RE: permanent damage

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: permanent damage

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: permanent damage

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3]

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 2:59:27 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

Hello Eric

I think the 'flaming' as you call it you have received is pretty mild. Well, not really flaming, just letting you know you could be wrong in your assumptions

You've been sweet enough to own up to the statement that you are inexperienced, which is cool and a hard thing to do so kudos for that. But it's really important to remember that every single activity carries risks and not one activity has more or less than another - even if you are practised in said arena. You could easily die from sufforcation during bondage as you could from breathe play. The moment you lapse into a false sense of 'security' over any activity is the moment you let down the person you are playing with. That is why there seems to be such a 'ruckus' over what you said. A knife is a tool - so is piece of rope - so is a flogger, a paddle, a pair of handcuffs. They are all have equally dangerous results the minute you forget they can.

I'd usually sign out with 'Be safe' - but on this matter I will sign out - Be aware.
the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to TheScrivener)

Post #: 41

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 3:00:12 PM

Prinsexx

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OldBastardly1

We all see the posts about how we fear the inexperienced will cause permanent or crippling damage to another. While I am sure that it happens, it made me wonder just what the frequency of such happenings is? Is it 1 in 100? 1 in 1,000,000? And yes, I know...even 1 is too much, so try to hold back those type of responses.

I am sure the statistic & accuracy police will have the answers, probably even have links to prove the data.

It's not the dage for which there is evidence that worries me so much as the emotional damage. The scars that none of us can see, the scars that no-one can photograph and which is threfore inadmissable evidence. The scars that take place outside of consensuality. The scars that got accrued wen someone intepreted stop as go. The memories of damage that takes years to recall because of date drug after effects.

< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 12/27/2007 3:01:24 PM >

(in reply to OldBastardly1)

Post #: 42

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 3:04:31 PM

stripmymanhood

Posts: 124
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

i am one who's kink includes the possibility of permanent damage...just take a look at my name and figure out what i mean...but that said...one has to be willing to deal with the aftermath of what they allow done to them...for me...i'd have to have a real level of trust with one who wishes it...and feel that it was going to be part of a long term relationship...otherwise, it's only damage for damage's sake...and what's the point in that?

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 43

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 3:20:10 PM

TheScrivener

Posts: 91
Joined: 8/11/2007
Status: offline

[Quote] original: Darcyandthedark

The moment you lapse into a false sense of 'security' over any activity is the moment you let down the person you are playing with. That is why there seems to be such a 'ruckus' over what you said

[/quote]

dark,

Thank you for your reply, along with everyone else. I don't know why it took so long, but the message clicked reading this, and I appreciate it greatly. Up until now, I had regretted making the first post in this thread, but seeing what's come out of it, I'm quite happy about my initial "oops" (Although I probably could have done with out some of the subsequent "oopses" to follow).

Oh, and the replies really weren't all that flamish, in retrospect. Although, I seem to have misplaced my eyebrows...

Eric

_____________________________

"We are the facilitators of our own creative evolution."

- Bill Hicks

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 44

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 3:23:48 PM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

Eric,

You clearly want to learn and have an open mind to what others say. We all get corrected or using the wrong words here at times. Hang in there.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to TheScrivener)

Post #: 45

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 4:49:45 PM

chellekitty

Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Eric,

You clearly want to learn and have an open mind to what others say. We all get corrected or using the wrong words here at times. Hang in there.

except when i get corrected, its because nooooo body understands me.... *sob sob*....

i suppose that's why i seek to understand, rather than to be understand these days....works out much easier that way...on these boards, i only have control over myself, and i can't do a damned thing about making anyone else understand me, so i try to understand them...

chelle

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 46

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 5:06:01 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

quote:

A submissive with interests in breath play, suspension, and blood play would be more likely to suffer permanent injury than a submissive who was generally interested in bondage and playing dress-up.

Really now?

And on what do you base your knowledge here?

Actually, I agree with Irish on this I'm not sure this is true as I have found in general that people that want to engage in rather intense play can be much more selective about whom they do it with. I love being caned personally and I enjoy breath play to an extent, but I have engaged in it much less than I would like as if someone doesn't have the desire to actually learn these things well before doing them, it's not something I will do. I am not a crash test dummy.

I agree too. I had mild swelling from being suspended up on my tiptoes in shackles with cling wrap tightly wrapped aroundmy wrists. the cling wrap further exaccerbated as it squeezed tightly on my Carpel Tunnel. The "Dominant" adjusted them when I complained and when I complained a second time stopped the scene and pouted and sulked. I got mad at his lack of aftercare and raged. He acused me of lieing and not being able to "take a litle pain". This from someone who told me I had the makings of a pain slut previously. I wont go into the ugly other parts, but I never saw him again. I suffered mild swelling. I have a predisposition as I have dainty and weak wrists with overuse syndrome from years of being a massage therapist. As a massage Therapy Instructor I know the difference between different pain. . Burning is nerve pain. Throbbing is vascular. Stinging pain delivered is fine, burning, searing, pins and needles is signs of nerve pain and possible damage. Stabbing is acute. Aching is chronic. In Bondage you must watch for signs of cutting off circulation too long and nerve issues must be managed and managed well by a Dom who is sane and not bipolar. Lesson learned. I still love bondage. I have even deeply delved into Shibari, but I pick loving Dominants who are truly more concerned for me and put thier ego away.

< Message edited by lusciouslips19 -- 12/27/2007 5:22:10 PM >

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 47

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 5:34:35 PM

LadyHugs

Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Dear lusciouslips19, Ladies and Gentlemen;

I am pleased to have read your last post [Reference #47]

It is often difficult to explain to Tops/Dominants/Masters/Mistress that there are many different types of pain--some that will be temporary but, others that are sincere warning signs and must be addressed immediately. Identifying the different types of pain as you have is a lesson all Dominants should be taught before inflicting pain and or discomfort on another; as well as to address blood/vascular, muscular and or breathing restrictions/constrictions. It wouldn't hurt for submissives/slaves/bottoms to know this as well.

This post supports the real need to learn anatomy beyond the skin's surface. It also supports the need for submissives/slaves/bottoms/servants to be honest with medical conditions that may be amplified by poor body/pain management. When one person isn't having fun and or a good time--it is time to quit.

I do hope that you would/will have an opportunity to give a presentation on this area...as few can identify the types/classifications of pain as to be accomidating to the partner and your professional expertise` and from a submissive/slave/bottom perspective is invaluable. (In my opinion).

Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 48

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 5:43:29 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHugs

Dear lusciouslips19, Ladies and Gentlemen;

I am pleased to have read your last post [Reference #47]

It is often difficult to explain to Tops/Dominants/Masters/Mistress that there are many different types of pain--some that will be temporary but, others that are sincere warning signs and must be addressed immediately. Identifying the different types of pain as you have is a lesson all Dominants should be taught before inflicting pain and or discomfort on another; as well as to address blood/vascular, muscular and or breathing restrictions/constrictions. It wouldn't hurt for submissives/slaves/bottoms to know this as well.

This post supports the real need to learn anatomy beyond the skin's surface. It also supports the need for submissives/slaves/bottoms/servants to be honest with medical conditions that may be amplified by poor body/pain management. When one person isn't having fun and or a good time--it is time to quit.

I do hope that you would/will have an opportunity to give a presentation on this area...as few can identify the types/classifications of pain as to be accomidating to the partner and your professional expertise` and from a submissive/slave/bottom perspective is invaluable. (In my opinion).

Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

Thank you. I am also going to search in my cirriculum for a more detailed list.

(in reply to LadyHugs)

Post #: 49

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 6:02:20 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline

Here is the longer lesson and more accurate in regards to aching then memory alone provided.

I. PAIN CLASSIFICATION

A. Acute
1. Either a symptom of a disease condition or a temporary aspect of medical treatment.
2. It acts as a warning signal
3. It is usually temporary, of sudden onset, and easily localized
4. Usually subsides with or without treatment

B. Chronic
1. Affects 25% of the population
2. Persist or recurs for indefinite periods, usually longer than 6 months
3. Has an obscure onset and the character and quality of pain changes over time
4. Usually is diffused, poorly localized and often requires the efforts to multidisciplinary health care team

C. Intractable
1. Chronic
2. It exist without demonstrable disease

D. Phantom
1. Frequently experience with amputation

E. Referred Pain
1. Pain is felt in a surface far from the stimulated organ
2. May result from stimulation of receptors in the viscera (internal organs)

F. Somatic Pain
1. arises from stimulation of receptors in skin (superficial) or from receptors in skeletal muscles, joints, tendons, and fascia (deep)

Listed below are the different types of pain location to be considered:

A. Location

1. Localized pain (confined to the site of origin).

2. Projected pain (a result of proximal nerve compression).

3. Radiating pain (diffuse pain, which is not well localized).

4. Referred pain (felt in an area distant from the site of the stimulus).
III. TYPES OF PAIN

A. Prickling Pain: Localized pain when skin is cut or jabbed.

B. Burning: A warm “burning” sensation on skin. Less localization – slower to develop.

C. Aching: When visceral organs are stimulated. It is constant, not localized and it is often referred to areas of the body far from where the damage has occurred.

D. Deep: Not usually localized, nauseating, and frequently associated with sweating and changes in blood pressure.

E. Muscle Pain: When blood supply to a muscle is occluded.

IV. TRIGGER POINTS( these are refered to as knots or pressure points by lay people)

A. An area that is aggravated by stress

B. Small areas of hyperirritability within muscles

C. Often located in a tight bond of muscle fibers

D. Can cause referred pain

VI. DERMATOME

A. An area of the skin that a sensory nerve root services.

B. Cutaneous (skin) distribution of spinal nerve sensation

VII. MOTOR POINT

A. The point where motor nerve enters the muscle it innervates and causes a muscle to twitch if stimulated.

< Message edited by lusciouslips19 -- 12/27/2007 6:04:39 PM >

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 50

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 7:00:33 PM

xxmasopetra

Posts: 1
Joined: 12/27/2007
Status: offline

thats correct.....
and if you are really maso you dont care .. at least up to a special level....

(in reply to masterrich175)

Post #: 51

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 7:05:13 PM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

The above is why using positions that stretch out are poor choices-espescially if the bottom will struggle and strain joints and tendons even more. Weight should never be placed entirely around bonds circling wrists and ankles-it's an extremely stupid thing to do. Better to also include some pelvic and torso support. Almost anything that places pressure on or around a neck is going to be dangerous.

And if a Top is not prepared to stop a scene at any moment for the safety of a bottom, best not to even begin.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 52

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 7:11:22 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: xxmasopetra

thats correct.....
and if you are really maso you dont care .. at least up to a special level....

To the pain. But not to the damage.

(in reply to xxmasopetra)

Post #: 53

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 7:13:24 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

It is so important to be with someone who LISTENS to the sub. I had a torn rotator cuff from being in bondage that someone pulled me too hard and he did not listen (he did not want to interrupt the scene), I had a screaming fit from nerve compression from steel cuffs that were too tight, etc.

Like everyone else said, you need to responsive to the sub when they are clearly informing you something is going wrong with the scene; it has nothing to do with not liking pain per se, but a legitimate problem.

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 54

RE: permanent damage - 12/27/2007 7:18:20 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

The above is why using positions that stretch out are poor choices-espescially if the bottom will struggle and strain joints and tendons even more. Weight should never be placed entirely around bonds circling wrists and ankles-it's an extremely stupid thing to do. Better to also include some pelvic and torso support. Almost anything that places pressure on or around a neck is going to be dangerous.

And if a Top is not prepared to stop a scene at any moment for the safety of a bottom, best not to even begin.

I was recently cuffed to a chin up bar but not suspended. My Dom made sure that I was planted firmly on my feet. But he quickly took me down. he was worried because i tend to get weakneed in my submission and hang from my wrists. So most of the bondage has been Shibari in contraction vs extension poses. Extension and strtch is my favorite. that is why he ordered and is waiting the arrival of hemp and plans at suspending me by creating a harness around pelvis and torso.

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 55

RE: permanent damage - 12/28/2007 6:45:41 AM

sirguym

Posts: 318
Joined: 8/10/2007
Status: offline

I guess that over the years I have met more male, female and transgendered submissives, probably several thousand, than most.

I do not recall any of them telling me of anything more than the odd scar from misapplied corporal punishment or mishap; or as one reported above the scars from cheap handcuffs, over-enthusiastically applied.

I have only seen one instance - when a pony tripped and landed nose-first in a sulky, with his driver's weight on him. He broke his nose and it won't ever be quite the shape it once was, but otherwise he was OK.

After that I now try to stress safety issues much more when doing workshops; but in general I would think that BDSM is one of the safest sports around. Certainly safer than American football, soccer, climbing, skiing, hang-gliding or even roller-skating, and possibly even ball-room dancing....

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 56

RE: permanent damage - 12/28/2007 9:56:41 AM

LadyHugs

Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Dear lusciouslips19,

Thank you dear lady for posting the detailed pain and association list. It should help everybody understand the body's warning systems that often get ignored and not separated from 'discomfort' and or 'pain' during S&M and or Bondage.

Hope people read this --

Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 57

RE: permanent damage - 1/20/2008 12:05:25 PM

Esinem

Posts: 156
Joined: 5/9/2006
Status: offline

I had a friend who is sadly no longer with us because he did a breath play session with his partner that went badly wrong. So, yes, it does happen.

As far as bondage is concerned, I would guess that relatively few people are fully aware of the risks, especially where suspension is concerned. I know I was one of them once. I screwed up through ignorance but fortunately the resulting nerve damage was temporary but it scared the s**t out both of us. Consequently, I made it my business to find out as much as possible about the risks and how to minimise them. I tried to get an incident reporting database running on AdultRopeArt so others could learn from such experiences but nobody added anything to it or discussed the subject with anything like the enthusiasm devoted to subjects like what rope to use or what constitutes shibari (or more accurately, kinbaku). Based on this experience, I think it would be impossible to get an accurate answer on permanent damage caused.

(in reply to LadyHugs)

Post #: 58

RE: permanent damage - 2/3/2008 9:07:30 AM

Arceye

Posts: 18
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline

Risk assessment is important in any activity: if I had not one time checked my motorbike I wouldn't have noticed that the swing arm was about to unscrew.
Didn't stop me riding bikes tho'.
Not only should you check that your subbie is OK, ask a new subbie about any problems- I admit that one occasion I neglected to do this and the sub said 'don't use steel manacles I have a long term injury to my right wrist'.

(in reply to Esinem)

Post #: 59

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3]

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: permanent damage

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3]

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.094