural sciences (especially evolutionary biology if I remember right). Not to say that the same structures don't apply to the social sciences they do. However in the context of your PhoenixRed you clearly accept the positivist notion of science, that is to say a contently progressing and growing body of knowledge. Putting the philosophy of epistemology aside for a moment, then positivism works just fine because what Aristotle observed hasn't changed from what Newton observed which hasn't changed from what Einstein observed, which hasn't changed from what you are observing. Unfortunately the social science don't have that kind of stability, body of knowledge changes on both ends of the spectrum. Both the units of observation change (society) and the interpretations of the behavior of the unit of observation change depending on the cultural context of the observer. Therefor, since the social sciences suffer from change in both the observed and the observer I find it difficult to accept the positivist notion of a continually growing body of knowledge that leads us to a greater understanding of the social world.

As far as the state is concerned...
Of course the government funds all sorts of scientific endeavors. But there is something unnerving about the social science endeavor IF we accept positivism. The reason we want to increase our knowledge of the natural world is so that we can have greater control over our environment. The natural scientists achieve this by creating predictive theories. Theories are acceptable when they accurately predict the behavior of the subject under study, be them planets, plants or particles. If we apply the same logic to the social sciences this pursuit becomes rather unsettling. For real world consequences of state funded social science research look up the history of Modernization Theory.

P.S. you make some other good points but I thought this one was most stimulating.

(in reply to PhoenixRed)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 1:55:10 AM   
Lordandmaster


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You know what I've kinda noticed?  All the women in this thread are dommes.  That's interesting.  How many academic women are submissive?  Straw poll?

(in reply to NotNutsReally)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 4:40:58 AM   
Dolce


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I would be one of those submissive academic women. 

_____________________________

The presence of a noble nature...changes the lights for us: we begin to see things again in their larger, quieter masses, and to believe that we too can be seen and judged in the wholeness of our character. ~George Eliot

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 5:02:12 AM   
SirW2004


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All,


Love this discussion thread. I earned my Doctorate almost 20 years now. Funny I never thought of it as a comparison to BDSM or D/s. Though I would not have mind my major professor as a Domme (still a hottie after all these years).
But BDSM and D/s is always more relaxing to me than work....also, it is more who I am. My Doctorate and subsequent professorship is my vocation, and while it is important and I really love it....if I stopped tomorrow and needed to go to something else,  I could adjust,  eventually.
D/s is my life.

Just my thoughts.


Sir W

(in reply to Dolce)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 5:07:18 AM   
laurell3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

You know what I've kinda noticed?  All the women in this thread are dommes.  That's interesting.  How many academic women are submissive?  Straw poll?


I actually see quite a few sub/slave/switch (and dirty girl) types that posted LaM.

< Message edited by laurell3 -- 12/24/2007 5:14:12 AM >


_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 7:02:57 AM   
NotNutsReally


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Joined: 10/6/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

You know what I've kinda noticed? All the women in this thread are dommes. That's interesting. How many academic women are submissive? Straw poll?

quote:

You know what I've kinda noticed? All the women in this thread are dommes. That's interesting. How many academic women are submissive?


I suspect that all grad. students, and academics are in fact kink heads of one strip or another. We are such a quirky bunch in public I can't imagine we are any less unique in private.

Look at that, I succeeded in marking a post of under 2000 characters!!! Maybe it needs some footnotes.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 7:12:02 AM   
Lordandmaster


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Yay!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dolce

I would be one of those submissive academic women. 

(in reply to Dolce)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 7:24:05 AM   
dawntreader


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

You know what I've kinda noticed?  All the women in this thread are dommes.  That's interesting.  How many academic women are submissive?  Straw poll?


Its ok if you overlooked the submissives that posted - we were probably on our knees at the time you breezed thru!

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 11:58:30 AM   
subsurfergirl


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Newbie sub here confessing I'm one of those academic subs too.  I've thought about this quite a bit - why I'm so drawn toward sub experiences when I'm so well educated, with feminist leanings, and otherwise in control of family, work and other worlds.  I talk a lot and make a lot of the decisions.  I'm sure there are many many analyses of why this dynamic occurs, but even as a newbie here I can surmise that my desire for a power exchange is pretty basic - a release of that pressure, expectatio to be in control and take responsibility.  I'm not experienced RT, and perhaps I'd feel different if I ever had true sub experiences, but I can say unequivocally that the idea of being gagged, bound and taking orders from someone else is attractive (note: understatement).

surfchick

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

You know what I've kinda noticed?  All the women in this thread are dommes.  That's interesting.  How many academic women are submissive?  Straw poll?

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 1:01:31 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Well, I don't think submission is at all incompatible with feminism--there have been a few threads about that--so I didn't mean to imply that academic women might have hangups about submitting just because they tend to be left-leaning and highly gender-conscious.  But what I WAS thinking is that maybe an academic career attracts a certain cross-section of women who are less likely to be submissive.

Glad to see I was probably wrong about that, though.

(in reply to subsurfergirl)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 4:08:59 PM   
TheInstrument


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Joined: 9/8/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

*chuckle*

I'm with ya, brother. In fact, I'm in two graduate programs, one conventional for Mech Eng., the other non-conventional for Metaphysics. Funny, but I KNOW my thesis for Metaphysics will be read!

Master Fire



Um...mechanical engineering and metaphysics? ::::swwwwooooonnnnnnssss::::

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/24/2007 11:39:06 PM   
MaamJay


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Well this has been an interesting thread LOL! I've long been involved in higher education and research as tutor, then lecturer, then research assistant and finally a research associate. A few years ago I had a brief fling in which I got as far as Master's prelim in Human Biology (I was going to study the biosocial and evolutionary perspectives of the choice to be childless) but then I landed the job of My dreams (as I thought, I ended up calling the place the hell-hole!) and pulled out. That job was in Curriculum which was undergoing statewide change and it was a massive undertaking. Once I returned to academia, I moved more into the educational arena, and never felt the "pull" to go for a higher degree despite the intense encouragement of My associates. I agreed that it seemed slightly ridiculous that I was helping to edit other people's theses (especially those of non-English-speaking students), critiquing papers for eminent journals (why can't Professors do a decent reference list LOL!) and editing textbooks when I hold nothing higher than a BSc and a Graduate Certificate in Tertiary Teaching! But I was adamant that I didn't need or want that "little piece of paper" and that I doubted that on My deathbed I would be saying "Damn! I wish I'd done that PhD!"

Well all that changed a couple of weeks ago! I'm still slightly in shock Myself LOL ... but suddenly I woke up thinking "I want to do it". As it happened, I was about to take a trip back to My home state and catch up with all those wonderful colleagues, and at lunch with the one I most love to work with (she has got to be Professor of Education largely based on the work we did together), I shook her completely by mentioning this sudden urge to do a PhD! Open arms was an understatement, it's full steam ahead I think! Some of the work we did would provide great groundwork for My studies ... as that work was done in a metro area and I now live in a rural area on the opposite side of the country, there would be much value in replicating and then extending the work to be more able to draw comparisons and perhaps generalise the results. I'm left musing, why the change in My mindset? I suspect it's removal of stress ... I was living in a very stressful home environment before, now, with Master and myself, all is much more peaceful. And if I can be as fortunate as Tammyjo (Big congrats by the way!) and find a wonderful sub/slave to pick up some of the load ... I will be laughing!! Now, after reading this thread, I hope I don't live to regret it LOL! However, at My age, I'm not doing it to snag a high-powered academic job at the end ... I'm doing it for Me. I'll be quite happy to potter along with part-time consultancy work that leaves Me time for My scrapbooking business, Avon round and My new career with Master in Our rock band!

Isn't it heartening though to see there are a number of academics in this community? I really appreciate the intellectual stimulation.

Maam Jay aka violet[A]

_____________________________

Life is a song ... and I love singing it! (By me!)

(in reply to TheInstrument)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/25/2007 7:17:55 AM   
Dolce


Posts: 34
Joined: 10/17/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Well, I don't think submission is at all incompatible with feminism--there have been a few threads about that--so I didn't mean to imply that academic women might have hangups about submitting just because they tend to be left-leaning and highly gender-conscious.  But what I WAS thinking is that maybe an academic career attracts a certain cross-section of women who are less likely to be submissive.

Glad to see I was probably wrong about that, though.


To be honest, if you met me in the vanilla world, you would assume I was really a domme. ;-) I can be a very take-charge leader, but a big part of that is my job (which I wouldn't give up for anything in the world! I have found my calling!!)...granted, that probably has to do with the fact that both of my parents work as corporate consultants, so I've been Type-A brainwashed since birth!

I am ever the student of academia...and will probably still be in classes when I'm old and grey. I am most definately one of those "perpetual learners", and take every opportunity to sit in and observe somebody who knows a lot more than I do.

So, don't let our vanilla lives fool you ;-) After many years of jokes about me and black leather with a bull-whip (one artist friend even went so far as to make a cartoon of me as a dominatrix, and several colleagues still make the joking whip-crack sound effect when I put my foot down), most of my open-minded friends were shocked and amused to find out that, really, I'm a submissive.

~Dolce


_____________________________

The presence of a noble nature...changes the lights for us: we begin to see things again in their larger, quieter masses, and to believe that we too can be seen and judged in the wholeness of our character. ~George Eliot

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/25/2007 8:31:51 AM   
Griswold


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Joined: 2/12/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NotNutsReally

After 3 years of classes,
2 weeks of grueling comprehensive exams,
3 hours of intense oral defense,
2 years of field work,
I've read a mountain of books that no one cares about,
Caused certain damage to my liver from alcohol,
Caused double that damage to my kidney's from coffee,
I'm unable to talk in social situations without bringing up Foucault or Marx or discourse analysis,
Now I have to write the damn dissertation which no one will read, and will lead me to a killer 40k/year.

So I ask, what's the point in BDSM? It can't possibly match the pain, humiliation and discipline that graduate school provides.
AHHHHHHHH I'm going to write.



(Crown Royal can fix that).

(in reply to NotNutsReally)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 12/26/2007 10:48:17 PM   
roland23


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Great thread! A few hours after my dissertation defense I dined with my sub and afterwards had a truly magical evening. I would like to meet sub female PhDs, if there are any out there!  

(in reply to Griswold)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 1/12/2008 3:46:57 PM   
PhoenixRed


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*fast reply*
OK, all of you fellow geeks, nerds and academics, I'd like to ask this......what do you do, years later with all the papers, books, data binders, etc. that you've benn accumulating over the years?  I just moved and I have BOXES and BOXES of journal articles, textbooks (that can't be sold back because they're out of date), binders upon binders of data from grad school, notes from classes I taught......what to do with all of this stuff?  I finally got rid of all the various versions of my thesis - I defended, it's bound, it's over, don't need them.  Getting rid of a lot of old articles, since I can probably download them if I ever needed them.  Got rid of abstract books from conferences.  Still have loads of books and data though, that I'll probably never use again (I don't know why but it seems somewhat sacreligious to trash them!).  So, what to do?  I'm curious as to what all of you have done......thanks!

_____________________________

Everyone deserves a break from the person everyone else expects them to be.
In the great experiment known as evolution, evidently there are some people who's ancestors were in the control group.

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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 1/12/2008 3:50:01 PM   
fluffyswitch


Posts: 1108
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From: Buffalo
Status: offline
lol. right there with you. my methodology course this semester is gonna be more dominant and sadistic than my dom would ever be able to dream up on his worst day, and i haven't even hit my PhD yet lol.

(in reply to OrrisKitten)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 1/12/2008 3:52:13 PM   
fluffyswitch


Posts: 1108
Joined: 9/29/2007
From: Buffalo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Well, I don't think submission is at all incompatible with feminism--there have been a few threads about that--so I didn't mean to imply that academic women might have hangups about submitting just because they tend to be left-leaning and highly gender-conscious.  But what I WAS thinking is that maybe an academic career attracts a certain cross-section of women who are less likely to be submissive.

Glad to see I was probably wrong about that, though.

completely ancedotal but i've noticed that it's teh other way around. i know more feminist, submissive women in academics/higher education than dominant women. and honestly if it wasn't for the fact that my women's center as an undergrad was populated by kinks i don't think i would have gotten into BDSM.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 1/12/2008 4:43:25 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PhoenixRed

*fast reply*
OK, all of you fellow geeks, nerds and academics, I'd like to ask this......what do you do, years later with all the papers, books, data binders, etc. that you've benn accumulating over the years? I just moved and I have BOXES and BOXES of journal articles, textbooks (that can't be sold back because they're out of date), binders upon binders of data from grad school, notes from classes I taught......what to do with all of this stuff? I finally got rid of all the various versions of my thesis - I defended, it's bound, it's over, don't need them. Getting rid of a lot of old articles, since I can probably download them if I ever needed them. Got rid of abstract books from conferences. Still have loads of books and data though, that I'll probably never use again (I don't know why but it seems somewhat sacreligious to trash them!). So, what to do? I'm curious as to what all of you have done......thanks!


I rarely get rid of anything.

There's a conference next year (2009) in Stockholm on a topic that I wrote a paper about years ago. I can get that paper out, do some update reading to see if anything new has appeared and then submit for the conference.

What I've noticed in history at least is much of what you continue to research is based on earlier stuff you did and kept around. Sure new things might also interest you but you have a lot to build from.

So if you plan to stay in academia, I'd organize it and keep it. I would not trust digital copies alone because having only one copy of anything is a good way to not have any copy in the future. Multiple media and means is usually a safer way to keep things you want.

Organizing all my stuff will be one of the new jobs for the next slave trainee I get in the future. A good test of how useful he/she can be.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to PhoenixRed)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: BDSM & the Ph.D. AHHHHHHHHH - 1/12/2008 5:58:44 PM   
Uniform


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of course it depends on the field you are in. but normally I would suggest: keep as much as you can. I keep most of it ever since I landed one of my first jobs based on a paper I could write within a couple of days based on material which I previously thought I would never need again. Through all of my career it has been helpful to have a backlog of things which might help to move into a new issue or to continue previous lines of work.

U

(in reply to PhoenixRed)
Profile   Post #: 80
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